Rewatching "Emissary"...

Discussion in 'Deep Space Nine' started by Lance, Jul 19, 2013.

  1. Maj. Kira Nerys

    Maj. Kira Nerys Ensign Red Shirt

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    I felt bad for Picard at the beginning, too, and it made me even dislike Sisko for a short time, but after some episodes I decided that I like him after all.

    And Sisko's reaction was understandable, but so was Picard's, who can't be blamed for being assimilated.
     
  2. R. Star

    R. Star Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    The whole scene struck me as very human. The incident caused both of them some deep running scars after all.
     
  3. JarodRussell

    JarodRussell Vice Admiral Admiral

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    That's what I missed, an apology by Sisko for blaming Picard for something he couldn't do anything about. One of the reasons why I think Sisko should have been aboard the Defiant in First Contact.
     
  4. R. Star

    R. Star Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    To me, that last scene between the two where Picard cut him off, I think Sisko was going to apologize. Call it seeing what I wanted to see, but I think both of them came to an understanding without saying a word.
     
  5. Anwar

    Anwar Vice Admiral Admiral

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    There didn't need to be a scene where he apologizes, because I'm sure Picard probably figured that Sisko can't help but feel hurt.

    What might have been nice would be a scene where Sisko just realizes that Picard wasn't to blame and there's no point holding onto that anger now that he's accepted Jennifer's gone.

    In fact, the novelization of "Emissary" had Sisko realize what a jerk he'd been to Picard and he felt like a real ass over it. He realized that Picard was just another victim of the Borg and he's suffered enough, and it should be something they could relate over if anything.
     
  6. Trek Survivor

    Trek Survivor Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    Definitely the best Trek pilot. Can't agree with the person above who said it sets things up perfectly for the mess the writers later made of the Sisko/Prophet relationship, but on its own, "Emissary" is the best Trek pilot, and one of the best DS9 episodes.

    I think the handshake between Sisko and Picard says everything that needs to be said at the end. Sisko didn't need to spell it out. We men don't need these things called "words" sometimes...
     
  7. Keith1701

    Keith1701 Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Yes, it was and is still a great episode.
     
  8. Mysterion

    Mysterion Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    If anything, that scene made Sisko's stock with me jump considerably.

    Maybe Picard isn't at fault for what happened at Wolf 359. But, Picard still acts like a dismissive, elitist asshole in the way he deals with Sisko, lecturing him about how Starfleet officers have to accept a certain amount of sacrifice while he sits in his posh lounge playing with his tea set. If anything, Sisko acts with what must be considerable restraint on his part.
     
  9. JarodRussell

    JarodRussell Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Picard earned that posh lounge and tea set with a lot of sweat and blood.
     
  10. dub

    dub Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    Location? What is this?
    Jennifer's blood, from Sisko's POV.

    It's a POV not based on the reality of Picard's lack of control over his person, but a very deep, skewed, emotionally damaged POV focused on the loss of his wife which had obviously consumed him ever since.
     
  11. R. Star

    R. Star Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Well Sisko's anger towards Picard is very understandable. Picard's face was the one on the viewscreen the day he and Jake lost everything. That face was mercilessly telling them it was all futile and any concept of sacrifice was meaningless. And he pretty much was right, that fleet at Wolf 359 didn't accomplish a thing other than slowing the Cube down long enough for the Enterprise to save the day.

    Years later that same face is ordering him, a single dad, to take his son to be rasied in a Cardassian shithole in the ass end of space, living with a bunch of religious yokel natives. When he presumes to point this fact out, that same face that took away his wife then presumed to lecture him about duty, when he had already given his dearest blood for it at Wolf 359.

    It's not fair at all, but it's very human. That's really what Emissary was about. Sisko moving on from that day. Even the Prophets saw that from the beginning.
     
  12. Anwar

    Anwar Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Exactly, it's about a guy who basically fell and then learned (with some assistance) to pick himself up again. It's a very Trek story, IMO.
     
  13. JarodRussell

    JarodRussell Vice Admiral Admiral

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    That "Why do you exist here?" scene was pretty moving.
     
  14. BillJ

    BillJ Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    As a die-hard TOS fan, I believe those scenes are some of the best in all of Star Trek. :techman:
     
  15. picsiskvinechef

    picsiskvinechef Lieutenant

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    Wolf 359 was Starlfleet's fault anyhow. they let one Federation ship face a near invincible Borg cube lol... Picard's capture was thus inevitable, since he could only do a certain amount to prevent capture. And the Borg evidently had that plan all along (that Borg Queen is very cunning lol..) so Starfleet played right into it. Somebody told me once that Picard could have had more officers on the bridge to prevent capture. lol.. I don't get how that would have helped. Yes, more Borg would have been killed, but then they'll send more drones, these drones will adapt to the phasers, and physically overpower all officers present. Only Data would not be overpowered, for obvious reasons. Even placing a forcefield around Deck 1 is no use against the Borg. Against the Romulans or the Dominion, maybe, but the Borg is a higher level all round lol..

    So I don't believe Sisko's treatment of Picard was fair, but I agree it was understandable.
     
  16. picsiskvinechef

    picsiskvinechef Lieutenant

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    Picard outranked Sisko, didn't he? And didn't Picard face "duty" when being ordered to track a fake Cardassian metagenic weapon? Or "duty" when being ordered to engage the Borg Cube in the first place?

    lol.. I like how you believe your judgment/opinion is so binding here. You only one man, not a God :lol:
     
  17. picsiskvinechef

    picsiskvinechef Lieutenant

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    Yes, and Picard assumed command of the Enterprise after Wolf 359.

    Erm.. you realise Picard is older and had outranked Sisko long before Sisko himself became a Captain? his "posh lounge" came from hard work. As in, well you know, years as CO of the Stargazer, in which Sisko was a teenager in Joe's kitchen or was at the Academy.

    Do you actually have a point, or do actually watch the episodes?
     
  18. picsiskvinechef

    picsiskvinechef Lieutenant

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    So when Picard orders Riker, is he being dismissive? Do you realise that both Sisko and Riker were of the same rank at the time?

    Don't let reality bite you on the arse. Superior officers in the armed forces treat juniors as they please. Just like how Admiral Nechayev beats down Picard whenever she met him. It simply is as is.
     
  19. Praetor

    Praetor Vice Admiral Admiral

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    The fine line between continuity and fanwank.
    Agreed.
     
  20. R. Star

    R. Star Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    I like how you apparently missed the whole point of the post being what Sisko would likely be thinking of the situation and then just pull some random insults out of your ass at my expense that have nothing to do with reality. You are a true gentleman and scholar, sir. Got any more pearls of wisdom?