Ratings are in !

Discussion in 'Battlestar Galactica & Caprica' started by Archangel, Oct 10, 2006.

  1. Cyrus

    Cyrus Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    I had a feeling this thread would get bumped after the post I made in that "Does Season Four suck?" thread. ;)

    Anyway, BSG is now back to the same level as season 3. The new viewers who were sampling the show are gone, so it's just us hardcore dudes left.
     
  2. tomalak301

    tomalak301 Admiral Premium Member

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    So this thread was brought back up to show Monkeys? Yeah, it's time to close this damn thing down. :rolleyes:
     
  3. sidious618

    sidious618 Admiral Admiral

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    MasterofOrion seems to think that ratings=quality. If that's true then I'm sure he'll agree that Farscape sucked as it was canceled due to low ratings (and don't give me any BS stories about why it was canned).
     
  4. sidious618

    sidious618 Admiral Admiral

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    Accoding to SyFy Portal ratings are up a bit, actually.

    Not that it bloody matters.
     
  5. Samuel T. Cogley

    Samuel T. Cogley Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Hold still, Jim.
    He doesn't think that.

    He just tries to find anything negative towards BSG, no matter how irrelevant or obscure, and then uses it to bump old threads (the more negative the title of the thread, the better).

    My earlier thread (http://www.trekbbs.com/showthread.php?t=54328&highlight=ratings) demonstrated that most fans do not care about the ratings. This thread is just for Masterof Orion. This is how he gets his kicks.
     
  6. Jack Bauer

    Jack Bauer Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    I pretty much loath the phrase but this thread has finally umped the fucking shark full force. Monkeys come up and it's the end of everything.
     
  7. Cyrus

    Cyrus Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    I wouldn't count on SyFy portal for reliable rating information. The actual rating info for past seasons and this season has been posted in this thread ad nauseum. Season 3 was mainly in the 1.1-1.4 rating range and that's what season 4 is getting now.

    And you are right. It doesn't matter.
     
  8. Kitty Worrier

    Kitty Worrier Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    At least BSG did better than ECW.
     
  9. Admiral Buzzkill

    Admiral Buzzkill Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    nuBSG has done well enough to get four seasons for the producers to tell their story. The Larson version didn't do well enough to get a second year as such.
     
  10. jimbtnp2

    jimbtnp2 Commander

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    What story?

    As the Battlestar Turns?.... ZZZZZZzzzzzzzz
     
  11. Garth Rockett

    Garth Rockett Commodore Commodore

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  12. solariabsg25

    solariabsg25 Captain Captain

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    To be honest I think that the ratings system has been on a slippery slope to being immaterial since the introduction of the home VCR.

    But now, with streaming, Tivo and all the other methods, it seems that the powers that be are realising that there is much more than just the paper ratings to a show.

    Let's put it this way - are there DVDs on the shelves of American Idol, Dancing with the Stars, etc? Cos if the Nielsens were a true reflection of a show's popularity, then Battlestar Galactica should be no-where near the top twenty DVDs, yet consistantly whenever I've gone into a store on week of release, it's been in the top three.

    And as that article states, no-one would make spin-offs from a failure.
     
  13. Temis the Vorta

    Temis the Vorta Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    Bitching about Nielsens is useless. Unless there is another system put in place, with similar scope, that can be used as a comparison, there is no way to know if the Nielsens are wrong. And even then, if there was a discrepency, a third system would have to be created as a tie-breaker. There's no way anyone's going to fund these two shadow-Nielsens systems so we'll never know the truth.

    What's far more interesting is the impact of DVD sales and TiVO (and paid downloads). But the story, like all these kinds of stories, is frustratingly short on specifics. How exactly do new revenue streams factor into business decisions about renewal of shows?

    If the Nielsens drop 10%, how many DVD sets need to be sold to make up the difference? How many paid downloads make up the difference? Since only a minority (though reportedly a sizable one) of TiVO viewers watch ads, how much are TiVO ratings discounted versus Nielsens? How much does it matter that TiVO viewers are watching ads "at the wrong time" (many ads are time-sensitive)? TiVO households are unrepresentative of the general public (better educated, higher income, more white) - some advertisers want that demographic, but many don't - how is that factored in?

    During Jericho's second season, the show was routinely #1 on iTunes' download list each week after it aired. It was cancelled anyway. How many more downloads would it have taken to avoid the axe?

    What are the trends in alternative revenue streams? Are DVDs more important than paid downloads or vice versa? Is one overtaking the other? What is the relative importance of the various revenue streams now, and what will the balance be ten years from now?

    Anyone who runs across a story like this that tells us something useful for a change, please post it. :D I'm really curious to know but nobody's talking (probably because this competitive info that businesses are loathe to reveal).
     
  14. Garth Rockett

    Garth Rockett Commodore Commodore

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    I suspect we'll never see any detailed discussion on the issues you raise, Temis, because many of those variables will differ from show to show based on the financial models present.

    With the specific case of BSG, we can draw the conclusion that the show is making a profit for Universal. Otherwise, as the article points out, they wouldn't be laying out money for more product. Ergo, the ratings don't effectively capture BSG's full earnings power. The same may or may not be true for other shows.

    Beyond that, we'll never know as businesses aren't likely to get into the nuts and bolts of those things with the public. However, I do think it's interesting that technology has changed things to the point that the old measures of success are no longer the only means of determing success.
     
  15. solariabsg25

    solariabsg25 Captain Captain

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    Problem is Temis I agree that though I believe the Nielsons aren't really much of a yardstick for the modern viewers, I still don't know how anyone can possibly do better. It would definately take a total re-vamping of the entire system.

    It's like if say Family A watched channel 1 at 8 on a Friday, Family B watched channel 2 at same time, and Family C watched channel 3, yet all three families taped the same show that was showing the same time on channel 4. The channel 4 show would be physically watched by three times as many people, but wouldn't even show up on the Nielsons.

    But I'm sure the money-making machine weighs up the revenue from downloads, selling to other networks, and DVD sales against lost advertising revenue. These secret calculations are the ones that decide if a show lives or dies. Could also explain why some shows that deserve to die can hang on for season after season, while others are cut horribly short. Hey, I may not have liked Jericho but that was simply cos it didn't quite catch me, but I can certainly see it had potential.

    Thing is on Neilsons alone if that was the true yardstick, basically all we'd have would be reality TV, soaps, cop shows and game shows, with very little if any genre shows in sight.
     
    Last edited: Aug 26, 2008
  16. Temis the Vorta

    Temis the Vorta Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    But some generalizations could be made. I'm pretty sure that sf/f shows - and any sort of serialized show - benefits more from downloads/DVD sales than sitcoms, police procedurals and reality shows. You can see that in the difference between the list of top-rated shows vs the list of top downloads or DVD sales.

    Since this is about the financial basis of the entertainment biz, someone is making those generalizations now, in great detail, and giving them to the boss to make decisions on. They just won't share, darnit! :D

    One other suspicion of mine: the sudden upsurge in sf/f series as a percentage of overall new shows is due to those generalizations. Somebody has realized that even if a new show sucks in the Neilsens, and most of them do, that sf/f shows can still be salvaged by downloads and DVD sales. Also, the international market is an unknown factor, but I'm thinking that helps sf/f as well.

    It's interesting that Chuck, with its marginal ratings from last season, has already gotten a full season order from NBC, even though the season hasn't even begun. That's probably partly due to NBC's overall desperation, but if Chuck didn't have genre appeal, would they have been so generous?
     
  17. WeAreTheBorg

    WeAreTheBorg Vice Admiral Admiral

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    that article says it averaged 2.2 million in for season 4.0? Only down slightly from season 1's average?
     
  18. Harvey

    Harvey Admiral Admiral

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    Viewers have been slightly up, at least early on in season four, but I have to wonder if that number includes DVRs, too.
     
  19. Kaijufan

    Kaijufan Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Viewers may be up for season 4.0 but I'm sure the show has only gotten more expensive, especially now with the Canadian exchange rate.
     
  20. Noname Given

    Noname Given Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Probably not - all the live action stuff was shot and 'in the can' before the dollar's nosedive really hit. I doubt CGI rates had much of a change and that is all that's left to complete th series. The cost for the post series telefilm will probably be up quite a bit though.