Orson Scott Card "Please don't boycott my film!"

Discussion in 'Science Fiction & Fantasy' started by Yminale, Jul 9, 2013.

  1. Opus

    Opus Commodore Commodore

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    "Fire and Brimstone" Evangelicals tend to cherry pick. They do it with the Bible all the time.
     
  2. DalekJim

    DalekJim Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    Not too fussed about his religious views, the guy knew how to write absorbing children's fantasy fiction.
     
  3. sonak

    sonak Vice Admiral Admiral

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    in a figment of a mediocre mind's imagination

    well if they're shouting loudly enough, it can be a different offense, of "disturbing the peace." But conversation-level slurs, while they're offensive, are not something government should be involved in stopping.
     
  4. Admiral2

    Admiral2 Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Exactly.


    Bull. "Intrinsically" implies that the progressive bent in the sci-fi story is automatic. It's not. No ideology is automatic to a fiction story. If the science fiction I'm reading has a progressive - or conservative or libertarian or green or what have you - bend, that's because it was inserted by the author, who made a conscious or subconscious decision to include it.

    And most of the time, the progressive bend is what I'm seeing, but if what you're saying is true, then any story that depicts the future would have the exact same trait. So then how do you explain Starship Troopers, or practically any other book Robert Heinlein wrote before the 80's?

    Again, bull, because this statement is based on a fundamental misunderstanding about Conservative Political thought, which is based on the uses and extent of government power, and has little to do with the dictionary definition of the word "conservative." It's also a pejorative Progressives typically level against Conservatives. (i.e. "He wants to live in the past!")
     
  5. Awesome Possum

    Awesome Possum The Friendly Face of Brutal Facism Moderator

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    Wired did an article on the subject, an excellent read.

    Here are some key bits.
     
  6. Avon

    Avon Commodore Commodore

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    well i'm glad where i am has hate crime laws to protect minorities. Not that they always work :(
     
  7. DalekJim

    DalekJim Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    If people try to picket a funeral or whatever then they should be legally stopped, but that's really nothing to do with the opinion expressed. That's just a violation of people's right not to be harassed. I'd expect the same if a crowd of people arrived at a funeral holding signs with Jason David Frank's face on them and singing the Power Rangers theme tune.

    I don't think we should really have laws specifically stopping people from saying certain things. I don't think that's any of the government's business.

    In life you are going to come across ideas you disagree with or that make you angry but that's just how reality is. Liberals shouldn't expect the government to always cushion them from it, it just makes them more sensitive and is counter-productive.
     
  8. Admiral Buzzkill

    Admiral Buzzkill Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    Card's defenders here and elsewhere appear pretty uninformed of or unwilling to examine what he's actually said - and worked for.

    In any event, as posted elsewhere here's David Gerrold's response to Card's butthurt:

     
  9. DalekJim

    DalekJim Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    I don't think he should apologise if he doesn't mean it. What would the point even be?
     
  10. Admiral Buzzkill

    Admiral Buzzkill Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    Card's defenders here and elsewhere appear pretty uninformed of or unwilling to examine what he's actually said - and worked for.

    In any event, as posted elsewhere here's David Gerrold's response to Card's butthurt:

     
  11. Allyn Gibson

    Allyn Gibson Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Going back to what I said a few pages back, because based on his work I would expect better of him. Doubling down on his intolerance, which is what he's done, runs counter to the ideals espoused and behaviors exhibited by the characters that made his career and his fame.
     
  12. YJAGG

    YJAGG Commander Red Shirt

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    everyone as an opinion and an ass and both of them can stink


    reading this reminded me of something if recall- after TNG -The Outcast came out ( no pun intended) there was an article in magizine that said (bear with me) that Gene was not really a gay rights fan -anyone know the article I am thhinking of?
     
  13. DalekJim

    DalekJim Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    I don't think he should back down from his position just to be some PR-friendly talking head when the movie is released. It never seems real when celebrities do this and the gay community would just accuse him of lying if he did anyway. When Michael Richards made a public declaration that he wasn't a racist after that whole "nigger"-gate incident, absolutely nobody believed it.

    The gay community will vote with their wallets by boycotting Ender's Game, a movie that most of these people would not have seen anyway judging by the general unfamiliarity with Card in many of his hate circles. Myself, I'll definitely be seeing it. Though I have worries it'll be an Abrams-esque disposable action movie instead of the slower film it should be.
     
  14. Avon

    Avon Commodore Commodore

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    but not everyone can talk out of both :p
     
  15. theenglish

    theenglish Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    I never saw that article. I do remember though an article leading into season 5 of TNG when Gene or somebody else talked about how the series would go further that season to show gay crew on board the ship. The idea was that there would be same-sex couples in the corridors or in Ten Forward just going about their daily lives. That, sadly, never came to pass.
     
  16. Awesome Possum

    Awesome Possum The Friendly Face of Brutal Facism Moderator

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    You contradicted yourself. I don't think people should be allowed to protest a funeral and need to be legally stopped from doing so, then you attack liberals because you think they want to protect people from opinions they don't like.

    Protesting a funeral is the actions of a scumbag, but even scum has a right to free speech in America. They're also openly hated by pretty much everyone in the country. Is it right to protest a funeral, I don't think so. But I cannot deny someone's right to say something. Especially on public land, which is what they do. They'd quickly get tossed out of private land and rightly so. That's how free speech works, it protects all speech not just popular speech. I don't know why you keep claiming that liberals are trying to silence opinions when all that is being said that some people refuse to see a movie because of the actions of the man who wrote the novel it is based on. That isn't censorship, that's capitalism. If you don't like a product for some reason, don't buy it. No one here has said that Card shouldn't be allowed to say whatever he wants or write whatever he wants. Just that they don't want him to get their money. Other people, like yourself, are free to do so if you wish. The movie may succeed and it may fail. Card will likely have little effect on the actual box office returns, so the movie will stand or fall on its own merits. But if a few don't want to see it because of what Card said, he has only himself to blame.
     
  17. YJAGG

    YJAGG Commander Red Shirt

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    I recall reading that someone pitched an idea to Gene that dealt with same sex realtionship not a main issue just a side note in a story - Gene said fine with me if so and so likes it - the person then went to see the decsion maker who was on the phone with gene and and they said Gene said I didn't want to do this- I don't lie for anyone...can nayone back me on up this either a Starlog, or Next gen magize article...
     
  18. ManOnTheWave

    ManOnTheWave Vice Admiral Admiral

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    That was David Gerrold in Cinefantastique, I think, talking about the script for Blood and Fire.

     
  19. Allyn Gibson

    Allyn Gibson Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Yes. And it was Herb Wright who Gerrold went to talk to and who said he couldn't lie for anyone. It's also covered in Joel Engel's Gene Roddenberry: The Myth and the Man Behind Star Trek.
     
  20. Scout101

    Scout101 Admiral Admiral

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    Card's being an idiot, but kinda always been that way, not a shocker. I'm just more of the type that doesn't give a shit what movie/rock stars, athletes, or I suppose authors think about politics or religion. Able to enjoy their work for what it is, and shut off their personal opinions just like every other retard on facebook, twitter, instagram, whatever. Pretty obvious fail on his argument, though, and one that several of the shoddy posters HERE use all the time. "You're not tolerant of my intolerance, so you're just as bad as me (or no fair!)" Yeah, ok...

    Loved the book as a kid, plan to see the movie. Likely will be disappointed based on enjoying the book for the past 20-25 years, but hey, that's what happens usually when favorite books become movies. Whether he hates gays or takes it in the ass 5x a day (or in the case of many politicians and public figures, BOTH), won't really have any bearing on the movie for me...