Not real Star Trek

Discussion in 'General Trek Discussion' started by King Daniel Beyond, Sep 14, 2013.

  1. King Daniel Beyond

    King Daniel Beyond Admiral Admiral

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    You do realize that The Motion Picture is a remake of The Changling, right? That Riker and Troi are recycled Decker and Illia? That Q is refried Trelane? JJ has a looooong way to go before matching Gene Roddenberry's record for recycling.
     
  2. BillJ

    BillJ Fleet Admiral Admiral

    I've got close to seven-hundred hours of TV Star Trek sitting on my DVD/Blu-ray shelf. I'm pretty happy with getting a new movie every three-to-four years.
     
  3. Green Shirt

    Green Shirt Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    The best definition of 'real', pure and simple. :techman:
     
  4. MarsWeeps

    MarsWeeps Fleet Captain Premium Member

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    Yes but it's more noticeable when it comes to movies. That's why I said Trek belongs on TV because a new show every week isn't going to be a previous show recycled.

    JJ's recycle rate is 100%. Can't beat that record.
     
  5. MarsWeeps

    MarsWeeps Fleet Captain Premium Member

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    I've seen every Star Trek series except for Voyager. I've tried, but I just can't finish it. By that time, they overdid Star Trek. Too many series in too short of time. It became diluted.

    I'd like to see a new series with new writers, someone who's familiar with Trek's history but won't use the same rehashed technobabble nonsense or the weak plots. I got sick of seeing these same scenarios:

    When they are trying to turn something on:
    "Sorry, (something) is off-line!"

    When they are trying to turn something off:
    "Sorry, (something) controls are fused!"

    Just piss-poor writing.
     
  6. Smellmet

    Smellmet Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    For me, Star Trek paints on such a broad canvas, that people take from it what they want - for some people it's all about the characters, some are all about the ships and the tech, or the social commentary, the morality tales, the politics of the various races, the list goes on - it's a rich well of ideas and tales to tell thats what makes it the enduring legend that it is. By comparison, Star Wars is very much a good vs evil adventure story that has been big screen adventures only in the main, if they ever made a Star Wars series, you can bet it would have a lot of Trek elements to it as it would have to dig deeper into the various characters/races and their stories/politics etc.
     
  7. Commishsleer

    Commishsleer Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    I think we all hope that.

    Star Wars has a Clone Wars series. I know its a cartoon but it seems sort of politically complicated like SW1,2,3. I don't know how the kids keep track of it.
     
  8. Tora Ziyal

    Tora Ziyal Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Yup. It's more honest than most responses.

    Seriously, it's all real. The only question is what one likes and what one doesn't like.
     
  9. Bad Thoughts

    Bad Thoughts Commodore Commodore

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    None of those others things feel like a mixtape the way JJ Trek does.
     
  10. Nerys Myk

    Nerys Myk Fleet Admiral Premium Member

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    I just watched STID and a few days ago watched ST09. Not the same film. A few similar elements is about it.

    TOS loved to recycle. Did we really need two episodes where a mad man takes over an asylum? Or a society ran by an evil AI? God like aliens who test the crew? Then we have episodes across several series where someone falls in love with a woman who's arranged marriage will end some sort of conflict. Being on TV won't prevent recycling.
     
  11. gazomg

    gazomg Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    totally agree with that.

    dont help that the recent two movies are in the alternate, and while i accept DS8 was a more darker trek in tied in with the original idea even with arcs as opposed to stand alone episodes with a message.

    For me the movies are you say hollywood crash bang wallop type stuff and the last movie a repeat formula of the previous
     
  12. WillsBabe

    WillsBabe Vice Admiral Admiral

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    This is pretty much the criteria I use, too.... :guffaw:
     
  13. Nerys Myk

    Nerys Myk Fleet Admiral Premium Member

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    Hollywood repeating a successful formula? That's gotta be a first. :guffaw:
     
  14. Bad Thoughts

    Bad Thoughts Commodore Commodore

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    I'm hoping for a Zombie Tribble takeover of the Enterprise. Maybe Spock will yell, "Double dumbass on you," or some other iconic Kirk line.
     
  15. TheGoodStuff

    TheGoodStuff Commander Red Shirt

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    For me 'real' Star Trek:

    1. Must adhere to Roddenberry-esque principles. Each episode should have a 'moral' [however light/heavy], the show should be a vessel for a look at the Human Condition & ponderings on ethics, morality and general philosophy. Generally, the show should encourage us to be as good as we can be while growing and learning.

    2. It must NOT be simply about action. Violence is the last resort, least preferred method. It must not be overtly sexual or gratuitous.

    So, for my rules....

    TOS, TNG, DS9, VOY & ENT and movies I-X are 'real Star Trek'.

    JJ is producing a shallow, soulless version of Trek necromancy in my opinion.
     
  16. Nerys Myk

    Nerys Myk Fleet Admiral Premium Member

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    :rofl::guffaw: Have you even seen TOS? The show was about as overtly sexual and gratuitous as you could get away with in the 60s. I think Gene loved to push the censor to the limit. If they said no nipples Gene would suggest they cover the nipples and nothing else. No skirt was ever short enough for Gene.

    Violence happened and not always as the last resort. Kirk was more than happy to conduct a campaign of sabotage against the Klingons on Organia. Scotty started a barfight because his ship was insulted.
     
  17. TheGoodStuff

    TheGoodStuff Commander Red Shirt

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    Yeah you can rest assured I have seen all of TOS.

    I think ENT was far worse than anything TOS did, as you said it did what it could get away with in the '60's [which wasn't much]. I dont see why you think some of the TOS outfits are overtly sexual. Revealing yeah but I think there is a world between them and watching a chick strip down to her underwear...for the sake of it.

    A barfight and a sabotage campaign are all intrinsic to plot: there are dozens of TOS episodes where Kirk specifically tries to resolve problems without resorting to violence or atleast shows remorse at the necessity. Its easy to point to two examples and scream 'OMFG VIOENCE!' but centering entire plots around it, simply for the sake of it, is not Star Trek and I do not think TOS really had that problem.
     
  18. SeerSGB

    SeerSGB Admiral Admiral

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    Dude, even back in the day they were calling Trek on the hypocrisy. 1976, the man that was organizing the first conventions at the time calling TOS out on it's hypocrisy. Whole interview is worth a watch, especially once Harlan gets on the stage.

    How many time did Kirk put the lives of 430 people above those of millions or billions on the world below.

    As for TOS being overtly sexual: Bullshit it wasn't,

    [​IMG]

    Everyone one of those costumes was about tits and ass.
     
  19. Nerys Myk

    Nerys Myk Fleet Admiral Premium Member

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    Of course those costumes were overtly sexual. That was the point of making them revealing. To tease and titillate. To show as much flesh as possible. He wasn't making the show for the local Convent.

    If Gene thought he could get way with a chick stripping down to her underwear in TOS, he would have done it. As it was he did have Yeoman Barrows change from a torn uniform to a princess costume. I think McCoy might have sneaked a peak. In TMP the Ilia probe appears on the Enterprise nude in a sonic shower. (Which Kirk observes) She exits and instead of changing into something practical, dons the shortest robe possible and continues to wear it till the end of the film.

    My point is TOS had fight scenes because the show was an action adventure show. It was part of the genre. Kirk showing regret or remorse doesn't change that. The films are no different. The violence in them is just as "intrinsic".
     
  20. -Brett-

    -Brett- Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Well, with Enterprise I think you could make a legitimate argument that it's not Star Trek. For it's first two or three years it literally wasn't.