Nicolas Cage's Career hits a new low.

Discussion in 'TV & Media' started by EmoBorg, Aug 16, 2013.

  1. Pingfah

    Pingfah Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    Nobody said it's terrible just because it appeals to Christians. Nobody has even spoken to the specific quality of this film, which hasn't even been made yet. Why is it you can never make an argument without misrepresenting other people's opinions?
     
  2. DalekJim

    DalekJim Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    Well, I suggest you look back at your posts in this thread and I'll leave it at that.

    I won't be seeing the film as it'll likely be typically lazy, watered down, bland Hollywood fodder, but a movie using Christian mythology doesn't really put me off for that alone. Hell, I even loved Jean-Luc Godard's Hail Mary and Richard Kelly's Southland Tales. I view all Christians as essentially delusional, so making a movie about God loving the atheists is about as realistic to me as a movie about God hating the atheists. The agenda is dumb and annoying, but that's Hollywood all over.

    I assume from your avatar that you like Gremlins. I doubt you believe the events of that movie to be realistic and true?
     
    Last edited: Aug 17, 2013
  3. Pingfah

    Pingfah Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    I suggest you do the same. Lots of ideas appeal to Christians, the particular reason why this one appeals so greatly is what is at question here, not simply the fact it appeals to Christians as you claim.
     
  4. DalekJim

    DalekJim Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    I find every Christian belief related to the afterlife to be pretty much equally disagreeable and entirely unbelievable. The premise of heaven is always elitist and exclusionary. Somebody lives a life of operating outside government law so gets billions of years of torture as punishment? I don't see how moderate Christian's beliefs are that much less off-putting than fundamentalist beliefs. Those people just tend to be from poorer and less educated backgrounds so are sneered at more acceptably by society than middle-class, liberal Christians that only follow their religion when it's convenient for their lifestyle.
     
  5. Pingfah

    Pingfah Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    Well you have a point there. But these books seems like a kind of fundie Christian version of torture porn to me. It gives them the opportunity to get their rocks off watching/reading about a group of people they are prejudiced against get slaughtered for daring not believe the same things they do, while fantasising about watching it from their perch in heaven.

    It's not about whether it's believable or not, but about why somebody would want to read about or watch that. I suspect it is simply to reinforce their own feeling of superiority.
     
  6. DalekJim

    DalekJim Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    It's to reinforce their own delusion in a world that is increasingly skeptical of Christianity. The film could be considered propaganda, but I disagree with the politics and values of the vast majority of entertainment I like. My favourite song is Supper's Ready, a song about the Book of Revelation's apocalypse, by a band with a name from the Bible. The song ends with an incredibly pro-Jesus sentiment.

    This stuff doesn't really phase me any more. The belief system is just so ingrained in our society, and basic Christian philosophy is so important to the development of my country and why I'm so fond of it.
     
  7. the G-man

    the G-man Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Aren't most fairytales/fantasy stories, including the Bible, just morality plays and/or metaphors for the author's world view?

    And most of those end up with at least some characters dying/suffering because of their failure to abide by the story's morality.

    As such, there seems to be little reason to be more offended by "Left Behind" than any other fantasy story.
     
  8. Hound of UIster

    Hound of UIster Vice Admiral Admiral

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    The author's world view in this instance is quite twisted.
     
  9. the G-man

    the G-man Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    What's so twisted about it insofar as it is based on an actual belief of that particular religion?
     
  10. ainmneacha_Nollag

    ainmneacha_Nollag Living the Irish dream. Admiral

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    He brought a house near here a few years ago, even switched on the Christmas lights because of this, I'm not sure if he still owns it though.

    Johnny Depp owns a flat on the Royal Cresent as well, never seen him out and about though.
     
  11. Opus

    Opus Commodore Commodore

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    Someone gave me the first book in the 'Left Behind' series to read, saying it was 'Incredible!' It was... Incredibly Awful. By far the worst written book I ever had the displeasure of barely reading. Calling it 'Fanfic' is being kind, and is insulting to Fanfic writers. Whoever the authors are, they couldn't write for a middle school newspaper, let alone a novel.
     
  12. Melakon

    Melakon Admiral Admiral

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    Depp's fond of disguises though, so you might have seen him and not realized it.

    I generally like Cage's work, and I think he did well in Knowing. It's the only film of his I currently have, and I'd bought it because I saw Alex Proyas' name on it. But the script is a mess though it tries to deal with similar themes as the Rapture films.

    The Left Behind series might work for mainstream audiences if it were played like that The Prophecy series with Christopher Walken.
     
  13. DalekJim

    DalekJim Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    Well, the Bible itself is essentially Jewish fan-fiction.
     
  14. Gaith

    Gaith Vice Admiral Admiral

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    So I guess the Aztecs' human sacrifice wasn't twisted because hey, that was "based on an actual belief of that particular religion" also? Come on, hombre. Revelation is itself a twisted and vicious polemic against inclusive vice traditionally Jewish followers of Jesus.
     
  15. the G-man

    the G-man Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Revelation is a fairy tale that imagines something bad happening to non-believers through magic at some point in the future. Human sacrifice is actually killing another human being. I'm surprised you aren't capable of drawing what is an obvious distinction.
     
  16. Gaith

    Gaith Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Revelation's inherent nihilism - God's gonna kill/allow to be killed pretty much all the unbelievers anyway, so what harm is there in sending 'em his way a bit earlier? - not to mention its anti-environmentalism (who cares about saving the rainforests, God's gonna torch everything all any day now) - has almost certainly encouraged, and probably in some cases caused, all sorts of killing and slaughter (not to mention indifference to environmental crises) in religion's name. I'm surprised you aren't capable of employing such basic critical/historical reasoning.
     
  17. publiusr

    publiusr Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Good points. A God of love doesn't invent horrors, allow the holocaust, or invent infinite punishment for finite sin

    I'm convinced that is the reason no gun nut has tried to assasinate him. He wears body armor, but if he takes a head shot and lives--so they don't dare.

    That fear may also be what is keeping him safe.
     
  18. SeerSGB

    SeerSGB Admiral Admiral

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    That is one of the best descriptions I ever heard of the books. I tried several times at the bookstore [when I worked there] to read some of the books, and they're just bad books. The read like an author that sat down and said "Fuck, I need to pay the bills, what's an easy sell...hey, I'll write a fanfic on the Bible and sell it as Christian fiction!".

    There's nothing wrong with using the Bible or books of the Bible as plot bunnies. But at least have some fucking respect for your target audience and actually try to tell as story that's worth telling.
     
  19. the G-man

    the G-man Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    So, what you are saying is that Christianity itself is inherently twisted.

    I'm not saying I completely disagree. Personally, I find all religions to exist largely to control people create differences where they should not exist and/or excuse wars. However, if one singles out Christianity then that's basically religious bigotry.
     
  20. Gaith

    Gaith Vice Admiral Admiral

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    ^ The Book of Revelation is one of the oddest ducks in the NT canon, and I naturally don't blame the authors of all the other books for that which the "John" in question wrote. On balance, I far prefer the NT to the OT, but as a matter of philosophy, let alone a possible prediction of actual future events, Revelation sucks hard.

    ... And the only reason I'm singling it out for criticism here is that Revelation is kinda the whole point of the thread, no? ;)