My "Just Saw Insurrection For the First Time" Review.

Discussion in 'Star Trek Movies I-X' started by Dale Sams, Jan 7, 2013.

  1. lurok

    lurok Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    If you search around this site (and net) you'll probably find some of the answer. The original ideas for INS were far more interesting, but Stewart in particular wanted something lighter (unless I'm mis-remembering).
     
  2. Robert Maxwell

    Robert Maxwell so far this is a dumb future Premium Member

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    Berman and Piller actually conceived of it as a lighter film from the getgo, because they didn't believe they could (or should) "out-Borg the Borg" and Berman was particularly fond of the success of The Voyage Home, and believed its lighter tone was largely responsible for its success.
     
  3. Dale Sams

    Dale Sams Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    That's all fine, I'd still ask for a *little* more gravity, a little more of a nod to the war than what they gave.

    From Insurrection, am I to infer that the Enterprise-E is really the USS Bob Hope?
     
  4. Robert Maxwell

    Robert Maxwell so far this is a dumb future Premium Member

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    Go find a copy of Piller's book "Fade In," which describes in gory detail how Insurrection was written. It originally was substantially darker, with more gravitas. Studio-ordered rewrites watered it down into what wound up on screen.
     
  5. JarodRussell

    JarodRussell Vice Admiral Admiral

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    The most awkward thing about it is that they didn't pursue the first draft because they ASSUMED Patrick Stewart might not like it. And then it turned it he did like the story, but they continued with a new draft.
     
  6. Dale Sams

    Dale Sams Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    I've only just now read the first part of "Fade In", but there are already several ideas that would made the film much better.
     
  7. BillJ

    BillJ Fleet Admiral Admiral

    Its a great book. :techman:
     
  8. StarMan

    StarMan Vice Admiral Admiral

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    The original outline drew inspiration from Heart Of Darkness and sounded damn good.

    I was drawn to Star Trek in the first place by First Contact, so had high hopes for it's sequel. Man, was I deflated leaving the theater that time round. :lol:
     
  9. Lance

    Lance Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    The thing which surprised me is that it somehow felt smaller than First Contact. And more cloistered too, in a funny sort of way. FC actually felt bigger and bolder and more "in the open", which is somewhat ironic because INS featured literally more external scenes away from the Enterprise than FC and costed way more money to shoot. I think FC was just better at suggesting its world, hinting in a way which makes it seem so broad while the size is actually scaled right back. On the other hand, INS kind of puts it all up there on the screen and then doesn't do anything interesting with any of it. :vulcan:
     
  10. Robert Maxwell

    Robert Maxwell so far this is a dumb future Premium Member

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    I always thought Insurrection felt "small" because it was about a few hundred people on an insignificant planet in the middle of a region no one cared about. In First Contact, the fate of the entire Federation was at stake--if they failed, everyone would be Borg. The stakes were higher and the scale was larger.
     
  11. BillJ

    BillJ Fleet Admiral Admiral

    This pretty much sums up the movie for me.
     
  12. lurok

    lurok Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Pretty much.

    But at the risk of repetition, the Frakes/Sirtis commentary makes it a lot more fun.
     
  13. Dream

    Dream Admiral Admiral

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    I still don't know why they did this story anyway. They should have trashed the script and started over.
     
  14. Lance

    Lance Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    It certainly is ironic that while INS had the bigger budget of the two (I remember reading that somewhere) and therefore, in production terms, more resources to throw at things, it all somehow ended up looking and feeling much smaller and cheaper than First Contact did.
     
  15. Australis

    Australis Writer Admiral

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    Hey, thanks for mentioning 'Fade In'. I didn't know it existed, and as a writer, I think it's going to be a great read.

    I haven't read the whole thing yet, but I'm willing to bet studio interference + time constraints = no time left.
     
  16. marksound

    marksound Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    Insurrection is not that bad, for Pete's sake. Some of you act like it's Plan 9 or something.
     
  17. Coloratura

    Coloratura Snuggle Princess Premium Member

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    Yeah, but you're repeating me, so it's okay. In fact, I endorse such actions.
     
  18. sonak

    sonak Vice Admiral Admiral

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    I have read over and over again about how great their commentary is, but I have an older version of the movie on DVD.:scream: I wish there was somewhere I could just read the transcript of it or something, I don't really want to buy a new blu-ray disc of one of the worst Trek movies of the entire series just to hear the commentary.
     
  19. Dale Sams

    Dale Sams Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    I'm reading Patrick's notes to Berman and Pillar in "Fade In", and frankly, I'm just facepalming. It's his character, he can do anything he wants. But he's really painting himself into a corner by wanting to move in those directions.

    He complains that if they go in Pillers direction, we'll eventually see them singing "Row Row Row Your Boat"?? Better that than basejumping or parachuting from outer space which are some similar directions that Shatner took in being more "Humorous, lighter, swashbuckling."*

    * I hope what I'm trying to say there gets across. Stewart seems to want to avoid some of the pitfalls of the TOS crew, and turns around and repeats different mistakes. And does it WORSE.
     
  20. MacLeod

    MacLeod Admiral Admiral

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    Sure TVH was lighter tone move, but to break it down to a one line description of the movie...

    The Key to Saving Earth can be found only in it's past.

    The crew of the Enterprise fight to save a Planet.