Lost 5x07: "The Life and Death of Jeremy Bentham"

Discussion in 'Lost' started by Agent Richard07, Feb 25, 2009.

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Grade the episode...

  1. Excellent

    67.1%
  2. Above Average

    24.7%
  3. Average

    5.5%
  4. Below Average

    2.7%
  5. Poor

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  1. Velocity

    Velocity Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Jack the Ripper fits that definition, too. He didn't kill as many as Ben has. And how many did Hitler kill personally? Ah, I really agree with you tho. Right now, Ben seems the worst. He seems like a real psycho. And he managed to get his butt back on the island.
    Is the island mad at Locke for listening to Ben and not to Christian?
     
  2. Brent

    Brent Admiral Admiral

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    Both are scum bags, but I'll just say this, I'd trust Widmore before I trust Ben. In the order of evilness, It is Ben>Widmore IMO, right now.

    I just really really find it interesting Jack is on Ben's side, and Locke on Widmore's. That should be interesting.
     
  3. Mr Light

    Mr Light Admiral Admiral

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    Holy ****. I just spend 25 goddamn minutes trying to get my computer to ****ing work to come here and post. It just froze for no ****ing reason and wouldn't get online after two reboots. Wow. That pissed me off.

    Anyway, good episode. 3.5/4 I guess. It did fall too much on the "showing us things we already knew" problem the way the S4 finale did, though.

    I think this is the first time in the series history that I've truly been stumped about something. I honestly have no clue who's the "bad guy" anymore, Ben or Widmore or a third party. I have no clue why Ben murdered Locke after having saved him from suicide a minute earlier. I guess he did it b/c Locke knew about Hawking.... but if the Island/Jacob sent Locke here to recollect the O6 surely it would tell him how to get back??? Or did Ben think he would be relied upon to get them to Hawking so he could still be in control? I just don't know, man.

    It was great to see Abaddon again... but they sure did wussify him. He went from being a mysterious mastermind to an assisted living dude. And then he dies. Is this cause he's on Fringe? Very disappointing.

    So is Widmore really a good guy? I just don't know. At least my theory was confirmed, that he WAS the Native Leader until Ben somehow conned him into pushing the Donkey Wheel. Boo yah.

    So when Ben teleports to Tunisia, the cameras aren't there. When Locke does, they're there and Widmore knows it's "the exit". But surely he would have known that from his "exit", so why weren't the cameras there for Ben? Of course his agents showed up to nab/kill Ben shortly after he arrived, but where were the cameras?

    Man, Walt is older. And his voice is deeper. Too bad they don't have to bring him back.

    My favorite part of the episode that totally geeked me out? THEY'RE BACK ON HYDRA ISLAND!!! I love Hydra Island, man. You've got an entire unexplored Dharma secret base. That's so cool that the Ajira plane landed on Hydra Island which we haven't seen in two whole seasons! I love it!

    That crashed plane was frickin' pristine, man. That was a controlled landing. It crashes on a rocky island but the fuselage is intact? Did the Island gently lower it via tractor beam? And we got confirmation that the O6 were "raptured" off the plane, which is cool.

    Did anyone else briefly think (between Ben stoppin the suicide and Ben completing the "suicide") that they faked his death with the ole "heart slowing injection" and he was alive all along?
     
  4. If you recall, The Others were building a runway there! Likely Frank saw it and landed them there. It looked like they were walking on paved cement.
     
  5. sidious618

    sidious618 Admiral Admiral

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    An hour of John Locke and during that hour Locke dies and then comes back to life. Can it get anything less than an "Excellent?" I think not.
     
  6. Mr Light

    Mr Light Admiral Admiral

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    I just can't buy Widmore as the good guy. I still go with Ben. Widmore sent an armed team to the Island with the backup plan of gassing the Island and killing every single living person on it. That's pretty evil. And Ben said he didn't want to do the Purge but had to to get in with the Others. Maybe Widmore, leader at the time, ordered Ben's role in the Purge.

    Can't wait to see screen caps of the Island maps that Caesar found at the beginning of the episode. Is he a Widmore soldier? He certainly seemed to know what he was looking for.

    The above theory about Ben killing Locke for the least amount of physical damage is a neat idea and I could definitely buy that being true.
     
  7. Mr Light

    Mr Light Admiral Admiral

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    ""If you recall, The Others were building a runway there! Likely Frank saw it and landed them there. It looked like they were walking on paved cement."" Dood, you just blew my mind. That's right they WERE building what was probably a runway! Did they know about the Ajira crash from a future timeflash traveller???

    The other big question of the night. The pilot (Frank) and "a woman" ran off with the passenger manifest. Who's the woman??? It can't be an O6er (ie the unseen Sun) since she didn't rapture off the plane. It's not Sayid's lady cop. So who was it???
     
  8. Agent Richard07

    Agent Richard07 Admiral Admiral

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    Thanks for the answers Brent and Gertch. Locke's death makes more sense now.

    To Mr. Light...

    - We could still see Walt and Abaddon again.

    - I got the impression that Ben was lying when he said he knew Hawking. I dunno, something sounded off about his response to Locke mentioning her. Even if he did know her, maybe he didn't know a lot about her, her ability to get people back to the island, or where she was. He was letting on that he knew more than he actually did.

    - I thought that maybe the Ajira plane skipped across the water and ended up a bit inland just past the beach. [Edit] Just read Sisko's post about the runway.
     
  9. Mr Light

    Mr Light Admiral Admiral

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    Does anybody remember where the Ajira plane landed? I recall it being intact on the side of a mountainous hill.

    When Ben visits Hawking in "The Lie" they appeared to be familiar with each other. And she says to Jack about how Ben always lies, like they know each other well.
     
  10. Mr Light

    Mr Light Admiral Admiral

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    Hmm, so they did outright state they were building a runway there. I couldn't remember if that was theory or stated: "SAWYER: So, when you pulled us out of those polar bear cages and put us on the chain gang, what the hell you have us breaking all those rocks for anyway? JULIET: We were building a runway. SAWYER: Runway, for what? JULIET: [Turns to him] The aliens."The moment they opened the episode showing people on a beach looking at another large island, I immediately thought HEY! Are they on Hydra Island?
     
  11. sidious618

    sidious618 Admiral Admiral

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    Then why did Ben say that he will miss John so much?
     
  12. Agent Richard07

    Agent Richard07 Admiral Admiral

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    The last two episodes have left me more convinced that the show will be returning to the traditional flashback format. Looks like we're easing back into it already.

    Looked like it was just beyond the bushes on the beach.
     
  13. Mr Light

    Mr Light Admiral Admiral

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    Hmm, maybe he'll miss John when he's dead, but then he'll be back alive on the Island again?

    Why would Ben murder Locke and then take the body back to the Island? Surely he would realize it would be resurrected the way Christian was? Is Ben completely unaware of Christian?
     
  14. Mr Light

    Mr Light Admiral Admiral

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    Or is it that Ben would be the only one able to see Locke's ghost? So that he could continue his role of "interpreting" orders from Jacob/Locke to the Others. But that doesn't make sense since he already knows that Hurley can see Jacob as well.
     
  15. Jono

    Jono Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    No choice probably.
     
  16. gh4chiefs

    gh4chiefs Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Kudos to the writers for moving the story along tonight and not dicking around with it for several weeks like they normally would.
     
  17. Starbreaker

    Starbreaker Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    Excellent. Beyond Excellent, in fact.
     
  18. gh4chiefs

    gh4chiefs Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Oh and whatever doubts I had about Ben were erased. He's a full blown son-of-a-bitch.
     
  19. Arrqh

    Arrqh Vice Admiral Admiral

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    The only reason I can see for Ben killing Locke was that it was the only way for Ben to take control of the situation so that he himself could get back to the island. I doubt he really cares about the fate of any of the losties at all. He may have a fondness for Locke, but this is now the second time he's going to have killed him (though the first time didn't go so well). All Ben does is manipulate, and I doubt Locke... or anyone else... is nothing but a means to an end for him.

    I suspect once Ben wakes up, he'll feed Locke a story involving Sun (it looked to me like that was the moment he decided to kill Locke, when he realized Locke hadn't spoken to Sun... he just couldn't do it until he got all the necessary info from Locke). As for Widmore, I don't consider him much better than Ben but his story at least made sense given what we know so I'm inclined to trust him for now... at least concerning his backstory.

    Uh, anyway, excellent.
     
  20. pookha

    pookha Admiral Admiral

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    yeah ..locke i thought knew about the link between widmore and the mercenaries.

    i think ben was concerned about locke meeting mrs hawking.
    i also wouldnt be suprised if he knew that if he killed locke but took him back to the island that locke would come back .
     

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