Discussion in 'Future of Trek' started by The Overlord, Jun 20, 2014.
Like I said, the beautiful thing about this world is we're all allowed to have our own opinions.
I'm of the opinion that 2 + 2 doesn't equal 4.
But I like that board up my ass!
I doubt those fans ever affected much though, and there almost has to be another Trek show at some point.
As Kirk would say, "I don't want that board taken out of my ass -- I need that board up my ass. It helps define who we are, if we lose that we lose ourselves."
Studios would rather have more viewers than "fans." Fans alone can't keep a Trek series afloat.
To carry over a point I supported recently in another thread, none of the Star Trek spin-off series (that means TAS, TNG, DS9, VOY, and ENT) have been "creatively in sync with the original material" (that means TOS), at least not fully, though probably TAS comes the closest.
For me, something like the above would hold zero interest. I watch Star Trek to see big, brash heroes explore the universe and encounter all kinds of weird stuff.
Why the heck would it 'have to be' a Section 31 show?
Either recast the crew again or set it on another Constitution-class vessel on the five-year-mission and explore some strange new worlds.
I don't think it necessarily needs to be Section 31 (and I personally have very little interest in that), but I also think it would be hard to have it just be random, episodic exploration. I think the S31 thing points to the trend of recent shows to be a lot more serial, and a lot different in tone. Netflix produced shows so far fit that mold. The whole idea behind a show on Netflix is that they release the whole season at once, which very much opens the door for a more serial approach.
This all may be why Netflix isn't much of an appropriate place for Trek.
Just because the ship and crew are exploring new worlds each week doesn't mean there's no room for serialized drama. It's a group of people crammed into a metal tube a million million miles from home. They aren't always going to get along.
fans can certainly kill a series. it's been done.
Nah, it's just a case of not enough people in general being interested in a series. There are many short-lived shows that have had very vocal fans, but very low viewership. On the other hand, you have shows that seem to have no fans (like Gene Roddenberry's Andromeda), that go on for years because they had enough overall viewers.
What does a show with low viewership and vocal fans have to do with my point?
You're comparing apples and oranges.
A show like SGU for example had a decent production budget because it was based on the successful stargate franchise. They had a built in audience. The franchise had the clout to warrant that sort of investment. A large number of the fans were incensed at the departure from the typical SG tone. It was a significant investment to make this show happen. And with the fan back lash, by having your target audience not even give the show a chance, it resulted in failure.
You can argue the quality of SGU if you want. But lets be honest, if SGA had the support to run for 5 seasons, and that show was not good, then there's no reason SGU couldn't either. It failed because the fans killed it.
Similarly, Star Trek fans killed Enterprise. There's no disputing it. By the time people started coming on board it was too little too late.
A show like Andromeda had an extremely low production budget, so was able to survive with a much smaller fan base for an extended period of time.
If someone green lights a Star Trek project, it's not going to be cheap. A property like Star Trek has a built in audience, and a network would be completely idiotic to ignore the wants of the massive built in audience that already exists. Making a blockbuster is a completely different animal from making serial television. And while an expensive heartless, action oriented film with absolutely no depth can make a billion at the box office(see transformers), you can't run a tv show with the same formula for more than a season or 2(terra nova).
It has everything to do with my point. Fans can't really make or break a series by themselves. Shows ultimately survive or fail on their ability to grab as many viewers as they can, not just a core fanbase.
Trek fans didn't kill Enterprise at all. You mean to tell me most of the die-hards never watched that show? Come off it! They may have moaned to hell & back about it but they watched it. Enterprise died because nobody else bothered - it was a 1993 show in an era of increasing Lost-style serialised 'event' TV, or at least it started that way; forcing it in its last two seasons to adapt to survive.
Fans of any major franchise, when it comes to the broad numbers, make or break very little.
This, this, a million times, this.
We don't matter, since we'll all watch it anyway. I hate-watched Enterprise for four seasons so I could bitch about it on the old TrekWeb forums.
I'm not proud of that, but it happened all the same. I'm a fan of Star Trek, so much so that I even tried to sit through the Star Trek Continues drek-fest. I'll watch anything Star Trek, no matter how ill-advised, for at least an episode.
Yeah, Enterprise's pilot had something like 12 million viewers, right? And then it quickly dropped off to 4 within a couple episodes. That has nothing to do with fans, it just means the general audience didn't care about the premise of the show.
Fans were already frothing at the mouth before "Broken Bow" even premiered. They lambasted the "Akiraprise", times to Qo'noS from leaked scripts, and the first contact with Klingons not being disastrous enough. None of this affected the fact that a reasonable sized audience tuned in for that premiere and still gave it a chance. Because basically the general audience doesn't give two shits about what some fanboys are saying. I know I don't when it comes to franchises that I'm only mildly interested in.
This is pretty much right on. I didn't watch Enterprise because it became hard to like any of the protagonists from the get go. Same thing with Voyager really. Although I was younger and stuck with it longer.
If Netflix brings back a Star Trek show I'm all for it and will probably watch it. I just hope it's got characters and better writing.
I didn't watch it when it aired, I couldn't be bothered. You want to say it was "bad", and general audience didn't like it so bailed. Guess what, there's more trek fans than you think. Just because you're on this board doesn't mean you are a trek fan, and everyone else that's not on here isn't. Just because you don't speak Klingon doesn't mean you're not a trek fan. Berman and Braga made a show that didn't appeal to the fan base. You think those 12 million that tuned in never saw star trek before, and think the franchise is silly? Those 12 million grew up with tos, or tng, or ds9, or voyager.
Furthermore, point still stands with SGU, it was a boycott of the show.
But hey, you all are entitled to your own opinion, and I don't share it.
A large fan base like one that exists for Star Trek and other successful franchises can certainly make or break a series. I'm having a hard time understanding how you guys think a franchise would intentionally look to ignore their existing customer base. In business terms, that's called idiocy, and putting you on the fast track to shortening your products life cycle.
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