List of Federation Members

Discussion in 'Trek Literature' started by Sci, Jan 31, 2009.

  1. foravalon

    foravalon Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    A wise choice not to make that assumption Sci. It looks like you are correct in this matter and it appears that christopher is mistaken. Sorry C-Bizzle. As others have said elsewhere, regardless of whatever fan handwave someone may choose to invent, in this case regarding Alpha Proxima and Proxima Centauri being one and the same, what apparently matters is the Author's intention; and given the text, it doesn't appear that this was the Author's intention.

    From The Brave and the Bold by Keith R.A. DeCandido:
    It also states elsewhere that Beta Proxima is the nearest Star system and is a Neutron Star. Over all Decker doesn't seem very familiar with the world
     
    Last edited: Feb 1, 2009
  2. Sci

    Sci Admiral Admiral

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    Hm. I don't know. If they have representation on the Council, that strongly implies that they're a Member State in their own right. (On the other hand, if they're part of Alpha Centauri, their representation on the Council would come through the Federation Councillor from Alpha Centauri.) KRAD, can you resolve this dispute?
     
  3. KRAD

    KRAD Keith R.A. DeCandido Admiral

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    I intended for Alpha Proxima II to be just what I said it was in the text, and I appreciate foravalon actually, y'know, using the text. :lol:

    So yes, they're Federation members (if they weren't, Decker and Kirk wouldn't have had the authority to declare martial law), and no, they're not part of Alpha Centauri.
     
  4. foravalon

    foravalon Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    I guess there are two matters at hand, one being whether or not Alpha Proxima is in fact located in the nearest star system to Sol, Alpha Centauri. I think several points in the Author's story indicate it isn't, unless there's a neutron star nearby us that we're unaware of, and/or Matt Decker is completely ignorant about our celestial next door neighbors for the last couple centuries.

    The other matter pertains to whether or not Alpha Proxima is a Member World in it's own right, as TBatB would seem to show, with its own individual representation on the Federation Council, or whether they are some random colony that's grouped in with several others.

    EDIT: And I'm a Johnny-come-lately... What KRAD said.

    btw, Just got a Singular Destiny, Yeah Baby! But when's Issue #2 of Farscape coming out?
     
    Last edited: Feb 2, 2009
  5. Christopher

    Christopher Writer Admiral

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    Which leaves the name of their system rather inexplicable. It means "First Closest."

    Oh well, at least it isn't something like Alpha Omicron or Delta Theta. Those are more like sorority names than star names.
     
  6. Sci

    Sci Admiral Admiral

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    Personally, I'm of the opinion that star names in Trek are like stardates -- we shouldn't take them too seriously and they aren't meant to stand up to too much scrutiny.
     
  7. foravalon

    foravalon Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    Well put Sci. :bolian:
     
  8. JD

    JD Admiral Admiral

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    Cool, thanks for that Sci. I haven't read anything Titan, other than Destiny, since SoD came so my memory of the books isn't the greatest. And it does certainly sound like they are members to me. I would think that anytime thre is a big deal made over how few of a species there are in Starfleet then it would be pretty likely that they are members. Except of course when it's done in the reverse, and it's a big deal that there are so many members in the fleet, like Worf being the only Kingon, Nog being the only Ferengi, and Dakal being the only Cardassian in SF, or the number of Bajorans pre-membership.
     
  9. Avro Arrow

    Avro Arrow Commodore Commodore

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    Yeah, it is kinda silly. Unfortunately, TOS did this a fair bit: Beta III, Omega IV, Omicron IV. And TMP gave us Delta IV. So, the original episode writer did probably intend for it to be a planet whose full name is Alpha III.

    Sci, impressive list. I don't have much to add, but since you mention Deneva's destruction in its entry, just thought I'd mention that
    it sounds like Rhaandarel got the Deneva treatment too.
     
  10. LightningStorm

    LightningStorm The Borg King Commodore

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    Maybe it's the first one closest to Alpha Centauri as opposed to the first one closest to Sol?
     
  11. Christopher

    Christopher Writer Admiral

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    Uhh, then it would be Sol. It's not only the closest star to us, we're the closest star to it.
     
  12. LightningStorm

    LightningStorm The Borg King Commodore

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    I'm not heavy enough into astronomy to really talk about it. But I was just thinking that perhaps it was a situation where AC might be closest to Sol AP could be closer to AC than Sol was in the opposite direction.

    For lack of visuals I'll use numbers take: 1, 7, 10, and 15. 1 is Sol, 7 is AC, and 10 is AP. 10 is closer to 7 than 1 is but 7 is still the closest to 1.

    But that's neither here nor there if that isn't at all the case. Which it sounds like that is what you are saying. :)
     
  13. Christopher

    Christopher Writer Admiral

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  14. Timo

    Timo Admiral Admiral

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    In terms of clear-cut mistakes, Klaestron shouldn't be a UFP member. They were overtly hostile in "Dax" and made it clear that the UFP should keep out of their business.

    I can't fathom how the idea first surfaced that these guys could be members - but it persists in so many books now that it may have to be rationalized somehow, such as with them all joining immediately after the events of "Dax" due to a revolution or something.

    Also, you probably know my stance on Trill membership...

    We could always argue that our heroes drop parts of star names when they are clear from the context. Either the place is so famous that nobody bothers to give the full name anyway, or our heroes are having their adventures that week within a specific constellation (a tight asterism) and thus drop the constellation name.

    Alternately, we could argue that we are mistyping these names. It's not Delta IV, it's Daltay IV; it's not Alpha III, it's Alstha III; it's not Omega IV, it's Omygu IV. Odds are that most words in a foreign language will always resemble differently spelled words of different meaning in other languages - especially in the case of proper names.

    Timo Saloniemi
     
  15. Therin of Andor

    Therin of Andor Admiral Admiral

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    Doesn't Earth's United Nations have some overtly hostile members at times, who make it clear that the UN should keep out of their business?
     
  16. GodThingFormerly

    GodThingFormerly A Different Kind of Asshole

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    That scene isn't mentioned in any In Thy Image/The Motion Picture treatment or script of which I am aware. :confused:

    TGT
     
  17. Therin of Andor

    Therin of Andor Admiral Admiral

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    I know, but it was the brief given to Fred when he started sculpting masks. He was disappointed the "big scene" never went anywhere.
     
  18. Timo

    Timo Admiral Admiral

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    Certainly. But if we use this standard, we should argue that the Klingon Empire is a UFP member (quite regardless of the remarks made in the first season of TNG), and that the Cardassian Union is, and that the Ferengi Alliance is, and so forth...

    In "Dax", we hear for example the following:

    How much clearer could the writers be about wanting Klaestron IV to be a non-member?

    Timo Saloniemi
     
  19. GodThingFormerly

    GodThingFormerly A Different Kind of Asshole

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    Huh.

    TGT
     
  20. Therin of Andor

    Therin of Andor Admiral Admiral

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    Why should they be clearer? They weren't writing the episode so some fan could build an infallible list of trivia.