Klingon Neutral Zone

Discussion in 'General Trek Discussion' started by Andres, Jul 17, 2013.

  1. Andres

    Andres Ensign Newbie

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    When the Klingon Moon of Praxis exploded and the KE seeked help from the Federation, at the meeting with all the Starfleet officals the idea of dismantling the Neutral Zone arose. Now after the Khitomer Accords the Federation and Klingons were strained but after Nerranda III a friendship blossomed. By the time that the Dominion War arrived did the Klingon Neutral Zone still exist or had it been marked void as both powers had close ties? Or was the Neutral Zone still established as a "just in case"?
     
  2. TheSubCommander

    TheSubCommander Captain Captain

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    I don't remember anything canon, saying either way, so this is just conjecture on my part. I think the Klingon Neutral Zone, at least the side shared with the Feds, may have been treated more as a border by the time of TNG, than a DMZ, because the Enterprise crossed into Klingon space pretty frequently. There may have been nominal forces still stationed, just in case, but I don't see two allies having a heavily militarized border.

    Now I am sure the Romulan-Klingon Neutral Zone was probably highly fortified on each side. For obvious reasons.
     
  3. Pavonis

    Pavonis Commodore Commodore

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    The Klingon neutral zone? Didn't that first get mentioned in the films? Wasn't Kirk afraid if peace with the Klingons happened, there'd be no more Neutral Zone? I'd say it would be abolished, if it ever really existed. The Neutral Zone was supposed to be associated with the Romulans, not the Klingons.
     
  4. Kevman7987

    Kevman7987 Captain Captain

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    Going by clues dropped in the franchise, The Klingon/Federation border didn't always have a neutral zone.

    TOS always mentioned the Klingon border. The mention of a neutral zone did not appear until the movies. by the time of TNG, the Klingon border has become just a border again.

    I get the feeling that the Federation/Klingon neutral zone only existed for a short time anyway. Maybe 20ish years.
     
  5. Anwar

    Anwar Vice Admiral Admiral

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    The Klingon Neutral Zone was more or less a mistake. Originally, the enemies in the Kobayashi Maru test were supposed to be the Romulans, which explained why they mentioned a Neutral Zone and all that. Then they changed it to Klingons without changing anything else so now there was a Klingon Neutral Zone too.

    It's mentioned only once more, in TUC, but after that it's never mentioned again. Mainly because it was a mistake it existed in the first place.
     
  6. T'Girl

    T'Girl Vice Admiral Admiral

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    It was mentioned (in a way) in TSFS as well, Kurge at one point told his helmsman to set course for the "Federation Neutral Zone," which probably the Klingon term for what the Federation refers to as the "Klingon Neutral Zone."

    What we saw in TWOK in Saavik simulator test didn't seem to be a zone entirely separating the Federation from the Empire, and more a enclosure of a limited area. An area of exclusion.

    :)
     
  7. Anwar

    Anwar Vice Admiral Admiral

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    I think that was a holdover from the previous version of the story, where Kruge and the Klingons were Romulans (which is why they had a cloaked ship called a Bird-of-Prey).

    Yep, but what exactly the Neutral Zone is supposed to be is kind of a debated thing (or it was, back then). Originally, the Zone was an enclosed space that contained the Romulan Home System and the Romulans were like the Kzinti from Larry Niven's stories (blockaded within their own system only) but then they changed their minds and made them an Empire so now the Zone is a guarded Border instead of a containment line.
     
  8. MacLeod

    MacLeod Admiral Admiral

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    Perhaps the KNZ came about due to the Organian Peace Treaty
     
  9. Harvey

    Harvey Admiral Admiral

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    The Klingon Neutral Zone is first mentioned in TWOK. It's a mistake, basically. The de Forest Research company strongly recommended changing it to the Romulan Neutral Zone; they also recommended a reference to "Gamma Hydra" to keep the film in line with the television series. For some reason (perhaps to use the stock footage from TMP without comment), the Klingon Neutral Zone stayed, but Gamma Hydra was added to the dialogue.

    The later films stuck to the idea.
     
  10. BK613

    BK613 Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    ^^
    it's been a while since I watched TWOK but I don't think they ever referred to it as "the Klingon Neutral Zone", just "the Neutral Zone" ( or "the Zone".)

    Sure there were Klingon battlecruisers present but it was also a training exercise: their presence might be a surprise element for the Kobayshi Maru and not actually reflect reality...;)
     
  11. Pavonis

    Pavonis Commodore Commodore

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    ^Good point. The KM scenario must have a few out-of-the-blue surprises to throw at the cadets, otherwise they'd all know what to expect after just one of them took it.
     
  12. C.E. Evans

    C.E. Evans Vice Admiral Admiral

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    That's the way I've viewed it.

    The Klingon Neutral Zone may have been just be a region of previously contested sectors that were declared off-limits to both the Federation and the Klingons.
     
  13. Anwar

    Anwar Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Then why would there be Klingon Battlecruisers inside the Zone ready to intercept any Fed ships that went in there?
     
  14. Captain Clark Terrell

    Captain Clark Terrell Commodore Commodore

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    Wasn't Nimbus III in the Neutral Zone?

    --Sran
     
  15. Pavonis

    Pavonis Commodore Commodore

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    Yup, the Planet of Galactic Peace was in the Neutral Zone. But which one?
     
  16. Captain Clark Terrell

    Captain Clark Terrell Commodore Commodore

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    I don't know. I'd guess it's closer to Klingon space because the BOP was able to find Enterprise fairly easily. Plus, there's dialogue from McCoy about how they're "bound to bump into the Klingons."

    --Sran
     
  17. C.E. Evans

    C.E. Evans Vice Admiral Admiral

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    I don't think they were inside the Zone, but immediately outside of it on their side waiting for any Federation ship that crossed into Klingon territory (like most borders, it may take only seconds for a ship to cross the Zone).
     
  18. Timo

    Timo Admiral Admiral

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    In TNG "The Enemy", it took a modern Warbird five hours to cross the RNZ at supposed maximum warp...

    Since the Romulan Neutral Zone exists, and a NZ has been mentioned in the Klingon context as well, we are well excused for thinking that the Federation always wants a Neutral Zone on all of its borders. That is, no clear-cut line where one nacelle can be on the Fed size and the other on the enemy size, but always a nice and thick buffer region that gives plenty of early warning about (uncloaked) invasions and spy activities and smuggling attempts.

    Put another way, we have never really heard of a Federation border that would not feature a Neutral Zone. Except, apparently, the border against Cardassia, where there is no neutrality, just two sides brushing against each other but banned from holding armaments.

    On the other hand, our TOS heroes typically deal with "the Neutral Zone". How can they tell which one, if more than one exist? Sometimes it's clear from the context, or perhaps from preceding but offscreen dialogue, but for example in ST5:TFF, it most definitely is not...

    Timo Saloniemi
     
  19. T'Girl

    T'Girl Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Moving at an angle through the zone?

    Vixis: " Captain ... hostages on Nimbus Three."

    It probably wasn't that hard to "find" the Enterprise.

    :)
     
  20. Timo

    Timo Admiral Admiral

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    At an angle, perhaps, but not corkscrewing or anything. The difference wouldn't be more than a few dozen %; we're still talking about a timescale of hours here.

    FWIW, Tomalak's Warbird was tracing the scoutship Pi through the Zone. Would these two vessels have come from drastically different directions? Certainly the Pi would have attempted to minimize exposure, thus moving across the NZ and then UFP space to Galorndon Core along the shortest possible path, normal to the local surface of the Zone.

    Timo Saloniemi
     

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