Kate Stewart in Day of the Doctor (SPOILERS!)

Discussion in 'Doctor Who' started by Noddy, Nov 5, 2013.

  1. Noddy

    Noddy Captain

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    Okay, some minor spoilers here, people, so be warned: From the recently revealed official synopsis, we know that the modern day sequences of Day of the Doctor take place in 2013. It's also long been known that Kate Stewart is returning, after appearing previously in The Power of Three. But, depending on how things go, this creates a bit of a problem: The Power of Three was set several years in our future, around 2018 or so, and that was when Kate first met the Eleventh Doctor......so how can she meet him now, in '13?
     
  2. Allyn Gibson

    Allyn Gibson Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Chances are, Moffat doesn't care; the casual audience that the series is pitched at probably isn't aware of the timespan of series 7A. If questioned, he'd probably say something like, "Oh, it was only fan supposition that the Ponds' final episodes took place in the future." And if fans question it, he would probably say that they can figure out for themselves how it works.
     
  3. Noddy

    Noddy Captain

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    Except it wasn't fan supposition. The Doctor first met adult Amy and Rory in 2010, as is shown multiple times throughout Series 5; after their wedding, they next met the Doctor a year later, making it 2011. Following their Series 6 adventures, the Doctor next met them in The Doctor, the Widow, and the Wardrobe, where I believe it was stated that it had been two years since Amy and Rory last saw him, making it Christmas 2013. So all their subsequent stories with him had to have begun after that year, and that includes The Power of Three. The chronology just completely falls apart otherwise.
     
  4. Emperor-Tiberius

    Emperor-Tiberius Commodore Commodore

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    Ah-oh, Moffat's done it again!
     
  5. Lance

    Lance Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Wibbly-wobbly timey-wimey stuff. ;)

    New Who's "chronology" has never been consistent. The RTD era was allegedly taking place one chronological year after broadcast from every episode commencing with "Aliens Of London" (where the Doctor lands Rose back at her estate, but a year later), but you'd be hard pressed to actually use that as a basis for a proper timeline, and there's just as much evidence to contradict it as there is to support it (even more so once Torchwood meanders into the picture as well).

    Unless an explanation is given on-screen, it's best just to ignore it. :)
     
  6. Noddy

    Noddy Captain

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    And we can't just bump the date of Amy and Rory's river back a few years, as it was explicitly in 2010, as reinforced several times in Series 5.
     
  7. Noddy

    Noddy Captain

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    How does Torchwood muddle up the chronology?
     
  8. Allyn Gibson

    Allyn Gibson Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Noddy, I don't disagree with you. :)

    I'm just saying that Moffat will probably sidestep the question because he'd much rather have his story take place in the present (on the anniversary date, no doubt) and proffer nonsense when asked about it. The only people who would care about the chronology are Lance Parkin and the fans. The casual audience won't give a toss. They won't even be aware that "The Angels Take Manhattan" has the Doctor bringing Amy and Rory from their present in the future to 2012, even though that's logically what had to happen.
     
  9. Noddy

    Noddy Captain

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    It's looking like we'll have two options as to how reconcile things:

    1) Ignore the original dating of Amy and Rory's present day adventures with the Doctor.

    2) Ignore the 2013 date for Day of the Doctor, and assume it takes place several years in the future.
     
  10. Lance

    Lance Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    A 2007 episode of Doctor Who, set in 2012, makes mention of Torchwood in a present tense even though the organization was disbanded on-screen by 2009, and even Jack and Gwen's splinter group in Miracle Day (ostensibly set in either 2011 or 2012 depending on who you believe, but if the chronology is consistent then it's gotta be 2012) is not truly Torchwood but merely uses the name.

    Torchwood is not by any means the only thing that contradicts itself about New Who's 'chronology', though. :)
     
  11. Emperor-Tiberius

    Emperor-Tiberius Commodore Commodore

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    Probably the first one. For all we know, he did meet Amy and Rory earlier than before in the rebooted timeline, with the Daleks invasions having never happened as a result of the crack in time.

    The latter date will probably be the one thats adapted, though.
     
  12. Lance

    Lance Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Exactly. Amy's crack has got a lot to answer for. ;)

    The truth is, we can't take anything that happened in Doctor Who prior to 2011 for granted, because Series 5 ended with the entire universe being reset. Not just implicitly, like with the Time War, but explicitly reset. It ends, and begins again. So all events in the Doctor Who universe prior to the 2011 series are by their very nature now mutable and may not have happened exactly as we saw them.
     
  13. The Grinch Doctor

    The Grinch Doctor Two Hearts Too Small Premium Member

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    Of course, the show has been loose and fancy-free with the chronology for years: U.N.I.T. dating.

    My simple solution: Ignore all of it and enjoy the stories.
     
  14. Lance

    Lance Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Very sound advice. :techman:
     
  15. Emperor-Tiberius

    Emperor-Tiberius Commodore Commodore

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    You know, I just realized that the crack in time might be able to use as an excuse for the UNIT date inconsistency. In the original order of events, they did occur during the late 70's, early '80's, but in the rebooted one, they happened much earlier.

    Thats wishful thinking, of course. But hey, why not? :)
     
  16. StCoop

    StCoop Commodore Commodore

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    I fully agree that Moffat won't care and 99% of the audience won't notice but there's no getting away from the fact that there's been more definite on-screen dating for the Amy-Rory years (and for the number of years that pass after they stop traveling full-time) than for any other "present-day" period in the series history.

    Rory was born in 1989 and says he is 31 in DOAS, which puts it in 2020. TPO3 takes place after it which makes that year the earliest real date that the Doctor meets Kate.

    Here's the Craig Hinton Memorial Fanwank Explanation: In an unseen story that takes place before this one where Kate meets the Doctor for the first time from her POV he tells her that when they meet in 2020 she should act like it's the first time as it will be from his POV. (As happens in a 6th Doctor Big Finish audio whose name escape me at the moment.)
     
  17. Captain_Amasov

    Captain_Amasov Captain Captain

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    Maybe there will be a big reset button used at the end of the 50th.
     
  18. Allyn Gibson

    Allyn Gibson Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Not impossible. Moffat likes that shiny red reset button.

    But very unsatisfactory.
     
  19. Noddy

    Noddy Captain

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    Is The Power of Three definitely the first time Kate's met Eleven though? I know it is for Eleven, but is it for her?
     
  20. Timelord Victorious

    Timelord Victorious Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Doesn't she claim to recognize him by his weird style of clothes?