Janeway's Decision to Kill Tuvix

Discussion in 'Star Trek: Voyager' started by Godless Raven, Apr 11, 2013.

  1. Fruitcake

    Fruitcake Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    Spoiler tag it!
     
  2. Pingfah

    Pingfah Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    After needlessly destroying the lives of her whole crew, sparing them from having to suffer the dickhead Tuvix for another 70 years or so was the least she could do.
     
  3. Guy Gardener

    Guy Gardener Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    "There's no Starfleet rule or regulation the allows us to execute someone."
     
  4. Fruitcake

    Fruitcake Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    Guess that proves he wasn't someone then.
     
  5. Guy Gardener

    Guy Gardener Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    The say he was a creep because Kes felt Molested because he loved her like Neelix did and she didn't reciprocate... That sounds like they're gearing up for a rape story. She's being fickle and he's being entitled it's a volatile mix.

    If he had forced himself on the little girl, legally I'm assuming that Tuvix would be forced to serve jail time? Although if there's no mental illness in the future, then maybe there's no rape so all the laws against rape have fallen into disrepair.

    But my point is

    A. Tuvix deserves death for forcing himself on Kes.
    B. Tuvix Deserves ten years in the brig, so A he's allowed to disintergrate into his components, or B he's not allowed to split into Tuvok and Neelix as it's seen as a clever jail break, or C Janeway still forces the split, and afterwards Neelix and Tuvok both have to serve half of Tuvixes sentence of their conviction.

    Hmmm...

    Look at this.

    Tuvok and Janeway in a serious disagreement about whether she should or should not murder Ransom.

    Wow!
     
  6. Captain Atkin

    Captain Atkin Captain Captain

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    In "I, Borg", it was said the the collective do not assimilate individuals. This is generally true, but we have seen instances where the Borg did assimilate individuals. Voyager is 'a collective' of aliens, and they do have technology that the Borg would be interested in assimilating. The Borg do attack and assimilate starships. Voyager was an advanced starship, so I don't think it is a case of "been there, done that". Starfleet is viewed as a threat by the Borg Queen, so I don't doubt for a second that she would assimilate a Starfleet vessel that was flying around in the Delta Quadrant. If the Borg assessed and determined that Voyager's biological and/or technological distinctiveness was worthy of being added to the Collective's perfection, they would assimilate them in a heartbeat.

    When the USS Raven was first detected by a Borg vessel it was disregarded by them. When the Raven was detected a second time, 7 of 9's father had developed technologies that could elude the Borg's sensors, making them a more worthy target. Even though there was just 3 people onboard the small ship, they were all assimilated. Voyager developed new technologies during their travels through the Delta Quadrant, so that would make them desirable for assimiliation too.

    As for Janeway's plan to slink through Borg space, hoping not to get detected... well... let's just say that Janeway made a lot of questionable decisions over the course of the series. Case in point: killing Tuvix.
     
  7. Guy Gardener

    Guy Gardener Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    Voyager was lost in 2371.

    First contact happened in 2373.

    Scorpion happened in 2374.

    Seven of Nine knew about the Borg's involvement in 2063.

    They wouldn't know that Voyager had something unique to offer until after they'd popped the hood, and they're not going to do that unless it looked like Voyager had something to offer, which it probably didn't since Voyager was at least 2 years behind the most recent ship which they had assimilated in First Contact.
     
  8. Gov Kodos

    Gov Kodos Admiral Admiral

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    She's extraditing him to the Ankari, who will use intensive questioning techniques.
     
  9. JanewayRulz!

    JanewayRulz! Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Sounds like she was agreeing to turn over the SHIP to the Ankari... not Ransom.

    Too bad the Ankari are not familiar with Federation Doublespeak.

    Shocking to consider, (after how many years with Janeway???) that TUVOK was equally unfamiliar with Janeway Doublespeak.

    :wtf:

    Uhhh... are you excusing current rapists from their actions because you feel they are mentally ill?

    :wtf:
     
  10. R. Star

    R. Star Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Um... that's just a bit of a stretch isn't it? Seems to me there's a big difference between saying mentally ill people commit rape and saying people who commit rape aren't at fault because they're mentally ill.
     
  11. Guy Gardener

    Guy Gardener Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    There are entire penal colonies, but in the last sanatorium in the 23rd century there were 7 patients. From a population of Trillions, there were only 7 criminally insane persons... And Voyager was set a hundred years after Whom Gods Destroy.

    I'd same the three key motivators for rape would be entitlement, insanity and stupidity.

    If you take insanity off the table, even fractions of insanity we'd today consider practically normal, it's going to be a whole new world.
     
  12. Fruitcake

    Fruitcake Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    It also means every bad person ever in Star Trek has no excuse and is just a huge jerk.
     
  13. publiusr

    publiusr Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Here is a suggestion. A tansporter is first used to make a Thomas Riker clone of Tuvix, with the original separated into Tuvok and Neelix.

    Three for the price of two.

    No one dies
     
  14. R. Star

    R. Star Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    That was briefly touched upon earlier in the thread. But continuity was never Voyager's strength. :p
     
  15. Sci

    Sci Admiral Admiral

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    All that does is create a new copy of Tuvix -- Tuvix 2.0 -- while still killing the original Tuvix in the course of creating new copies of Neelix and Tuvok (the originals of whom still remain dead).
     
  16. Hartzilla2007

    Hartzilla2007 Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Well unless the Tuvix copy is the one that is the one that is split and not the original.
     
  17. Third Nacelle

    Third Nacelle Captain Captain

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    So with Will & Thomas Riker, one is the "real" Will, and one is a copy? Who determines which one is real?

    If we're going to say that you can maintain continuity of identity while transporting, then they are both real. If not, every person who has ever used the transporter is a copy.
     
  18. Dream

    Dream Admiral Admiral

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    The real Riker was lost in a transporter accident before he became commander. The one we have been seeing since the start of TNG has been a copy.
     
  19. Crisp Crinkle

    Crisp Crinkle Admiral Admiral

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    Thomas is The Riker Within.
     
  20. Guy Gardener

    Guy Gardener Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    There are less ominous ways to say that Dee is preggers.