Is Spock the main character of TOS?

Discussion in 'Star Trek - The Original & Animated Series' started by albion432, May 2, 2014.

  1. albion432

    albion432 Lieutenant Red Shirt

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    Thank you for taking the time to respond to this thread and your willingness to express your opinions on the subject. It’s been more helpful than you may realize. Unfortunately it seems I haven’t come across very well in posting this thread. I am very new at posting in a forum, having never done so before two days ago! Perhaps I shouldn’t have created a new thread until I had a better idea what to expect from it.

    I can see where you’re coming from in the first paragraph. I would have probably felt the same way under these circumstances. We don’t know each other, and for all I know I’ve come across as a complete crack pot. Just like with Nerys Myk, I don’t know your level of understand regarding the hero’s journey, and feel no need to defend my own, but it seems like you are at least familiar with it. Again, I need to stress it was a misnomer to restrict the scope of this topic to just TOS. I meant this topic to cover the entire body of filmed Kirk/Spock adventures. Unless there’s a distinction which encompasses this corpus of material, I would like to continue using TOS when referring to it.

    Again, I obviously didn’t do a very good job at explaining my position. I will try to be more clear here. I completely understand and believe Kirk has earned his position as Captain of the Enterprise. I think his leadership skill are exemplary, and he is a very intelligent and insightful leader of men. I was trying to point out the reason why Kirk is in position of lead character in the series is because of his rank as captain. The position itself is what puts Kirk in the position of making the decisions which push the plot forward, which is the role of the protagonist. I do not doubt for a minute he has earned the right to sit in the center seat, but his qualification was not my point at all. I hope I made the distinction clear.

    I've responded to the last part of your post line by line below:

    Campbell is not an "authority."

    Here is where I have to strongly disagree with you. Not only was Campbell an authority on the hero’s journey, he was the authority on the subject. Campbell literally wrote the book on the hero’s journey for Pete’s sake!

    He was talking about basic themes that underlie cultural myths,

    If you believe Campell was only referring to “basic themes that underlie cultural myths” then you have given yourself away. To me that indicates a one-dimensional understanding of his work. Any understanding of it is better than no understanding, don't get me wrong. However, it is soooo much more than what you have indicated it to be.

    but he certainly wasn't saying that every single work of fiction is required to conform to a single formula.

    Correct, I have never seen him quoted as saying that.

    He was describing the pattern, not prescribing it.

    As Chekov said once, “if the shoe fits, wear it.”

    And he wasn't writing about the structure of episodic television series.

    That is a logical conclusion, since he published The Hero With A Thousand Faces in 1949.

    Yes -- you're coming from a completely different direction than I am. We're not going to be able to agree on this.

    That’s a shame, predictable, but a shame. Despite one of the most important things Star Trek attempted to teach us, people still tend to reject what is strange to them instead of seeking to understand it.
     
    Last edited: May 4, 2014
  2. Nerys Myk

    Nerys Myk The Real Me Premium Member

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    Hmmmm, do you have examples for the first part of Hero's Journey that fits what we know of Spock?

    1) The Call to Adventure

    2) Refusal of the Call

    3) Supernatural Aid

    4) Crossing The Threshold

    5) Belly of The Whale
     
  3. albion432

    albion432 Lieutenant Red Shirt

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    Yes, actually. Thanks for asking.
     
    Last edited: May 4, 2014
  4. Nerys Myk

    Nerys Myk The Real Me Premium Member

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    1) The rift with Sarek is the result of Spock joining Starfleet, not the cause. The why would be his "Call".

    3) How are the Thasians part of Spock's journey? Charlie's journey for sure, but Spock's? They don't act as mentor or guides for Spock, they just take Charlie away.

    4) Using a transporter is like hopping in a cab. So I'm not sure that works. GoF is better, but that seems to be more of Kirk's journey, with Spock along for the ride.

    5) Those aren't really transformative. V'Ger would be the best choice here.
     
  5. albion432

    albion432 Lieutenant Red Shirt

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    Yes, V'ger is another very good example.
     
    Last edited: May 4, 2014
  6. Lucky

    Lucky Commander Red Shirt

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    Kirk was always the protagonist. Spock was the deuteragonist.
     
  7. Push The Button

    Push The Button Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    Spock is probably the best known and most popular character, sort of like Kramer on Seinfeld. Kirk was the main character, however.
     
  8. Ssosmcin

    Ssosmcin Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Except........... Harve Bennett has always gone on record as having written the script by himself. Nimoy, I'm sure, had plenty to contribute, but the script, and therefore the destruction of the Enterprise, was Harve Bennett's baby.
     
  9. Dennis

    Dennis The Man Premium Member

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    When TOS was on NBC, Spock was easily the most popular character on the show.
     
  10. albion432

    albion432 Lieutenant Red Shirt

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    According to Majel Barrett, the first character introduced in the [Cage] script was Number One. "That was the first character Gene wrote into the script," Barrett stated. "Captain April was not an afterthought because he knew he had to have a captain, but the first character that was described was Number One." (Star Trek Monthly issue 27, p. 43)

    As promised, when I came across the evidence to support my claim, I'd post it immediately. 1 down, 1 to go . . .