Humpback whales

Discussion in 'Star Trek Movies I-X' started by Noddy, Aug 27, 2013.

  1. Noddy

    Noddy Captain

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    Why was the Cetacean Probe in TVH only interested in humpback whales? We know the humpbacks were intelligent, but what about all the other species of cetacean on Earth? If humpbacks were intelligent, I'd think it quite likely that other kinds of whale would be too - so why did the Probe ignore them? Remember, it was only said to be humpbacks that were extinct by the 23rd century; in an episode of TNG, I remember Picard making a reference to sperm whales as though they still exist.
     
  2. BillJ

    BillJ Admiral Admiral

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    Probably because whatever race sent the probe had seeded the Earth oceans with humpback whales and it came to see how they were progressing.
     
  3. Noddy

    Noddy Captain

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    So humpback whales are aliens? Erm....not too sure what to make of that.
     
  4. Kirk the Jerk

    Kirk the Jerk Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    What (surprisingly) bugged me more was how easy it was for them to travel back in time.
     
  5. Timo

    Timo Admiral Admiral

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    Well, it was easy for Spock. Which is consistent with him having done it several times before. Quite possibly, the know-how was never allowed to leak to the wider audience, and even within Starfleet very few people know how Spock accomplished the feats of "Tomorrow is Yesterday", "Assignment: Earth" and ST4:TVH.

    We know very little about the motivations of the Probe. Spock recognized the voices he heard as those being made by humpback whales - but perhaps any whale would have done, and Spock just failed to realize that the Probe started talking blue whale a few minutes later, and switched to sperm whale not long thereafter?

    We don't know if the whale sounds were actual communication, either. Perhaps they were just unintelligent noises, and the Probe was satisfied with hearing some being emitted from Earth's oceans, meaning the whole time travel effort was for nothing. Kirk's original idea of responding with "gibberish" would have solved the whole problem already!

    Timo Saloniemi
     
  6. Kirk the Jerk

    Kirk the Jerk Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Well... If it was so easy for him as you say, he seemed pretty accepting of the destruction of Vulcan and allowing the whole alternate Abrams tosh to take fold, why not just go forward, kill Nero and save the day :rommie: especially If it just involved flying around a sun at warp.

    Didn't Kurn fly a bird of prey into a sun, destroy a couple of other Birds of Prey and then fly off at warp in TNG: Redemption, yet no time travel :wtf: (I realise they were entirely different circumstances and Kurn didn't fly 'around' the sun using it's gravitational pull)

    Just seemed an empty plot to me, an 'easy' way to 'save the day' and i don't particularly like the idea of time travel as being 'easy'; there has to be some sort of catalyst.
     
  7. Timo

    Timo Admiral Admiral

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    Well, that Spock had never seen "Tomorrow is Yesterday".

    The trick is said to involve careful calculation and even the sort of fine tuning that calls for "thruster control". Odds are that a Vulcan would do better there than a Klingon...

    Timo Saloniemi
     
  8. Kirk the Jerk

    Kirk the Jerk Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    That's somewhat true, however we have 'primeline' Spock and 'alternate' Spock present in the alternate timeline and both seemed pretty okay with it.
     
  9. Noddy

    Noddy Captain

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    The Probe didn't stop attacking Earth's biosphere until the humpbacks starting singing though, so it does appear as though no other kind of whale would have done.

    And the humpbacks are definitely intelligent (at least in the Trekverse) as Spock conversed with them in a mind meld, and they informed him how upset they were at their species' plight, and agreed to be taken into the future!
     
  10. Deckerd

    Deckerd Fleet Arse Premium Member

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    In the Trekverse the humpbacks obviously fared a lot worse than the humpbacks in this universe.
     
  11. Timo

    Timo Admiral Admiral

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    Yeah... No kind of surviving whale, that is. Sperm whales apparently still eat cuttlefish in Earth's oceans at the time of "Silicon Avatar", suggesting other toothed predators might have survived as well; perhaps it's just the baleen whales that have disappeared due to changes in plankton?

    For all we know, Spock could converse with Spot just fine, too.

    Timo Saloniemi
     
  12. Nebusj

    Nebusj Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Well, the others are just boring. Humpbacked whales have a better sense of narrative style; they could make getting their diver's license renewals a compelling story. A sperm whale? Man, they could make a story about being abducted by aliens to repopulate the species three centuries in the future sound dull.
     
  13. Melakon

    Melakon Admiral Admiral

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    "Oh... I saved the whale race once. Yeah, that was me. Hey baby! Looks like you gotta little sperm whale in ya."
     
  14. Nerys Myk

    Nerys Myk Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    The aliens must have liked them best or for some reason could communicate with them easier.

    Since its a different timeline, I don't think killing Nero in the Abrams timeline would change anything in the Prime timeline. That Nero might not even be a miner.
     
  15. Kirk the Jerk

    Kirk the Jerk Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Ahh time travel gives me a headache haha, I see what you're saying but again, if it was 'easy' for him, he could have gone back a few months (in the Abrams universe) warned everyone on Vulcan of their imminent destruction (or at least his own Mother) and saved many thousands of lives, his fellow Vulcans... Not just sit in hiding as he eventually does. It does open up a possible reboot of a reboot though :rommie:
     
  16. Captain_Amasov

    Captain_Amasov Captain Captain

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    So long, and thanks for all the krill! :D
     
  17. KarmicCurse

    KarmicCurse Lieutenant Red Shirt

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    I inferred that the aliens who sent the probe did not originally seed Earth with whales, but instead that the first time these aliens, or their probes, visited Earth the highest form of intelligent indigenous life was whale. So they sent another probe to check on the whales' condition unaware of human progress.
     
  18. Timo

    Timo Admiral Admiral

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    Makes sense, except it's a bit weird the aliens would first send a probe advanced enough to deduce that whales are smart and interesting, and then follow with a probe so stupid that it cannot make the same deduction on current evidence and realize there are also humans there. And chimps, and other possible challengers to the whales.

    Somehow, the aliens must have decided that whales should be promoted over all later contestants. But if so, why did they stop being destructive to land-dwelling life when the whales reappeared? Surely killing surface life with added cloud cover could have been done in a way that would still leave enough plankton for the whales to weather the weather, and then emerge triumphant...

    Timo Saloniemi
     
  19. jpv2000

    jpv2000 Captain Captain

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    I really hope they don't go there. It would probably give you an even worse headache. ;)
     
  20. Nerys Myk

    Nerys Myk Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    From a certain point of view its not his mother or his Vulcan. He seems content to let things play out on their own.
     

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