How many people aboard Enterprise ncc-1701

Discussion in 'Trek Tech' started by RB_Kandy, Aug 18, 2012.

  1. RB_Kandy

    RB_Kandy Commander Red Shirt

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    I'm writing a fan fic, and I need to know, on Kirk's Enterprise, how many people were regularly aboard the ship?

    What was the maximum crew capacity of the ship?

    How many security officers were aboard the ship?
     
    Last edited: Aug 18, 2012
  2. T'Girl

    T'Girl Vice Admiral Admiral

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    We heard the figure 430 a few times, but Captain Pike had a crew of half of that, with the same basic ship.

    In Journey to Babel, they took on 114 delegates (of whom 32 were ambassadors), Sarek came aboard with 2 aids and a wife. If 1 delegate plus 3 others was typical then the number of people aboard the Enterprise would have been nearly a thousand. Although I've consider the possibility that they might have remove the science contingent for that mission. Even still, the ship would have been stuffed.

    :)
     
  3. C.E. Evans

    C.E. Evans Admiral Admiral

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    I've always believed the maximum capacity aboard the original Enterprise was 1,000 persons, but that the actual number depended on whatever mission she was undertaking at a time and the ship would either add or remove staterooms to accomodate that number before leaving spacedock, IMO.

    I don't think there's ever been a canonical number given for the number of security personnel during Kirk's mission, but I do remember one of the original AMT models suggesting about 90.
     
  4. King Daniel Beyond

    King Daniel Beyond Admiral Admiral

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    Franz Joseph's old blueprints break down the TOS Enterprise's security staff thusly:

    Chief of Security (Lt. Cmdr.) ... 1
    Security officers (Lt.) ... 5
    Security Specialists (Ensign) ...84

    From a total crew of 430.

    If you're talking about the new Enterprise from the last movie, the "Experience the Enterprise" site said it had an overall crew of 1100, so I'm guessing more redshirts!
     
  5. RB_Kandy

    RB_Kandy Commander Red Shirt

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    Thanks for the answers guys.
    The figure of 1,000 seems unlikely considering that was the ships compliment on TNG, and Enterprise D was a lot bigger than Kirk's ship.
    I am going to go with that 430 number T'Girl gave me.
    and thank you KingDaniel, for the info on the security.
     
  6. C.E. Evans

    C.E. Evans Admiral Admiral

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    One important thing to take into consideration, however, is that the Enterprise-D was a really big ship and could likely hold well more than 1,000 people (some estimates have placed a maximum capacity upwards of 15,000 for a short period of time).

    The extra space is reserved for passengers/evacuees or for future crew and onboard facility expansion. The same was very likely true of the original Enterprise, which could probably be reconfigured during a starbase layover to carry 500 additional people in addition to Kirk's crew of 430.
     
  7. yenny

    yenny Captain Captain

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    There were 431 officers and crew on the 1701 before the refit. After the refit, there were 500.
     
  8. Timo

    Timo Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    Today, when warships are reworked, this gives them a specific new crew requirement that is the minimum number of people needed to get the ship to do the tricks it's built or reworked for. No additional people are ever embarked because nobody wants to pay them.

    But the Starfleet crews clearly include "idle" people, "passengers" who could and would be shoved overboard or pressed to useful duty in order to pare down the crew count to the absolute minimum if Starfleet were run by people of today. We never hear what the personnel requirement of Kirk or Picard's starships would have been (except in "Remember Me" were various false figured are bandied about, sort of). We never hear what the personnel capacity of these vessels would be, either. The only thing we ever hear is the personnel count, and that is never indicated to reflect limitations or demands posed by the ship.

    That aside, though, it is curious that the counts stay so consistent within a series. Picard's ship had people coming and going, yet there were two mentions of 1,014 people aboard; Kirk's ship likewise had various visitors, yet the figure of 430 was repeated. And Archer stuck to some 80 despite taking the MACOs aboard. An odd coincidence? A Starfleet regulation? Or indeed an indication of technological requirements or limitations posed by the ship's design, despite appearances?

    Timo Saloniemi
     
  9. scotpens

    scotpens Vice Admiral Admiral

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    The Making of Star Trek clearly states that the Enterprise (post-"The Cage") normally carried a crew complement of 430. Franz Joseph's blueprints, IIRC, show living quarters for a total of 500 persons -- by making most of the primary hull (saucer) into a virtual hotel.
     
  10. blssdwlf

    blssdwlf Commodore Commodore

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    From the episodes, between 400-430.

    The TMP Enterprise also was 431.
    COMPUTER VOICE: Crew status is one seven two at duty stations, two four eight off duty, eleven in sickbay, all minor.
    My guess, at least twice the crew capacity that way she can rescue another ship's crew if needed. She did rescue colonists and other stranded crews and was in progress to rescue the crew of 400+ of a Klingon Battlecruiser in "Day of the Dove" but only 40 were still alive to be rescued.

    [/quote]

    Unknown. However, in "Breads and Circuses", Kirk did threaten to beam down 100 men with phasers. It was a bluff, but the number might be correct though...
     
  11. Timo

    Timo Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    So, proof positive that Kirk's ship had families aboard?

    Probably a function of the time these people have to spend aboard. For a day-long trip, "standing room only" (meaning thousands upon thousands) might be perfectly okay - but they would have to break out the special chemical pellets for purifying the air and vent out vast amounts of life support fluids to manage the heat. For a trip taking twenty years, even 200 might be too much.

    One wonders how many of these would be security officers and crew, and how many would be "naval infantry", random crew issued a phaser and told to go down to fight.

    In TAS "Lorelei Signal", five female redshirts of Lieutenant rank (Uhura included) beam down to solve a crisis no man could cope with. Is it realistic to assume there were four female Security Lieutenants on call (when the rank isn't all that prevalent among the Security folks in TOS and no females of that professional persuasion were ever seen there), or are we seeing Uhura drafting other non-Security Lieutenants besides herself for the landing party?

    (Actually, there's even a fifth female redshirt Lieutenant in the party - for a brief while, where Nurse Chapel's blue dress gets colored wrong...)

    Timo Saloniemi
     
  12. Boris Skrbic

    Boris Skrbic Commander Red Shirt

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    Or more than one duty shift? :vulcan:
     
  13. blssdwlf

    blssdwlf Commodore Commodore

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    LOL :D They make up the junior ranks ;)

    In anycase, I had interpreted it as minor injuries resulting in a stay in the sickbay.
     
  14. Timo

    Timo Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    The idea of the crew count still being 430 in ST:TMP sort of speaks against any of these being "superfluous" personnel. It would be pretty odd for Admiral Kirk to take onboard somebody useless like Marla McGivers (even if in the end, knowledge of history would be the one thing needed to save the Earth!) for this frantic scramble.

    Or then it's sheer coincidence that the sum total of essential and nonessential personnel in TOS was the same as the number of essential people alone in TMP, and the refit had just increased the manpower requirements of the vessel a lot.

    Timo Saloniemi
     
  15. yenny

    yenny Captain Captain

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    It was mention that the Enterprise 1701 had crew of 431 in: A Piece of the Action, The Mark of Gideon? And I think it was mention also in Tomorrow Is Yesterday and The Tholian Web?
     
  16. Mark_Nguyen

    Mark_Nguyen Commodore Commodore

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    Yep.

    Also, in ST6 Valeris states that the Enterprise-A by that point had a crew of 300. And in the movie prior, she shipped out with "less than a skeleton crew aboard" per Scotty, but very little thought was really put into why the ship was sent off in the first place, in the condition she was in.

    Mark
     
  17. blssdwlf

    blssdwlf Commodore Commodore

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    Here's a run-down of crew sizes mentioned in TOS and TOS Movies (TOSM).

    Interestingly, in TMP, if 172 are at duty stations and if they had 3 duty shifts then the total crew should be 516, not 432. But since they were on alert because of V'ger, it could be that an extra crew shift was up as well, but that would suggest perhaps 2 crew shifts of 86 with 172 as "superfluous"... Or, they have only two shifts of 172 with 88 as "superfluous"...


    e2 "Where No Man Has Gone Before"
    <100 Women as part of crew
    MITCHELL: With almost a hundred women onboard, you can do better than that, friend Captain.
    e8 "Charlie X"
    428 Total
    RAMART: Like a whole city in space, Charlie. Over four hundred in the crew of a starship, aren't there, Captain?
    KIRK: Four hundred and twenty eight, to be exact.
    e16 "The Menagerie"
    203-206 Total, USS Enterprise 13 Years Prior to TOS
    SPOCK: As I stated, gentlemen, this was thirteen years ago. We were on routine patrol when the ship's sensors detected something ahead. At first we were not certain what it was.
    ...
    PIKE: You bet I'm tired. You bet. I'm tired of being responsible for two hundred and three lives.
    e17 "Shore Leave"
    431 Total
    MCCOY: He needs it. You've got your problems, I've got mine. He's got ours, plus his, plus four hundred and thirty other people's.
    e18 "The Squire of Gothos"
    400 Total
    KIRK: There are four hundred men and women aboard that ship.
    e20 "The Alternative Factor"
    431 Total
    KIRK: Lazarus, you're hurt. I know. I sympathize, but I've got four hundred and thirty other men to worry about.
    e21 "Tomorrow is Yesterday"
    430 Total
    MCCOY: There are four hundred and thirty of us, and that means four hundred and thirty chances of altering the future.
    e23 "A Taste of Armageddon"
    500 Total
    ANAN: Are those five hundred people of yours more important than the hundreds of millions of innocent people on Eminiar and Vendikar?
    e26 "The Devil in the Dark"
    ~100 Security Troops including Kirk and Spock
    KIRK: You may be right, Doctor, but at least it's something to go on. Mister Spock, have Lieutenant Commander Giotto assemble the security troops and arm them with phaser number two. You make the proper adjustments. You seem fascinated by this rock.
    ...
    SPOCK: Captain, there are approximately one hundred of us engaged in this search, against one creature.
    e33 "Who Mourns for Adonais"
    431 Total
    KIRK: I have four hundred and thirty people on that ship up there.
    e35 "The Doomsday Machine"
    401 Total for USS Constellation
    DECKER: Don't you think I know that? There was, but not anymore. They called me. They begged me for help, four hundred of them. I couldn't.
    e36 "Wolf in the Fold"
    <440 Total including visitors from planet below
    SPOCK: Indeed, it will try, but not immediately. We know it feeds on fear and terror. There are nearly four hundred and forty humans aboard this ship. Surely it will try to breed fear and terror before it kills.
    e38 "The Apple.htm"
    400 On Ship with Kirk's party below
    KIRK: You're fired. Four hundred people
    e47 "Obsession"
    <400 Total for USS Farragut, 11 Years Prior to TOS
    SPOCK: Fortunately, I read somewhat faster. In brief, Doctor, nearly half the crew and the captain were annihilated. The captain's name was Garrovick.
    ...
    MCCOY: Am I? I was speaking of Lieutenant James T. Kirk of the starship Farragut. Eleven years ago, you were the young officer
    at the phaser station when something attacked. According to the tapes, this young Lieutenant Kirk insisted upon blaming himself.
    ...
    KIRK: Don't you understand? It killed two hundred crewmen.
    e48 "The Immunity Syndrome"
    400 Total for USS Intrepid
    SPOCK: Captain, the Intrepid. It just died. And the four hundred Vulcans aboard, all dead.
    e49 "A Piece of the Action"
    >400 Total
    KIRK: There are over four hundred guys there.
    e53 "The Ultimate Computer"
    430 Total for USS Enterprise, ~400 per ship in wargame fleet
    DAYSTROM: It takes four hundred thirty people to man a starship. With this, you don't need anyone. One machine can do all those things they send men out to do now.
    ...
    KIRK: There's your murder charge. Deliberate. Calculated. It's killing men and women. Four starships, sixteen hundred men and women!
    e54 "The Omega Glory"
    > 400 Total, USS Exeter
    CAPTAIN'S LOG: What could have happened to him and the over four hundred men and women who were on this ship?
    e60 "And the Children Shall Lead"
    430 Total
    SPOCK: Captain, the four hundred and thirty men and women on board the Enterprise and the ship itself are endangered by these children.
    e66 "The Day of The Dove"
    430 Total, as 38 Are not trapped
    SCOTT: Three hundred and ninety two trapped below decks.
    e72 "The Mark of Gideon"
    430 Total
    KIRK: I seem to be the only one of my crew left on board the Enterprise. Four hundred and thirty, and I, apparently, am the only one left.
    ...
    KIRK: Well, let's see. Power, that's no problem, it regenerates. And food. We have enough to feed a crew of four hundred and thirty for five years.
    e73 "The Lights of Zetar"
    430 Total
    MCCOY: Lieutenant, there are four hundred and thirty people aboard this ship. You're the only one that passed out, and I want to know why.
    TOSM1 "The Motion Picture"
    432 Total, Before Ilia was replaced by probe. 430 Total, End of Movie.
    COMPUTER VOICE: Crew status is one seven two at duty stations, two four eight off duty, eleven in sickbay, all minor, Over.
    TOSM6 "The Undiscovered Country":
    > 300 since there still had to be crew left to man their stations :)
    VALERIS: None. We have got a crew of three hundred turning their own quarters inside out, but the killers may still be among them. Surely they have disposed of these boots by now. Would it not have been logical to have left them on Gorkon's ship?
     
  18. Timo

    Timo Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    Actually, that's >400 because 200 is not yet quite half of it...

    It would seem that all figures for Kirk's vessel markedly differing from 430 are rough estimates or downright errors made by uninformed people.

    Timo Saloniemi
     
  19. blssdwlf

    blssdwlf Commodore Commodore

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    Good catch.

    Although Anan's figure might be an estimate, he did have good reason to have an accurate count for reporting to the death chambers plus Ambassador Fox might have had a large delegation with him pushing the number to 500.
     
  20. C.E. Evans

    C.E. Evans Admiral Admiral

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    I'd go with the rough estimates (some folks could just round off 430 as 400). But I think it's also possible that the precise number of Kirk's crew varied following various crew rotations, but generally hovered around 430.