Heroes 3x18 "Exposed" Discuss and Grade

Discussion in 'Science Fiction & Fantasy' started by Dream, Mar 3, 2009.

?

Grade the episode

  1. Excellent

    5.4%
  2. Above Average

    30.4%
  3. Average

    50.0%
  4. Below Average

    8.9%
  5. Poor

    5.4%
  1. Dream

    Dream Admiral Admiral

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  2. Anwar

    Anwar Vice Admiral Admiral

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    So, did Nathan save Peter or does Peter still have the ability to keep other powers and it's just gradually coming back?

    Sylar's dad had TK powers too? Maybe that's a submerged second power Sylar always had and he didn't need to kill that guy to get TK powers originally.

    EDIT: Nevermind. Nathan saved him.
     
  3. The Habs Fan

    The Habs Fan Commodore Commodore

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    I give it an Average. It was better than the last 2 weeks, but still not great. I liked the ending with Parkman in the suicide vest, but the love story between Aquaman and Claire-Bear was useless and badly written.
     
  4. D Man

    D Man Commodore Commodore

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    I agree, and I'll add that the puppeteer showing up was a nice surprise, which is rare on this show these days. Peter and Parkman's "plan" to trade a HUGE amount of evidence for one person was really stupid, but I've come to expect that :lol:. Sylar was interesting as always, and I'm glad he finally got rid of Meltman. They've dragged his search out a few episodes too long, so I'm really hoping he finds his father soon.
     
  5. melancholymecha

    melancholymecha Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    I liked this weeki's ep better than the last couple ones, & I too couldnt tell if it was Nathan who flew Pete out or not... why did they make the flying look so damn fast???

    I will :rolleyes: if next week ends with Nathan carrying another exploding man into the sky...
     
  6. Daneel

    Daneel Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    So, given this thing between Claire and Alex, I have to wonder: what the heck happened to West? I mean, I think it's safe to say he's no longer in the picture, but why is that? Not that I'm complaining about him being gone, of course. Good riddance. Maybe if we're lucky he somehow got trapped in a now non-existent future too (seriously, has Peter even once thought about Caitlin since Season 2? What's up with this show and all the dropped storylines and characters? Do they think we don't notice?).

    Anyway, tonight's episode: like most, it was predictable. The action in the Bennet household contained no big surprises (with the romance angle and the government agents not catching Alex), but it was nice to see that Sandra has learned a trick or two in the past year.

    Matt, the Petrellis, Noah, Hunter: decent, although Peter could have planned the trade a bit better. On the scale of his boneheaded decisions, though, this isn't among the worst (not that that's saying much :p). And as much as I loathe the prophetic painting angle from last week, it's kind of interesting to see how the suicide bomber vision is unfolding. That Hunter is one ruthless SOB, I'll give him that. I'm curious to see what comes of this next week (not that I'm expecting them to actually blow up Matt, of course).

    As for Sylar and his quest to find his father... So, the apple doesn't fall far from the tree, apparently. I just hope they don't try to convince us that it's his dad's fault that he became a killer, because that would be lame.
     
  7. startrekwatcher

    startrekwatcher Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Average.

    Not bad really just not that interesting. The problem is if you are going to do a serialized series you need to come up with a few interesting threads that you develop over the season with the key being to hold the audience's attention and build up from the previous episode.

    I've noticed this being an issue with BSG and Heroes. The writers fill airspace for 3/4 of an episode with "stuff" that really feels like standalone material and then introduces a series of teasers that actually are interesting only to follow them up not at all or in a very bland way. Successful serials make the stuff in between interesting and build from what came before with each subsequent chapter in the arc even better than the last. It is obvious Heroes isn't in all liklihood going to get back what it once was and I have no idea why I keep watching it other than curiosity of how it will end. Even Matt as a human bomb, which should have been a somewhat exciting moment felt ho hum.

    Sylar's discovery initially seemed like it might be interesting then the revelation felt convenient and clumsy--not at all natural. I did like the selection of Fleetwood Mac's "The Chain" though. Nathan is suffering multiple personalities--one minute ready to round them up and then the next helping Peter. More predictable cat and mouse. I said last week it would get old with the run-ins with the government and then escapes. It has. The characters aren't engaging me beyond Angela. The show is failing at being a plot-driven series which even if I'm not into the characters I can at least enjoy the ride like I did with Enterprise with the Xindi arc and the show is failing at being an interesting quiet character driven show because try as it might the attempts at the quieter moments aren't working for me.

    Frankly I'll be glad when BSG and Heroes both end. Ironically, it looks like Lost is the only one of these type of series to finish without going off the rails.
     
  8. Dorian Thompson

    Dorian Thompson Admiral Admiral

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    Is it me or is Sylar's story becoming a total snooze? He can only emote in a sinister monologue for so long. The man's an island.

    Claire didn't make me want to strangle her for once. That was a welcome change of pace; Sandra was beyond awesome. I think I actually...enjoyed parts of this episode. That's a nice change of pace. Mr. Muggles coming up with that HUGE sandwich of appeasement was LOL funny.

    Peter wasn't completely stupid, also a nice change of pace. Finally a reversal of the hug of power. Score one point for Peter for refusing to trust Nathan. Nathan, Nathan, Nathan, how naive can you be? He must be a Republican to have believed that detention camps would be a useful tactic. It only makes enemies of the innocent, and WHY HASN'T ANYONE OUTED NATHAN AS SOMEONE WHO CAN FLY??????? :scream: :scream:

    Also, why is it a rule that everyone young shirtless man on television must shave his chest? Dammit, I like a hairy chest on a man. Better not get rid of Sylar yet, I guess. Nathan has a bit of a hairy chest, too, but he hasn't been shirtless since season one. He's only useful for the pretty, so he may as well get naked more often.
     
  9. hyzmarca

    hyzmarca Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    They've hit the point where they're afraid to kill people.

    Season 1 was Anyone Can Die. Season 2 was Anyone Can Die but we'll Always Bring Them Back to Lie. Villains was Only Minor Characters and Takeo Kensei can die. Now, we've got Mooks and Redshirt Can Die But Only If They Fight Sylar.

    I think that the switch between the original premise of a constantly rotating cast to their current core cast approach really took something away from the whole show. They've fallen into creative cowardice, not wanting to alter the core dynamic of the show, and that's impacting quality, it has been for a while. While they're getting back on track with the writing, the cowardice remains and the characters are becoming static.

    Currently, the only interesting characters are Angela, HRG, and Sylar, becuase they're the only dynamic characters. The others are just stuck in a rutt, existing but never actually doing anything. Nathan is close to being interesting, but doesn't quite make it this volume.

    The apparent revelation about Sylar's father is a bit meh. Really. I'd expecting something more subtle and interesting, not something that's been done a thousand times before.

    Currently, Heroes can be brought back onto the rails, but that requires major changes to the core characters, higher stunt and SFX budgets, the big disposable casts of Season 1, less prophesy, logical conflicts, logical actions, logical consequences, and more follow-through.
     
  10. Dorian Thompson

    Dorian Thompson Admiral Admiral

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    I wouldn't count on that higher budget too much. With last week's season low of under 7 million viewers, NBC isn't about to give the hugely expensive Heroes a budget increase.

    Yeah, Nathan's almost interesting, but they'll never go too far with him or with anyone not named Sylar for that matter. They could kill off Hiro and Mohinder to trim the dead weight....but they won't. If I were in charge of cast changes, I'd trim it down to a core cast of Angela, Nathan, HRG, Sandra, Peter, and Tracy. Maybe bring back Micah. Get rid of everyone else.
     
  11. firehawk12

    firehawk12 Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    So, is this the point where Fuller is supposed to have taken over the show?
    Anyway, pretty bland episode. Will Parkman die? Probably not... if they didn't even want to kill Daphne. So what's the point?
     
  12. Alidar Jarok

    Alidar Jarok Everything in moderation but moderation Moderator

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    Yeah, that honestly felt underwhelming to me as well.

    Black and white flashback with a song appropriate for the time period? I thought I was watching an episode of Cold Case ;)

    That at least tends to make sense for him. I never expecting him to let his brother die.

    Honestly, I was talking during the quiet moments because they weren't interesting. I predicted that pool scene for about two episodes. That being said, she can't drown either, so it wasn't exactly necessary. He could also just live in a pool. He doesn't need to surface and it would be a good hiding space.

    I'm giving the new writer taking over in Heroes a chance before I give up on the show. But there needs to be a noticeable turnaround.

    And where the hell is Hiro?
     
  13. Jaron

    Jaron Captain Captain

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    Shh! If we don't mention him, maybe the writers will forget about him. And if the writers forget about him, we don't need to see him go to France to stop a birthday party or whatever his next sidequest is.
     
  14. hyzmarca

    hyzmarca Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    Hiro and Mohinder were originally great audience perspective characters, though for very different reasons. With Hiro, we got to see the classic hero's journey and experience with fresh eyes, eyes tinted by the pop culture that we ourselves grew up with. With Mohinder, we got to see the world of superpowers from the perspective of a mortal outsider like ourselves.

    And then they dropped the ball, because, ultimately, they had no clue what to do with either of them. Hiro's journey should have taken him from naive child to responsible adult, but they arrested that journey because they felt that naive sold better. Thus, he remains childlike in ways that he should not be. Mohinder, should have been the Professor X of the story, continuing his father's work and providing an alternative to The Company. Instead, they turned him into Spiderman.
     
  15. Dorian Thompson

    Dorian Thompson Admiral Admiral

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    They didn't turn him into spiderman. They turned him into someone with the intelligence quotient of Rihanna. Get screwed over by the company and get beaten up? Go back for more. :p
     
  16. firehawk12

    firehawk12 Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    Remember when Hiro was supposed to be some kind of badass ninja with contact lenses?

    Season 1 was so long ago...
     
  17. Psion

    Psion Commodore Commodore

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    Has there been any discussion about "Rebel" in previous threads. I smacked my forehead tonight and said, "Rebel is Micah!"

    Of course, I smack my forehead and say nonsensical things a lot ... I'm not sure if it's the cause or the effect.
     
  18. D Man

    D Man Commodore Commodore

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    I'm thinking it's either Micah or the wireless wizard woman from season 1 who disappeared without explanation (yes I know she was in the webcomics. ;)) Micah is probably more likely, be he's just so BORING that I'd rather it be the wireless chick.
     
  19. hyzmarca

    hyzmarca Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    Wireless woman was dead. Now, she's deader than dead and has been for some time.
     
  20. startrekwatcher

    startrekwatcher Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    I'm of the opinion that character deaths should be used sparingly for greater dramatic impact. Sure in season one they killed off a lot of characters--Eden, Thompson, Ted--but it didn't carry the weight of a major character death since these characters for the most part were plot devices.

    In fact, you run the risk of turning it into a cliche as you try to find out who is going to die next and it becomes predictable. BSG has fallen into this trap terribly to the point when a character dies it is routine and you reach a point where you are desensitized to the whole thing.
    The only thing I liked about the huge cast in season one is it gave the series an epic feel with all these different characters with a wide range of character reactions & perspectives--not so much for the possibility of a death.
    I think the biggest problem for the series is the lack of a creative vision and that is what is hindering the writing.

    If the show wanted to continue the style of season one with tons of characters, lots of interconnected stories, an emphasis on mystery and keeping their cards close so as to keep the audience constantly confused as to what was going on that's fine. It worked because the show was interesting, fast paced, all the threads were engaging, the writers were creative, the mysteries were intriguing.

    I can also understand if they wanted to step back and attempt to adopt a more traditional drama style that was less LOST-influenced and more conventional that most viewers were accustomed to before LOST's unique style came around--more modest ensemble, fewer arcs to allow for more depth on the few they do focus on, less jumping around chronologically within the storyline etc.

    The problem has been the writers seemed to not have thought through the story. In the truest sense it is serialized but the episodes feel less like interesting links in a narrative chain and more like situations of the week--Hiro/Ando in India, Claire helping Alex, Noah gets kidnapped etc.

    And without the interesting backdrop of season one, the characters on their own simply aren't interesting. Perhaps Kring rightfully realized that this when he initially advocated changing out casts each season and bringing in a new group. Perhaps he had created them to be as interesting as they were for a limited time and they had served their purpose when volume one concluded. And so without interesting plots or interesting characters there is nothing left. I mean the character scenes are lacking, the plots are anemic. Successful arcs build on what has come before and build into something that is guiding it the whole time. Here it feels like it is just stumbling from week to week. There is no story anchoring the characters that is meticulously developed in interesting directions. No, they simply jump from one scenario to the next and the writers hope in a vacuum it is sufficiently interesting and for the most part they really aren't.

    When you bring in new characters for the volume you are suppose to bring them in to shake up the dynamics for the preexisting characters but Alex or the Hunter have yet to do that in my opinion.

    The idea itself for Fugitives is interesting but it just isn't being implemented in an interesting way. This reminds me of ENT's season two where it isn't bad and certainly isn't unwatchable just exceedingly bland. Maybe Fuller can turn it around but I've read interviews and he had high praise for these last few episodes which makes me wonder.
    SFX budget isn't the problem. The show needs better writing but there comes a point where not much can be done to save a show when it has really turned off a viewer.