Frank Miller completely loses the plot

Discussion in 'TV & Media' started by Captaindemotion, Nov 15, 2011.

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  1. stj

    stj Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    The notion that at the end Che was presiding over the executions of "hundreds" of political prisoners sounds like mad dog right wing propaganda. A quick glance at the Wikipedia page cites Amnesty International as estimating less than three hundred political executions up til 1987! Long after Che left the Cuban government I might add. The number of executions taking place within the revolutionary period is unknown but not at all the "end," falsifying the implication of inevitable development of Communist tyranny.

    The general quality of the gusano writing on Cuba is illustrated by the claim that some Cuban is the political prisoner held the longest worldwide, at thirty years. I would nominate Leonard Peltier myself. The rebuttal from the right winger (overt or crypto,) would of course be, but Peltier is not a political prisoner! But, then, is everyone really a political prisoner the gusanos say is? And how many of them are guilty of things that would be illegal under pretty much any legal system? And how does this compare to the murders by Colombian death squads and Mexican federales who are being supported by the US government?

    Equating bin Laden and Che is a fine, fine example of Newspeak, proving that worshipping the thuggish Orwell damages your mind.
     
  2. Davros

    Davros Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    That would still make him a better person than not only Bin Laden but the dictator Batista who he helped overthrow and many of the other despots we have supported.
     
  3. the G-man

    the G-man Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Yeah, people need to get over idea that their politics require them to turn a blind eye to what a bastard Che (and Castro for that matter) was.

    Even if you believe that their predecessors were bad guys too and even if you support a more socialist style of government, that doesn't require you to blindly support these two, any more than aversion to bigotry against Islam requires you to support Bin Laden.
     
  4. Davros

    Davros Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    :rolleyes:I never claimed Che was a saint or even a nice guy, just that he wasn't as bad as Bin Laden or Batista. Learn the difference.
     
  5. the G-man

    the G-man Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    True, he was unable to kill as many people as Bin Laden but not really for lack of trying. More for lack of opportunity.
     
  6. Davros

    Davros Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    No, more of a lack of trying.
     
  7. Sci

    Sci Admiral Admiral

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    Whether or not you think Che or bin Ladin are guilty of equivalent crimes, the basic principle -- that people who did horrible things or fought for oppressive causes can later be lionized as somehow good or heroic by subsequent political movements -- remains an apt comparison. The question is not "Was Che as bad as bin Ladin?" The question was, "Did Che commit atrocities or fight for an oppressive cause, and was that fact later whitewashed to create a heroic image?" The answer is yes, and yes -- just as happened with Guy Fawkes and the same could, in theory, happen with bin Ladin.
     
  8. stj

    stj Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    ^^^And Frank Miller sees Occupy Wall Street as fighting for an oppressive cause. He displays every bit as much logic in thinking so as you do in seeing Che's cause as oppressive because the simple truth is that you both share much of the same reasoning behing your antiCommunism. In fact, he's ahead of you, being much more consistent. Communism in Cuba after the revolution has been much less violent than ordinary capitalist business as usual in the rest of Latin America and the Caribbean. What you're really saying is that you approve of the Tonton Macoutes and Colombian death squads.
     
  9. Sci

    Sci Admiral Admiral

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    [​IMG]

    Condemning one system's abuses is not the same thing as condoning its rival's abuses. Believe it or not, it's not an "either-or" choice. I'm perfectly happy to condemn communism and capitalism.
     
  10. the G-man

    the G-man Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    In fact, to play devil's advocate, one could legitimately argue that Bin Laden is actually more admirable than Che.

    Bin Laden, to borrow an argument some have made, saw himself as a freedom fighter attacking an outside enemy (western society) attempting to subjugate the Muslim world. He was attacking an invader, that argument goes.

    Che was killing his own people, largely in an attempt to suppress opposition.

    But Che looks better on a t-shirt so I guess he's more "moral" ;)
     
  11. the G-man

    the G-man Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Greenwich Village couple busted with cache of weapons, bombmaking explosives: The privileged daughter of a prominent city doctor, and her boyfriend — a Harvard grad and Occupy Wall Street activist — have been busted for allegedly having a cache of weapons and a bombmaking explosive in their Greenwich Village apartment.
     
  12. Captaindemotion

    Captaindemotion Vice Admiral Admiral

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  13. Alidar Jarok

    Alidar Jarok Everything in moderation but moderation Moderator

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    You bumped a year old thread to quote a post quoting yourself?
     
  14. Captaindemotion

    Captaindemotion Vice Admiral Admiral

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    ^You mean The G-Man rather than me, right?!
     
  15. Alidar Jarok

    Alidar Jarok Everything in moderation but moderation Moderator

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    Yeah, the guy who bumped the thread. When it's two posts above, I don't usually see it as necessary to explicitly refer to someone because it should be clear from the context.
     
  16. sidious618

    sidious618 Admiral Admiral

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    It's kinda sad to bump a thread a year later to try and win an internet argument.
     
  17. cultcross

    cultcross Janitor of the Mind Palace Moderator

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    This is a thread necro of impressive proportions and what's more has nothing to do with TV/M anymore. Occupy Wall Street is for TNZ. Closed.
     
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