Frank Miller completely loses the plot

Discussion in 'TV & Media' started by Captaindemotion, Nov 15, 2011.

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  1. Sci

    Sci Admiral Admiral

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    Again, they don't have to clearly state any one agenda. By simply changing the moral framework by which we talk about and understand how an economy ought to function, they're changing people's expectations, people's ideas about what the government ought to do.

    And that's already happening. Wealth disparity in America has become a much bigger topic of conversation in the national media in the two months since OWS happened.

    And, frankly, the Occupy movement is much bigger than the Tea Party. I'm sorry, but the Tea Party never had thousands of people demonstrating in 18 major cities simultaneously. This movement is already huge, and it's only going to get bigger the more local governments try to shut it down.

    Sorta-kinda. The Tea Party began as something similar to Occupy -- leaderless, without a common agenda. A lot of Tea Party groups got co-opted by establishment right-wing figures -- e.g., Dick Armey and his FreedomWorks group, the Koch brothers and their Americans for Prosperity group -- but the Tea Party still doesn't have any one single "agenda." Less government spending is very common, but we've already seen a lot of initial Tea Party supporters back away upon realizing how extreme the candidates they elected were. Witness the backlash against Ohio Governor John Kasich and Wisconsin Governor Scott Walker.

    But you don't have to have a clearly-defined policy agenda to affect change. Change can be the natural result of just working to change people's concepts and expectations of what government and economy ought to do for us. You don't have to demand a higher tax rate on the rich if you convince millions of people that there's something wrong with a scenario where millions of Americans are kicked out of their homes while Wall Street fat cats who scammed the rest of the country are high on the hog.

    ETA:

    The Guardian takes an interesting look at the politics of Frank Miller's comic book work, and at other artists' reactions to his statements.

    Meanwhile, author David Brin has responded by writing a critique of what he views as Miller's anti-democratic messages, as exemplified in his graphic novel 300.

     
    Last edited: Nov 16, 2011
  2. Robert Maxwell

    Robert Maxwell so far this is a dumb future Premium Member

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    Well, of course. Frank Miller's number one concern is killing them scary Muslims.
     
  3. Distorted Humor

    Distorted Humor Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    I always enjoyed David Brin's comments on the morality of some popular Science Fiction or fantasy. He also wrote a great bit on Star Wars.

    Funny enough, I enjoy Orson Scott Card's writing a lot, but always shake my head on his political stuff. (Comon Card, as a fellow North Carolinian and Mormon, you can do better then that.) I have never been able to finish a Brin Novel, but love his essays.

    As for the OWS folks, I am glad they care, even if I want to throw shoes at them for some things. (For example, some want to forgive student loans, but it not anyone fault but your own that you went to a expensive, private college and didn't get a degree that paid well. I for example went to a "lesser" public university so I would have debts in the 20k-30k range, and not the 100k-150k range that I would of been dealing with if I went to the private colleges I was accepted to. But I will stop my rant.)
     
  4. ColeMercury

    ColeMercury Lieutenant Commander Red Shirt

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    Wow. That was an... evisceration. That was just nasty.

    ... I love it. :techman:


    ADDENDUM: Hmm. I just looked up Miller's Wikipedia page and I notice he has never been in the military. What a pathetic chickenhawk.
     
  5. Robert Maxwell

    Robert Maxwell so far this is a dumb future Premium Member

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    It's not surprising. Active duty military who have been deployed overseas often have a broader perspective and exhibit far less xenophobia, by virtue of having been exposed to other cultures much more extensively.

    Some twit who thinks all the land outside the borders of the US is dominated by lawless barbarism is usually too dim, too unstable, and too cowardly to ever sign up.
     
  6. siskokid888

    siskokid888 Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    What is it with guys name Miller? First Dennis Miller, then this knucklehead. I guess if your name is Miller you get real fraidy scared of the big bad muslim menace.
     
  7. Robert Maxwell

    Robert Maxwell so far this is a dumb future Premium Member

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    I don't think two guys really makes a trend.
     
  8. siskokid888

    siskokid888 Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    Sarcasm, sir, pointed at the 2 individuals named. No generalization intended. ;)
     
  9. xortex

    xortex Commodore

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    I guess one of the dangers of being a sci-fi writer like Brin is that you can no longer distinguish between reality and fantasy. Something obviously neccesary to sell your books while also ensuring that they're any good.
     
  10. Sci

    Sci Admiral Admiral

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    In what way?
     
  11. xortex

    xortex Commodore

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    He's equating the 300 with an historical documentary when it is a work of fiction. Hence believing things like Salieri killed Mozart and things like that when they're not true.
     
  12. Sci

    Sci Admiral Admiral

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    No he is not. He is criticizing it for being a historically inaccurate work of fiction that selectively uses its inaccuracies in order to advocate a philosophy that is anti-democratic.
     
  13. RJDiogenes

    RJDiogenes Idealistic Cynic and Canon Champion Premium Member

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    Re: The "Occupy" fad: They don't make Hippies like they used to.

    Re: Frank Miller: Poor sap went batshit crazy a long time ago.
     
  14. Trekker4747

    Trekker4747 Boldly going... Premium Member

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    :snerk:
     
  15. xortex

    xortex Commodore

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    The man is being delusional. Noone should equate or confuse a work of fiction with reality and real history.
    The violence didn't bother him at all though. :guffaw:
     
  16. Sci

    Sci Admiral Admiral

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    He is not confusing or equating a work of fiction with reality and real history. He is criticizing a work of historical fiction for both being inaccurate and for using specific inaccuracies to advance an anti-democratic philosopy.
     
  17. xortex

    xortex Commodore

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    Art transcends political inclinations. Well maybe not his, but I thought the 300 was good art and didn't care if Unitus was a republican or not along with 99.99 percent of other people too. It's just insane to think otherwise.
     
  18. Hound of UIster

    Hound of UIster Vice Admiral Admiral

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    300 was an interesting comic in how it used two page spreads exclusively to tell the story.

    But it certainly isn't art in any ways.

    And I thought Batman and the Outsiders Special did a much more effective job with the use of two page spreads and integrating writing with art.
     
  19. Sci

    Sci Admiral Admiral

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    None of that is relevant to the argument that a work of historic fiction should not portray history dishonestly in order to advance an anti-democratic philosophy.

    Of course it was art. It just wasn't good art.
     
  20. xortex

    xortex Commodore

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    Did you see the part where the guy got his head choped off? That guy must have been a democrate.
     
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