ELEMENTARY - News, Reviews, and Discussion

Discussion in 'TV & Media' started by Allyn Gibson, Jan 13, 2013.

  1. Aldo

    Aldo Admiral Admiral

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    They were on really fast horses.
     
  2. sojourner

    sojourner Admiral Admiral

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    House lived at 221B Baker St., just not in London.
     
  3. Gov Kodos

    Gov Kodos Admiral Admiral

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    And he took that left turn at Albuquerque.
     
  4. Allyn Gibson

    Allyn Gibson Vice Admiral Admiral

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    "Poison Pen."

    I liked it. I liked Holmes' relationship with his teenage pen pal.

    But I hated the ending. Except...

    ...on consideration, I think she walks.

    Unless she plead guilty -- which her attorney would advise her strongly not to do -- I don't see how she goes away for the crime.

    She has a couple of different defense. The obvious one, "Defense of Others" as a self-defense argument. Plus, her story of the crime wouldn't hold up to examination -- she didn't have the means, only the motive and opportunity -- and even the fact that Delancey's wife was planning the very same murder would give rise to reasonable doubt.
     
  5. Christopher

    Christopher Writer Admiral

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    Quite an effective and clever episode, yes.
    I was expecting it to turn out that she really did kill the guy to protect his son.

    I was quite pleased to hear them acknowledging school bullying as a form of child abuse. I'm glad we're outgrowing the tendency to think of bullying as a normal and acceptable part of growing up -- although I wish society had figured that out soon enough to do me some good.
     
  6. Aldo

    Aldo Admiral Admiral

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    I continue to be impressed with the evolution of Watson as a character on this show. When they first started last year I expected her to be acting in her sober companion role for quite a while. See I'm used to these types of shows to keep their characters in a static orbit for quite a long time.

    So to see her grow as a character like this is really endearing me to the show quite a bit.

    And was it just me, or is Watson writing about Holmes a nod to the books and how they were told from "his" perspective?
     
  7. Christopher

    Christopher Writer Admiral

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    No doubt. I was wondering if they'd ever get around to that. (Sherlock updates it by having Watson be a blogger.)
     
  8. Tom Hendricks

    Tom Hendricks You move! Premium Member

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    I agree about Watson's growth, really making her a well rounded character. However the biggest part of this is Lucy Liu's growth as an actor. She is so fantastic in this, she's able to keep up and hold her own with Johnny Lee Miller.
     
  9. lurok

    lurok Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Really enjoyed last two episodes. Nice to see Watson grow as a character. But what really struck/impressed me in Poison Pen was Miller's acting, especially in the two-hander scenes with the 'poisoner'.
     
  10. Spot's Meow

    Spot's Meow Spot's Meow Premium Member

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    Oh shit y'all! Did you see tonight's episode? Things got interesting towards the end there...
     
  11. Tom Hendricks

    Tom Hendricks You move! Premium Member

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    Just about to watch it, I'll get back to you after I do.

    ETA: So just watched it, one of the best episodes yet. I so enjoy Johnny Lee Miller in this. His impassioned speech about needing his support system, his evolution because of Watson, the Captain and Detective Bell was very powerful.

    Now to get to what you inferred, a very interesting turn with Mycroft. I hope it's not as sinister as implied but I guess we'll see. I have really enjoyed Rhys Ifan and hope these developments means we'll see him more.
     
    Last edited: Nov 15, 2013
  12. Allyn Gibson

    Allyn Gibson Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Here's what I wrote about that on Facebook and a Sherlock Holmes mailing list this morning:

     
  13. cardinal biggles

    cardinal biggles Happy Little Tree Premium Member

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    I like your theory, Allyn.
     
  14. stj

    stj Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    ^^^Ditto. Also, if Mycroft was acting from base motives, talking Daddy into cutting Sherlock off for real probably wouldn't be too hard, would it?
     
  15. Christopher

    Christopher Writer Admiral

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    Two things:

    1) We know from a text message we saw last season that Daddy Holmes's first initial is M.

    2) Several episodes have featured Holmes taking on cases that weren't initially homicides, such as a kidnapping and an impossible heist, and he's also taken on cases for people other than the police, like when he was hired to track down the guy who leaked the government secrets. However, all those cases eventually ended up involving homicides in one way or another.
     
  16. Allyn Gibson

    Allyn Gibson Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Honestly, I was aware of that. In the absence of a known name, though, I'm falling back on old habits, hence Siger. :)

    All true. It seems at times that the non-homicide crime gets short shrift in Elementary. I want to see Holmes track down lost kittens! I want to see Holmes bust up a secret society of mimes!

    Okay, I meant that last one as a joke, but now that I think about it, that sounds awesome. :)

    The former, by the way, is something Holmes did in a radio play Dorothy Sayers wrote starring her Lord Peter Wimsey. As a child, Lord Peter lost his kitten, and he hired Sherlock Holmes to find it. So I guess Holmes is canonical to Lord Peter. :)
     
  17. Spot's Meow

    Spot's Meow Spot's Meow Premium Member

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    Keep in mind that I write from the perspective of someone who has had very little experience with Sherlock Holmes stories in the past and knows next to nothing about the canon Mycroft.

    In Elementary, I haven't liked Mycroft as a character, mostly because he's kind of boring and he just gets in the way of the Holmes and Watson relationship. And I'm not picking up on any chemistry at ALL between him and Watson, so it's strange to think that there's some sort of sexual attraction there.

    After this past episode, I am liking Mycroft more. He just got interesting! I hope that he IS evil, I think that would be awesome. The phone conversation could have meant so many things, but what I initially took away from it, especially due to the comment that Sherlock hasn't seen or spoken to his father in years, was that Mycroft was planning to murder their father, or in fact already had (and had been acting as him when hiring Watson/sending messages). Thinking back on the scene later, this is just one of many possibilities and it might not even be the best one, but for some reason that was the first idea that struck me.

    Also, when Mycroft tore up the letter, I detected a hint of jealousy in his facial expression. A sort of mix of anger, envy, and disgust. Which makes me think that Mycroft would be very unhappy about the idea of Sherlock having a better relationship with their father. And that he possibly hates their father enough to kill him.

    Perhaps he wanted to lure Sherlock to London to frame him for the murder?
     
  18. Allyn Gibson

    Allyn Gibson Vice Admiral Admiral

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    In the Canon, Mycroft is Sherlock's older brother (by seven years, I believe). He is a corpulent man who essentially lives (and sometimes works) at the Diogenes Club in Pall Mall. He's described as a minor government clerk, but he's shown to be far more important to the Empire than mere clerk. He is smarter and more observant than Sherlock; unfortunately, he's also lazy and only goes out to travel between the Diogenes and his office. The world is burning down if Mycroft goes somewhere, anywhere else.

    There's some question about whether or not Mycroft is Nero Wolfe's father, but that has no bearing here. :)

    With that description, you can see why I haven't been drawn to Elementary's Mycroft. He's not a public servant. He travels. He's not observant, and he seems outclassed mentally by Sherlock.

    And, yes, I know I'm trying to fit Ifans' Mycroft into a Canon-shaped mold that he may not be suited for. The only thing I ask is that he not be evil. I don't know that I could handle that.
     
  19. Christopher

    Christopher Writer Admiral

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    It occurs to me that in some ways, this version of Sherlock Holmes was more like the original in the past but has now grown beyond it -- he used to be a consulting detective in London and dabbled in drug use, but then the drugs got out of hand and now he's gone through rehab and started a new life and has reformed some of his old ways, at least to an extent. Mycroft seems to be portrayed similarly -- he used to be fat and lazy, according to Sherlock, but now he's remade himself. So these Holmes brothers are like an evolution beyond the canonical ones, in a sense. So the characteristics they had in the canon inform them without limiting them.
     
  20. Aragorn

    Aragorn Admiral Admiral

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    So how many TV shows has William Sadler died on this month? :lol: