ELEMENTARY - News, Reviews, and Discussion

Discussion in 'TV & Media' started by Allyn Gibson, Jan 13, 2013.

  1. throwback

    throwback Captain Captain

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  2. Keith1701

    Keith1701 Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    I just started watching ELEMENTARY this season, and what I have seen so far is very good and enjoyable.
     
  3. sojourner

    sojourner Admiral Admiral

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    ^You didn't miss much in the previous season.
     
  4. Saul

    Saul Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    That last episode was set up in a way where I could figure out who did it early on.

    Why didn't Holmes explore that first which would have taken the audience off that lead. tut tut.
     
  5. Allyn Gibson

    Allyn Gibson Vice Admiral Admiral

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    I did not read that line that way at all. Rather, I was reminded of this passage from The Hound of the Baskervilles:
    I think Holmes, at this point in his relationship with Watson, is beginning to recognize that she is his conductor of light but it's still so early that he can't put it into words.

    That's how I read the scene, anyway. :)
     
  6. Christopher

    Christopher Writer Admiral

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    ^I hope you're right. On another BBS I'm on, a couple of the regulars are talking about a Holmes-Watson romance as if it's inevitable -- somehow forgetting all the shows out there, including several other CBS series, where the male and female leads have platonic relationships.
     
  7. Spot's Meow

    Spot's Meow Vice Admiral Premium Member

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    I also didn't pick up on any romance or sexual tension in the scene. I interpreted their awkward glance at the end of the conversation as a result of Sherlock's reluctance to emotionally connect with others. It's like he wants to say "I care about you" but just doesn't know how. I thought it was telling that he was only able to express himself to Watson when her back was turned. As soon as she turned around, he looked away uncomfortably.
     
  8. Allyn Gibson

    Allyn Gibson Vice Admiral Admiral

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    The problem with calling a Holmes/Watson romance "inevitable" is that it's pretty clear by now that Watson isn't Holmes' "type." She doesn't strike me as someone who would be into the rough, kinky sex that Holmes enjoys, and he's direct with women he finds attractive. Judging by the evidence we've had thus far, Holmes wants nothing more than a professional relationship with Watson.
     
  9. lurok

    lurok Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Been binge-watching this while on the road and just got to the M ep 12 (Vinnie Jones? wha? :)). Plots are predictable but I love how unpretentious it is: no artsy directing gimmicks or narrative tricks. Just great acting and dialogue and nice use of NY locations. Looking forward to second half of first season. Dying to know who Moriarty is and when appears. Would be nice touch if made female. I adore the old Billy Wilder Private Life Of SH movie which, if remember correctly, had a female antagonist?
     
  10. davejames

    davejames Vice Admiral Admiral

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    I can sense a hint of physical attraction between the two (with Lucy it would be hard not to), but I agree they don't seem like they'd be that great a couple, and I have no interest whatsoever in seeing them together.


    And I have to say I'm kinda surprised at the recent change from Watson being Sherlock's sober companion to now being a "junior detective." Clearly it was in the plans all along, but it does seem like a pretty big shift in the show's concept.

    Although I have to admit, it is nice seeing her take some actual joy and enthusiasm in the work now, instead of being so dour all the time like before.
     
  11. Christopher

    Christopher Writer Admiral

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    Well, they've been setting it up for quite a while, so it's hardly out of nowhere. We learned some time ago that the companion gig was supposed to be temporary. We had a whole arc of Holmes being impressed by her potential as a detective and encouraging her to embrace it. We had 2-3 weeks of people telling Joan she seemed happier with the detective stuff than with the companion stuff, and Joan resisting it. And once M. Holmes terminated her employment and she stuck around anyway, it was clear that that would be a temporary situation and something would have to change.

    So not so much a recent big shift as the culmination of a process that's been building up for months.
     
  12. Allyn Gibson

    Allyn Gibson Vice Admiral Admiral

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    I liked a lot of last night's episode, but overall I didn't like it.

    I really liked seeing Joan be a detective. I thought her case was interesting.

    Holmes' case was also interesting.

    Where I think last night's episode failed, however, was in that it didn't play fair with the audience. I had a hunch that the two cases would be connected -- because that's the simplest narrative solution -- but I kept hoping that they would simply be two unrelated cases because it wasn't giving us any reason to link them beyond the video. And then, it didn't give us any clue as to how the solution would work; Joan wasn't trying to find details on the wife's first disappearance, she was sure the wife was actually dead so she wasn't trying to find the wife anymore but instead prove that the husband had murdered her, it wasn't until late that we discovered that the husband resembled the subway pusher at all, etc. In short, there were more rabbits being pulled out of the hat than usual last night.

    I wanted the cases to be separate. Alas.
     
  13. Christopher

    Christopher Writer Admiral

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    Well, that was fun. Watson's first case! And it was a pretty clever mystery -- I didn't figure it out until they started explaining it in the interrogation room. My working theory for why the husband killed the woman on the subway was that Callie left him for her the first time. I thought they couldn't find a connection between him and the victim because the connection was to Callie instead, that she'd had an affair with the woman and he was taking revenge. But the actual explanation was very clever.

    I particularly liked how in the interrogation room, when Watson was telling the guy what had really happened, she was basically imitating Holmes. For a moment there, Liu came close to capturing Miller's delivery. ...Although come to think of it, I'd rather not see that become the norm. Watson should be distinct from Holmes, a complement to him, not an echo. So it was fun to see from both a character standpoint and a performance standpoint, but I don't want to see it become a regular thing.
     
  14. Allyn Gibson

    Allyn Gibson Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Now, that would have been really interesting.

    I thought the connection, though I couldn't figure out how it would have worked, was that Callie and the subway woman were actually the same person.
     
  15. cardinal biggles

    cardinal biggles HHHHIIIIIIIIIIII... Premium Member

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    But then wouldn't they have just identified Callie as the subway woman? Or if subway woman was leading a double life as Callie, wouldn't Callie's husband have come forward and said "Oh, wait, but she's my wife"?

    I actually thought that since they were the same "type" — white female, dark hair, roughly mid-to-late-30s, similar build — would have played into it, but apparently not.
     
  16. Christopher

    Christopher Writer Admiral

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    Yeah, they were a broadly similar type, but clearly different women -- the subway victim was a lot more beautiful, IMHO. I'm generally not that great with faces, but I had no trouble seeing they were different people.

    Besides, the plot depended on Callie not disappearing until some days after the subway incident. If she'd disappeared at the same time, that would've instantly thrown suspicion on her breakup video, because it wouldn't have fit the timeline. So they had to be two different people.
     
  17. sojourner

    sojourner Admiral Admiral

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    I actually went with the obvious approach. Callie was leaving him because she found out about the murder. Thinking maybe he was a serial killer and she had become wary of why he was gone at odd times. Followed him, witnessed the latest killing, then to cover her knowledge of it, she tries to pull her usual disappearing act.
     
  18. Christopher

    Christopher Writer Admiral

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    Yeah, I did wonder why none of the characters thought of that as a possible connection between the murder and Callie leaving him a few days later. That was actually my first thought. But it raised the question of why she wouldn't have gone to the police, why she'd leave him for committing murder but still help cover up what he did. Maybe that's why they didn't consider it.
     
  19. Nerys Myk

    Nerys Myk Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    I was thinking it might be a quid pro quo situation. I kill your wife and you kill mine.
     
  20. Christopher

    Christopher Writer Admiral

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    Strangers on a Subway Train?
     

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