DTI: Forgotten History by C. L. Bennett Review Thread (Spoilers!)

Discussion in 'Trek Literature' started by Sho, Apr 15, 2012.

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Rate Forgotten History.

  1. Outstanding

    56 vote(s)
    50.9%
  2. Above Average

    39 vote(s)
    35.5%
  3. Average

    10 vote(s)
    9.1%
  4. Below Average

    3 vote(s)
    2.7%
  5. Poor

    2 vote(s)
    1.8%
  1. RPJOB

    RPJOB Commander Red Shirt

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    Apr 11, 2012
    It's true that Spock might consider what did as murder no competent court would convict him. In the eyes of the law he did nothing wrong. Seeing as he had just emerged from Plak Tow and thought he had killed Kirk, his opinions would be suspect at best. His emotional reaction to seeing Kirk alive also shows that he was not in his usual mental state. He might have presented himself at a Starbase but, assuming the JAG office is doing their job, no charges would be filed. He wouldn't offer a defence because none would be necessary. He may feel guilt for killing Kirk but he had no reason to consider it murder.
     
  2. CommodoreNero

    CommodoreNero Captain Captain

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    Bought, read and enjoyed as always, Christopher, thank you!

    Any more DTI novels on the horizon? I'd love to see more from Jena Noi and Ducane. Oh, and totally aside, may I ask why you wrote Ducane so adversarially (Not a word, but go with me) in WTC?
     
  3. Christopher

    Christopher Writer Admiral

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    Not at the moment. I did two in a row and I'd like to try something else. And doing a third would probably be predicated on strong sales for the second, so it's too early to tell if it'll even be an option.

    It's a perfectly valid word. As for Ducane, I was just going with what Voyager showed about the policies of the Temporal Integrity Commission. In "Future's End," they were willing to destroy an entire starship based on an unproven suspicion that it was the cause of a disaster -- not even bothering to investigate first, just charging in guns blazing. And in "Relativity," Ducane arrested the "present" version of Braxton for the crimes of his future self -- punishing a completely innocent man for something he not only hadn't conceived of doing yet, but would be prevented from ever doing at all. That's horrifically unethical, a profound violation of the most fundamental principles of justice. Those told me that the Federation of the TIC's era had lost track of its core values and become a more oppressive state.

    Besides, Ducane was just kind of smarmy. There was something shifty and mean about him, and in the context of the above, it made sense to play that up.

    Even aside from all that, I think it was a good idea just for variety's sake. It wouldn't have been as interesting if all the uptime agents were nice people with compatible agendas. It was more fun to have the agents from different eras constantly bickering and clashing. And it was worth touching on the idea that societies sometimes lose touch with their ideals and go through dark periods. We can't assume the Federation will remain benevolent forever.
     
  4. Hartzilla2007

    Hartzilla2007 Vice Admiral Admiral

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    To be fair that was likely "the Sol system was just destroyed/possibly traumatized from it" Braxton. when the other version showed up he didn't seem that bad.
     
  5. Christopher

    Christopher Writer Admiral

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    I'm speaking of the overall impression that I formed from both episodes. If it had just been "Future's End" by itself, that rationalization could work, but if you take that together with what Ducane did in "Relativity," it suggests a pattern of "guilty until proven innocent" thinking. And I wanted to explore the implications of that possibility.
     
  6. BrotherBenny

    BrotherBenny Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Bought it. Read it. Enjoyed it.

    The CLB Trifecta.

    I love how you made the book feel, to me, like a TNG era, TMP era, MyrU novel all in one and keeping it all cohesive. I loved every aspect of the book, from Lucsly giving Kirk the means to save the future history (pre-destination paradox?) to the Klingon-Andorian Compact and T'Pring finding the Kir'Shara, from the timeships themselves to founding of the DTI.

    Everything gelled for me, and I agree with others' sentiments that a third DTI novel would be nice, but when the time is right (no pun intended).

    I would also like to see another return to the TMP era or Titan.
     
  7. JoeZhang

    JoeZhang Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Didn't someone once write a book that touched upon this idea more explicitly? Where the TOS Crew find out that the Federation becomes a fascist state.

    Em... Crossroad?
     
  8. RTOlson

    RTOlson Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Not to be crude about it, but I'm sure fanfic authors have analyzed Spock's pon farrs countless times from a myriad of angles. ;) IDIC.

    I've read the book twice now and enjoyed it. Personally, it didn't have quite the same zip as the first DTI novel, but it was a fun voyage tying up the temporal adventures depicted in "The Original Series." It was also nice to visit the era around the end of the primary five-year mission and "The Motion Picture."

    Thanks very much. I look forward to your next work.
     
  9. Christopher

    Christopher Writer Admiral

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    Thanks! And yes, you pegged it. I not only used this as my chance to do the TAS-focused novel I've been wanting to do and the post-TMP followup I've been wanting to do -- I also seized the opportunity to do a "stealth" Myriad Universes tale (although not the specific one I've been wanting to do).



    I believe so, and that may have been an influence on my thinking. Well, that and my general awareness of historical cycles. Not to mention that the events of the past decade in the United States make it worth reminding people that even the noblest of societies can lose touch with their ethics if they're not careful.



    But in the years since Ex Machina, as I've given thought to what I'd do if I got to continue forward from there, this particular pon farr loomed large, since it pretty much had to be within a year of TMP/ExM. That and Spock's mentoring of Saavik (which prior books had also established as taking place around this time) -- as well as what the Enterprise crew did while Spock was away for so long -- were the main story points that stood out as the most important things to address in a new post-TMP novel.
     
  10. UncleRogi

    UncleRogi Commander Red Shirt

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    T'Pring is just BEAUTIFUL!!...and both are in Pon Farr?

    Spock learned something from Jim...SHOOT first, then ask questions! :vulcan: :p
     
  11. Stoek

    Stoek Commander Red Shirt

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    Overall I enjoyed the book very much. I will admit that I was expecting a bit more of a presence from the "present day" DTI members, but I certainly did not feel the book was lacking in anyway. I am especially something of a Geek for books that fill in blanks in Trek history or connect dots. Seeing the mission to the past that led to them meeting with Gary 7 as a logical outgrowth of their previous accidental trip was one of those lovely "Well of course, why didn't I think of it before" moments.

    There was one thing that I found a little disturbing personally...

    While I certain appreciate the value of mythology Lucsly seems to go beyond merely acknowledging it's value into the realm or repudiating accepting the fact that there are deeper realities that go beyond and often contradict mythology because he is unable or unwilling to deal with the inherent complexities.

    While uncertainty might be fatal in certain context for a DTI agent, too much certainty leads to fascism which in my observation is fatal for all concerned. It leads to things like walking down a row of peacefully sitting protesters and pepper spraying them. It leads to raids on the homes of citizens for the "crime" of daring to speak out against actions taken by their government that they believe to be wrong.

    My hope is that if we get a chance to see Agent Lucsly again in the future that he might be forced to confront the inherent danger in too simplistic a worldview and to realize the tragic consequences it can bring about.
     
  12. Christopher

    Christopher Writer Admiral

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    I didn't entirely agree with Lucsly's conclusions myself, but I think you're giving him too little credit, and mistaking what he tells others for what he truly believes himself. Just because he lets his fellow agents preserve the myths that motivate them to do their jobs doesn't mean he's burying his own improved understanding. And it's not as if most DTI agents would ever have any opportunity to confront Kirk directly, so it's a remote enough myth that it shouldn't really compromise any DTI agent's ability to grasp the truth about whatever situations they do find themselves dealing with.

    Besides, if even the inflexible Lucsly could change his mind about Kirk after less than an hour watching and interacting with the man, then surely other DTI agents could do the same.
     
  13. Mike Winters

    Mike Winters Lieutenant Commander Red Shirt

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    Sho,

    Not sure how old you are, but I am 33 and in my lifetime, I have no recollection of TAS ever being aired on tv, even in re-runs. Whereas all other shows are re-shown somewhere every day.

    I have seen very little of TAS. Still finding time to watch it on startrek.com.

    Mike
     
  14. Christopher

    Christopher Writer Admiral

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    Mar 15, 2001
    I discovered the animated series during its initial run on NBC, but I have caught it in syndication at various times in later years. I think the network then called The Sci-Fi Channel aired it for a while, back in the days when cable channels aired mostly reruns, although I think it was before I actually got that channel. That was rather less than 30 years ago. But it was a fair while ago.
     
  15. JoeZhang

    JoeZhang Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Jan 9, 2008
    I'm not sure it was ever shown in the UK, if it was I have no recollection of it (I'm 36).
     
  16. Dimesdan

    Dimesdan "Down with this sort of thing!" Premium Member

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    I'm eight years younger and it was shown on Saturday or Sunday mornings on BBC2 way back when.
     
  17. Therin of Andor

    Therin of Andor Admiral Admiral

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    In Australia, we got TAS first-run on Saturday mornings in glorious b/w, then several repeats "in full colour" when weekday breakfast TV really took off in the late 70s. For a long time, "Mr. Spock's Time Trek" from View-Master (21 "Yesteryear" images in 3D) was my only tangible proof that the animateds existed. Bjo Trimble's "ST Concordance" entries were highly valued.

    Western Australia got another run when video recorders had become common, and so a few people in Perth staved off our rememberings back east with grainy crosstapes of crosstapes of crosstapes.

    Then, TAS even came back to Saturday mornings in the 90s, when TNG was at its height of popularity, probably just after the dust had settled on rights ownership after the Filmation closure in 1989.
     
  18. BrotherBenny

    BrotherBenny Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    That's when I caught it too. Isn't it available on DVD/BluRay now?
     
  19. Mr. Laser Beam

    Mr. Laser Beam Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    ^ TAS is available on DVD but not Blu-Ray.

    (If there are any technical issues that would *prevent* a BR release, I'm not aware of them. I don't think any 'remastering' would be required.)
     
  20. Christopher

    Christopher Writer Admiral

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    Well, despite how the term has come to be misunderstood and abused, remastering simply means going back to the original master footage and printing directly from that for maximum quality and authenticity, rather than making a copy of a copy. Most DVD or Blu-Ray releases are digitally remastered as a matter of course these days.

    If you're talking about whether TAS has the necessary resolution for Blu-Ray, it was shot on film, which is automatically high-definition. But an HD presentation might make some of the imperfections in the artwork, scratches on the cels, etc. easier to see.
     

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