Dominion War

Discussion in 'Deep Space Nine' started by Captain Picard., Feb 21, 2013.

  1. Captain Picard.

    Captain Picard. Lieutenant Commander Red Shirt

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    Hi all DS9 fans:) I have not really seen a lot of DS9 and I am starting to watch them. I would like to know how the Dominion war started? I know it lasted for 2 years that is all. Was it political instability? I see the Klingons fighting with star fleet as well in a battle (I think it was season 4 around there):confused:
     
  2. sonak

    sonak Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Sisko didn't listen to the Dominion when they told him to tell the Federation to stop coming through the wormhole.
     
  3. DS9forever

    DS9forever Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    Dukat took Cardassia into the Dominion, giving them territory in the Alpha Quadrant.
     
  4. Pavonis

    Pavonis Commodore Commodore

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    Might be easier to read the Memory Alpha page on the Dominion War than to ask us to summarize it for you. Or just watch it unfold on TV, the way the rest of us had to back in the olden days.
     
  5. Ensign_Redshirt

    Ensign_Redshirt Commodore Commodore

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    And Dukat took Cardassia into the Dominion, because the Cardassians had been weakened by a costly war with the Klingons (and to a lesser extent, the Maquis).

    And the Klingons originally invaded the Cardassians after the Dominion had replaced General Martok with a Changeling... well, that and Gowron's overreaching political ambitions. It seems that Martok-Changeling's main purpose was to channel Gowron's ambitions into the "right" direction (from the Dominion's perspective).

    So the Founders basically manipulated the Klingons into invading Cardassia so that they could manipulate the Cardassians into joining the Dominion. The ultimate Batman Gambit.

    So much for the more general causes of the war. As for the actual casus belli: The Federation's refusal to let any more Dominion ships come through the wormhole. To paraphrase Weyoun: Either you remove those mines or we'll take this station from you and remove them ourselves. They did the latter. The Federation responded with blowing up some Dominion shipyard in Cardassian space IIRC. And thus the war had started.
     
  6. Pavonis

    Pavonis Commodore Commodore

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    I don't think the Dominion had its sights on Cardassia specifically. They just wanted to sow discord among the Alpha Quadrant empires. If the Klingons are fighting the Cardassians, and the Federation is fighting the Klingons, then they're weakening themselves, and the Dominion can come in and knock them all down more easily.

    More insidiously, the Dominion could've eventually come in as a mediator for the Alpha Quadrant powers. After a series of long wars, the Dominion could be seen as a savior for the peoples of the Alpha Quadrant. They could station some Jem'Hadar troops at key locations and force a truce among the AQ empires, then cajole them into joining the Dominion through diplomacy.
     
  7. DalekJim

    DalekJim Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    The Dominion attacking and occupying DS9 was the official start of the Dominion War.
     
  8. Ensign_Redshirt

    Ensign_Redshirt Commodore Commodore

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    Well, since the Dominion war is obviously meant as the Trek equivalent to World War II, we have to consider that appeasement could make the aggressor more aggressive.

    Had the Federation actually stopped from coming through the wormhole, the Dominion would have learnt that blowing up Bajoran colonies and Galaxy-class starships gets you what you want. If you push the Federation enough, they back down. We can't rule out the possibility that the Dominion would have invaded Federation space by the end of Season 3 instead of going the long road of getting a major AQ power like the Cardassians on your side first.
     
  9. sonak

    sonak Vice Admiral Admiral

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    appeasement is usually seen as giving an aggressor your or someone ELSE's territory in an attempt to prevent war. For all we know, encroachment into the territory beyond the wormhole really was seen as invading Dominion territory, in which case they were basically saying "stop sending ships into our territory or we'll view it as an act of war."
     
  10. Pavonis

    Pavonis Commodore Commodore

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    Seeing as it took a couple of years of travel through the wormhole before the Alpha Quadrant powers even heard of the Dominion, I'd say it's not exactly reasonable or realistic for the Dominion to count everything on "their" side of the wormhole as their territory. Clearly the GQ terminus of the wormhole doesn't open up in the Dominion's backyard. Besides, isn't there the equivalent of "freedom of the seas" with regards to interstellar travel?
     
  11. Ensign_Redshirt

    Ensign_Redshirt Commodore Commodore

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    I don't see much difference here. Nazi Germany saw Austria and Czechoslovakia as rightful German territory and the act of appeasement was to recognize that claim (strictly speaking, both the Austrian and Czech territories had indeed been part of the German Confederation until 1866).

    The Dominion saw the entirety of the Gamma Quadrant as their rightful territory and to recognize that claim would have been an act of appeasement as well. Other Gamma Quadrant species surely disagreed with Dominion's territorial claims as we had witnessed over the course of Season 2.
     
  12. HaventGotALife

    HaventGotALife Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    Well, animosity builds on both sides through the first two years of the Dominion threat. They have attacked us (Destroying New Bajor and the Odyssey,The Defiant when they go looking for the founders, the terrorist attack on Earth, Martok's changeling putting the Alpha Quadrant at war, etc), we have attacked them (Cardassian/Romulan invasion of the founders). Sisko says it best: "We're losing the peace, which means a war may be our only hope." (A Call to Arms). Cardassia is a haven for Jem'Hadar ships and supplies. The Federation isn't stopping them from bringing these supplies into the Alpha Quadrant because it would lead to war, a war that is against their nature and they might not be able to win. But governments are starting to sign up with the Dominion, become allies of the Cardassians and the Dominion in the Alpha Quadrant. The Federation could wake up one day and find themselves surrounded by governments that either aren't willing to fight with the Federation, or will actively try to conquer the Federation. It's just a matter of time. So, Sisko mines the entrance to the wormhole with the intention of starting a war and to cut off supplies for the Dominion during that war. Weyoun comes on the station and demands the mines be taken down, because, as described earlier in the show when the Klingons were mining the Bajoran border, this is an act of war. So Weyoun makes good on his threat that they would "take this station and remove the mines ourselves." After that, it's just a matter of formal declarations.
     
    Last edited: Feb 22, 2013
  13. JirinPanthosa

    JirinPanthosa Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Based on The Search, the Dominion always intended to become masters of the alpha quadrant. They hoped they could absorb the Federation the same way they absorbed Cardassia. They just wanted to do it firing as few shots as possible, and the first thing that put that in jeopardy was the mining of the wormhole.
     
  14. indolover

    indolover Fleet Captain

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    It depends. Ever since the Dominion annexed Cardassia, war was inevitable. Sisko and Starfleet knew this, hence they decided to cut their losses and mine the wormhole. They knew that the Dominion would get pissed off, but they thought "they'll attack sooner or later, so let's take our chances now".

    I never understood why Starfleet decided to abandon the station though. I know they wanted to destroy the shipyards, but it seems the first battle was a stalemate. The Dominion/Cardassians may have lost the shipyards and had no access to the wormhole but they got the station. And the Federation/Klingons lost the station but destroyed the shipyards.

    I know a war requires long-term strategy, but surely an initial conflict should attempt to strike a blow. It's like in World War II (bar the Phoney War at the start). Went on a Blitzkrieg in late 1939/early 1940 and made some key Allies surrender (like France).
     
  15. indolover

    indolover Fleet Captain

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    There was no more a "war" then than between the Federation and the Romulans.
     
  16. indolover

    indolover Fleet Captain

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    That said, I think as soon as the events in The Search concluded, Starfleet should have banned all Federation starships from the Gamma Quadrant.
     
  17. heavy lids

    heavy lids Lieutenant Commander Red Shirt

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    The Dominion are assholes and the Federation couldn't stay on their side of the wormhole. End of story.
     
  18. Jono

    Jono Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    I doubt that the Federation listening to the Dominion and stop using the wormhole would have made any difference. If the Dominion was serious about their initial threat they would have fortified the GQ end and actively stopped ships form the AQ instead of doing nothing. Plus if the Federation did stop using the wormhole it might have been years before they figured out the Founders were Changelings, if they ever did. You would think that with a longer period of secrecy that the Founders could have caused quite a bit more havoc and without implicating the Dominion.
     
  19. heavy lids

    heavy lids Lieutenant Commander Red Shirt

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    All true, I was making a facile comment. The Dominion was coming regardless of what Starfleet was doing. "What you can control, can't hurt you."
     
  20. The Regent

    The Regent Cadet Newbie

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    The biggest issue was fear and arrogance to starting that particular war.

    The Dominion's Fear: Of course most of use know what happened to The Founders in their tragic story. They want to keep anyone they can't control at arms length until they can exact that control. They had somehow known of The Federation and anticipated a formal meeting about 200 years down the road but The Wormhole threw a monkey wrench into those plans when it made travel between the two quadrants faster. That fear grew when they were caught off balance by the new forces, all with their own independent military forces, that were now on their front door.

    The Federation's Arrogance: The Dominion took then Commander Sisko captive because the Federation began to start encroaching on The Dominion's territory, I don't think that the wormhole counted at the time but the Federation was extending their reach. When Third Talak'talan of the Jem'hadar told them this and to stay out of the Dominion's territory, Dax's exact quote was "Your're making a mistake if you think detaining Commander Sisko will stop us from exploring the Gamma Quadrant." The arrogance of that line is incredibe, you have someone who just proved that he's more than you can handle since Talak'talan beamed through their shields and walked through their force field as if they were nothing in addition to not being able to even lock a tractor beam on their ship telling you to stay out of their territory and the first thing you say is no. She didn't even offer to negotiate or say we'll explore everything else. Showing some spine is one thing but was a big F you.

    If the Dominion's initial plans were able to be exacted, they may have been able to take the Alpha Quadrant without firing single shot but when the timetable got moved up, war was inevitable. Sisko just decided to to do it on their terms which is why he's my favorite Captain.