DOLLHOUSE 2x12-Hollow Men Grading, Discussion, SPOILERS

Discussion in 'Science Fiction & Fantasy' started by Captain Craig, Jan 15, 2010.

?

How do you grade HOLLOW MEN?

Poll closed Aug 3, 2010.
  1. EXCELLENT

    14 vote(s)
    42.4%
  2. ABOVE AVERAGE

    13 vote(s)
    39.4%
  3. AVERAGE

    4 vote(s)
    12.1%
  4. BELOW AVERAGE

    2 vote(s)
    6.1%
  5. POOR

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  1. Captain Craig

    Captain Craig Vice Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Dec 7, 2003
    Location:
    Nashville,TN
    [​IMG]

    [LEFT][​IMG]

    [​IMG]
    [LEFT][​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG][/LEFT]
    [/LEFT]



    [LEFT]Here we are on the eve of the final week of Dollhouse with episode 12, Hollow Men. While putting the thread together this week I noticed all the released promo pics take place in two locations. Usually the promo pics have 4-5 different shoots. It has me wondering just what all the other action is about and if they deemed it too spoilerific to release. If this episode is anything like the prior 4-6 then we should be in for another great ride.[/LEFT]



    [LEFT]Can't wait to check back in later. I've enjoyed the discussions in these threads every week.[/LEFT]


    Do you like my newest shirt?
    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Jan 15, 2010
  2. StarshipDefiant

    StarshipDefiant Captain Captain

    Joined:
    Jul 11, 2009
    Great shirt, Captain Craig. As far as I know, the images portray the episode, most of it taking place at Rossum HQ/The Mainframe, but you may be right on the images and spoiler. I am dreading and looking forward to this episode at the same time because for all intents and purposes, this is actually the finale, with "Epitaph Two: Return" being the coda to the season/series like "Epitaph One" was a coda to season one. Depends on how you want to view it though.

    Also, I have to announce that sadly, this is the final episode where Miracle Laurie appears. (This is sourced to her twitter, so anyone that follows her already knows this).

    I'm going to miss this show.
     
  3. Paulcpick

    Paulcpick Commander Red Shirt

    Joined:
    Sep 10, 2008
    Location:
    South East Texas
    Got to say, Pauls line "What Did I Miss" left me and my little brother in Stitches, show has gotten great at the end.
     
  4. StarshipDefiant

    StarshipDefiant Captain Captain

    Joined:
    Jul 11, 2009
    Great episode, sad at the same time...confused over the dating references because things dont seem to consistent there :( Makes me wonder what will happen to see the future still happen, despite their attempts to save it. Am sad about Mellie, and wonder just what it was about saying Summer Glau and Reed Diamond were in the episode, they sure as hell weren't.
     
  5. DarthPipes

    DarthPipes Vice Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Mar 3, 2006
    Above Average. It took a little while for me to get fully into it but it turned out great, particularly the last few minutes.

    SPOILERS for those on the West Coast...






    Poor Boyd. Yeah, I know he was evil but still...that last sequence with him is chilling. This was definitely Boyd episode but the rest of the cast was great too. Nice to see Viktor Topher again...his impersonation of Topher is amazing.

    And we get the Epitah One future! Got to give them credit for going there.

    Question...with Bennett and Mellie getting their brains blown out, does Dollhouse suffer from the "woman in the fridge" syndrome? ;)
     
  6. Mr Light

    Mr Light Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Dec 7, 1999
    Location:
    Pennsylvania
    Another great episode! Great ending to the series. I really loved the twisted psychology of Boyd's true character; would have liked to have seen more of this. So... Dominic wasn't in the episode...
     
  7. StarshipDefiant

    StarshipDefiant Captain Captain

    Joined:
    Jul 11, 2009
    Sorry about that, I really thought he was, the Wiki posts the cast list as given by the Fox press release, and it apparently had his name on it.
     
  8. David cgc

    David cgc Vice Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Apr 3, 2002
    Location:
    California
    I'm guessing that E2 will have more flashbacks, and that everyone will go back to the Dollhouse and try to continue business as usual, up until the actual thoughtpocolypse, which is when the E1 flashbacks we haven't gotten to yet (including Dominic's release) would've happened. It may have been Whedon's way of having his cake and eating it, too. Defeat Rossum in the season 2 finale, but show that they couldn't put the genie back into the bottle. That way, if the show ended now, there'd be closure on all the major plot points and characters, but if it was by some miracle renewed, they would still be able to play out their running plot.
     
  9. StarshipDefiant

    StarshipDefiant Captain Captain

    Joined:
    Jul 11, 2009
    Knowing the way he works, this was probably his plan all along, and going back to "business as usual" isn't something I had thought of before, and totally explains the flashbacks clearly taking place between 2010 and 2019/20, good thoughts.

    Anyone else think Amy Acker was amazingly awesome in this episode? Looked pretty damn good in that suit, to.
     
  10. DarthPipes

    DarthPipes Vice Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Mar 3, 2006
    Amy Acker rocked that suit, agreed.

    Kind of like in Terminator. You could destory Skynet, destroy the data but you can't destroy human advancement. Someone will always be along to build another and so on.
     
  11. David cgc

    David cgc Vice Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Apr 3, 2002
    Location:
    California
    I think deWitt might be almost as insane as Boyd was, given how she's snapped in recent weeks. Her extremely dry reaction to a bunch of people getting shot in the head in her office, for one, and then the fact that after being kidnapped, betrayed, held hostage, and jailbroken tonight, she still became audibly aroused when Anthony/Victor mentioned that he was "enhanced."

    I suppose it's better than her being drunk all the time, though.
     
  12. StarshipDefiant

    StarshipDefiant Captain Captain

    Joined:
    Jul 11, 2009
    She's clearly not against using people and/or getting "rid" of the "problem" but seems to be against destroying the world.

    I agree about the Terminator thing, clearly, a plan was at work here to show that this could happen with the tech, Boyd even said it would happen. Likely, they resumed the status quo for some reason (with Victor apparently becoming an active again) and the world still ended. I wouldn't be surprised if seasons 3-5 would have revealed a rival corporation doing something similar, or that Clyde and Boyd were back (I doubt Boyd would have gone without having a copy of himself somewhere).
     
  13. FreezeC77

    FreezeC77 Commodore Commodore

    Joined:
    Dec 26, 2002
    When Millie shot herself and then watching Boyd/Rossum after being wiped blow up the computer it made me think of a blog review I was reading about Dollhouse a week or two ago and a guy said Whedon was a comic con one year and said something along the lines of

    "I got two big tricks I can throw out there. Killing a character or making them gay."
     
  14. Serial thread killer

    Serial thread killer Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

    Joined:
    Apr 20, 2003
    Location:
    uk
    I really thought Victor and or Sierra wasn't going to make it though the episode you don't get many happy couples with Whedon.
    And even though he's evil i still fault a bit sorry for Boyd at the end i think it was because he was like a helpless child.
     
  15. StarshipDefiant

    StarshipDefiant Captain Captain

    Joined:
    Jul 11, 2009
    They somewhat had to for a while, Epitaph One showed them in flashbacks in events we now know to be set between 2010 and 2019, but I get what you mean. I am glad that not all of it ended in disaster, and I now wish we'd be getting a season 3, I'd love to have seen what life would be like after the destruction of the HQ, and the realization they are still on the path of things to come.
     
  16. Joe Washington

    Joe Washington Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

    Joined:
    Apr 26, 2009
    Location:
    Providence, Rhode Island, United States
    Another great episode in a series of great episodes this season.

    I had a feeling Mellie was going to die. She just had that tragic look to me from the moment she was revealed to be an Active. Like that was the only ending she was headed towards.

    I found Boyd's twisted motivations about bringing Echo and the others to the facility interesting and though he did turn out to be a bad guy, I can't help but recall all the father/daughter moments between him and Echo and feel sorry for him in the end when he was turned into an Active suicide bomber.

    It makes sense for the Dollhouses to be taken over by a rival corporation if the show had continue into Season 3. Stepping into the vaccum left by Boyd and Clyde. Clyde will obviously fight for control of Rossum since there are more than one copy of his personality. The Dollhouse will probably side with the rival corporation aganist Clyde until they find out that the corporation is no better than Rossum and intends on pursuing the plans made by Boyd and Clyde. They'll probably have some of that revealed in flashbacks in next week's episode. I can't wait to see how it all ends.
     
  17. Captain Craig

    Captain Craig Vice Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Dec 7, 2003
    Location:
    Nashville,TN
    Really liked it but found it less excellent than last week.
    For most TV it's still excellent.
    By Dollhouse standards I voted: ABOVE AVERAGE

    Why? The death of Mellie was all but predictable. She wasn't happy with the knowledge of who and what she was/had been. Plus, Whedon never lets happiness stay. Topher lost Bennet and Ballard had to lose Mellie. Frankly I kept waiting for Sierrea to die in all honesty as well.

    Boyd was still a bad guy just one with some inkling of goodness. Trying to harvest a cure or innoculation is good but it sure was gone about in a bad way. Once you understand how Clyde was involved you can empathize some but it its not totally redeeming and yet you still hated seeing Boyd in full on "jihad" mode.

    Hoping to get my Dominic and Alpha fix in with Epitaph Two since they weren't here in Hollow Men. I'm wondering how flashback heavy the episode will be. How much time between 2010 & 2020 will we get. I know Whedon says he's wrapping it up and doesn't intend to pursue "Tales of the Dollhouse" in novels or comics but that 10yr span is a lot of stories to be told. If only.

    Can't figure out why they said the finale in 2 weeks? Why the change I wonder? FOX is killing me, if they don't air this episode I'll be mad.
     
  18. The Fatman

    The Fatman Captain Captain

    Joined:
    Sep 2, 2001
    Location:
    Buffalo, NY
    There's going to be a fundraiser/telethon/support show for Haiti next week, which is preempting the finale.
     
  19. StarshipDefiant

    StarshipDefiant Captain Captain

    Joined:
    Jul 11, 2009
    It seems to be a tragedy all around for most people, which is something that I somewhat like of this show, in reality, many people have a miserable life for various reasons. While this is a bit...more complicated, it shows people in misery for various reasons. While it's a "evil corporation takes over the world" type story, in someways I feel it is different as such. I'll miss this show, and will wonder for some time what season three could have been. I also wonder what some of the other Dollhouses think of what is going on, and how they would react to certain changes or events.
     
  20. DarthPipes

    DarthPipes Vice Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Mar 3, 2006
    I think Amazon is having a one-day sale on Dollhouse Season 1 on DVD and Blu-ray.