Does It Get Better???

Discussion in 'Voyager' started by AdmiralScreed, Dec 4, 2011.

  1. exodus

    exodus Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    That's the "Dark Phoenix Saga", not the "Phoenix Saga".
    The Phoenix Saga ends with her saving the universe by bringing the M'Kron Crystal into the sun.
     
  2. Guy Gardener

    Guy Gardener Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    It's been 25 years since I read those comics.

    I loved it when Wolverine got punched into orbit by the half-pint guardian of the M'Kraan crystal,and he was rescued by the Starjammer.
     
  3. AdmiralScreed

    AdmiralScreed Captain Captain

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    Watched a couple more episodes last night.

    Nemesis: This episode ripped off Predator with the commandos and the aliens that looked just like the Predators. I personally didn't care for all of the alien slang, and for the most part I didn't like the guest actors either, but Robert Beltran's excellent performance (as usual) and the great twist at the end made this at least a worthwhile watch.
    4/10

    Gotta go to class. I'll be back with another review later!
     
  4. Misco

    Misco Commander Red Shirt

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    Ha, yeah sorry for the confusion. I just prefer rating things on a scale of 5. I tend to get bogged down in the 5/6/7s if I use the 10 scale. Although with the OP ranking out of 10 I can see why you would make the mistake! :)

    I would agree with that. I've never really gone so far as to 'ship them but they were generally well written as a couple with a minimum of forced drama;
    The way their relationship progressed through marriage to a baby all felt pretty organic.
    Off topic, sort of, but my favourite Trek couple are Kira/Odo, however, I probably have more issues with the way their relationship was portrayed than with Tom/B'Elanna's.

    I feel that too. They had a really good concept there and I loved the idea of fluidic space. Also if 8472 had become a bigger part of the series then maybe there would have been less Borg stuff for people to bitch about. I suppose they were expensive to put on screen though?
    Although I guess the way they were portrayed in In the Flesh could have been utilised somehow, if that were a problem.

    As for Nemesis, I watched this for only the second time the other week and it's gone from being one of my most hated Trek episodes of all time to a ranking of 'average'. Which is a vast improvement! I still think the language thing is irritating and pointless but the overall story was alright and I actually found Chakotay relatively bearable in it. The last line about wishing it was as easy to stop hating as it is to start could definitely have been better put though. It came across far more preachy/twee than it needed to be.
     
  5. You_Will_Fail

    You_Will_Fail Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    They ripped off the design of the Predator alien. That's where the similarities end. The plot of "Nemesis" isn't really that similar at all.
     
  6. Anwar

    Anwar Vice Admiral Admiral

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    The 8472 being able to fight the Borg was a big part of them not being used again. Negative reaction to the idea of there being even one species that could fight the Borg led to them not being used to a big capacity again, so that meant no more 8472 vs Borg stories. But they couldn't be lazy and just leave things the way they were in "Scorpion" so the did "In the flesh" as a quick and easy way of getting them out of Trek without wasting any more time and effort (because they'd already seen that their better efforts were met with nothing but further criticism so there was no further point in trying).
     
  7. MacLeod

    MacLeod Admiral Admiral

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    Isn't there always a bigger fish?
     
  8. tighr

    tighr Commodore Commodore

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    I'm going to call you out on this one. Prove it. I want facts, not pronouns and emotions. Raw hard facts that people hated 8472 because they could defeat the Borg.
     
  9. AdmiralScreed

    AdmiralScreed Captain Captain

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    Nor is the plot that interesting. Just your average "two alien races at war" plot without much substance. Not bad, but nothing special either. This episode is bogged down with too many problems to be considered good, or even average for that matter, IMO.
     
  10. AdmiralScreed

    AdmiralScreed Captain Captain

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    Revulsion: Winner! Winner! The best episode of season 4 so far, IMO. The main plot with the hologram was interesting; the hologram was extremely creepy and well acted. His revulsion at humanity was an interesting twist to his character.
    I also loved the subplot with 7 and Harry. I thought all of their scenes were hilarious, and seeing Chakotay question Kim later was very funny.
    No complaints here.
    8/10
     
  11. You_Will_Fail

    You_Will_Fail Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    Oh great, here comes Anwar with his made up fan reactions.

    RE: Revulsion
    Its a pretty good episode but I never get too excited about it. Nonetheless, it was a very good story concept with good acting, good lighting/direction and fairly interesting dialogue. A very solid episode.
     
  12. tighr

    tighr Commodore Commodore

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    Revulsion: I liked it as well, but probably not enough to give it 8/10. It is one of only two times on Voyager that a member of the crew is promoted in rank, and that strikes me as a huge disappointment for the show in general. (In TNG, several characters are promoted at various times, but its mostly off-screen. Same with DS9).

    Not to mention the fact that the costume department was horrible at pips in Voyager. Absolutely horrible. And rank is one of my favorite parts about watching the show.
     
  13. Guy Gardener

    Guy Gardener Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    I was aghast watching this one, because an idea/conversation brought forth last week still existed.

    Tom loves B'Elanna!

    Yayyyyyyy!
     
  14. You_Will_Fail

    You_Will_Fail Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    I know. The mild shows of continuity in the first half of season 4 was kind of crazy! Oh well, good things don't last long.
     
  15. Anwar

    Anwar Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Seriously? You've never heard any of the "Voyager ruined the Borg" spiel on these forums alone?

    No, the fandom/hatedom refused to believe that there were "bigger fish" than the Borg. They're quite stupid in that belief, but that's how it is.
     
  16. Harvey

    Harvey Admiral Admiral

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    Star Trek: Voyager did ruin the Borg, but it has nothing to do with the events of "Scorpion."

    When you're talking about "fandom/hatedom" it seems to be something that doesn't exist (if it ever did).
     
  17. tighr

    tighr Commodore Commodore

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    A)You're still using pronouns and vague references to "spiel".
    B)Absolute failure to respond to my request in earnest.
    C)I never asked you to prove that "Voyager ruined the Borg" (a fact I already agreed with). I asked you to prove that people hated 8472 for being able to defeat the Borg.
     
  18. tighr

    tighr Commodore Commodore

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    Shoot, I did the research for you. Here's a thread -- one in which you participated -- from 2 years ago where the general consensus is that 8472 is badass, yet underutilized. Not a single person in the thread hated 8472 or questioned their ability to defeat the Borg. Rather, the complaint was that the writer's handicapped them instead of just letting them be badass.

    http://www.trekbbs.com/showthread.php?t=121460&highlight=8472
     
  19. AdmiralScreed

    AdmiralScreed Captain Captain

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    Since you're obviously referring to me as the stupid hatedom, Anwar, I'll tell you again that I don't hate 8472 for being able to defeat the Borg. All I was trying to originally get across was that the story in Scorpion was one that I didn't think needed to be told. The Borg were at their peak in their original TNG episodes because they were frightening, menacing, and seemingly unstoppable. The Borg in Scorpion, on the other hand, had hardly any of that menace, and they were beginning to feel stale from overuse.
    And please, Anwar, if you have something negative to say about me please say it directly to me rather than referring to me as the stupid fandom/hatedom. Thanks for your consideration.
     
  20. tighr

    tighr Commodore Commodore

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    I don't think he was referring directly to you. I think he likes to talk in generalities because he can't back up what he's saying.
     

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