Discussion in 'Enterprise' started by King Daniel Beyond, Sep 19, 2011.
Don't say that in the TOS forum. They don't handle comments like that very well up there.
How does time travel to get back where you came from violate cannon? I thought using it as a gimmicky science was stupid as it should have been a one offer and not a cheap ploy as it was written by Spock after all.
That's why I don't really have any trouble with the "The Time Barrier has been broken" comment. It was the series pilot and there is no way they could have every detail of technology and character traits & history (Laughing Spock, anyone?) planned. Neither did the folks involved with the show suspect the expanse of the trek Universe and fandom that lay ahead!
I'm speaking of time travel and cannon separately. I've just started season three and so far there has been time travel by three different ways.
1. Accidental time travel when they discovered the slingshot effect on time. They used the same effect to get back.
2. The portal.
3. The episode where they went back in time to observe history and ran into the being that was there to interrupt the race to build orbiting weapon platforms.
Cannon is a different issue. They started messing with cannon in episode three of the first season. But, as someone said, no one expected the ST universe to grow the way it has. But hey, it is not like Sabrina getting a new Darren. I guess back then anything could happen on TV.
I enjoyed Lansing and Garr in that episode, but they never did tell what method they used for time travel. The entire ship was there so we know it was not the portal. They treated the time travel aspect very casually. Maybe that is how ENT and other later Trek should have done things. Don't explain it, just do it.
Don't they discover the slingshot effect in 'Assignment Eternity' ? what was the third TOS episode that violated cannon and how?
I mean 'Assigment Earth'
They discovered the slingshot effect in "The Naked Time", they used it in "Assignment: Earth" and Star Trek IV: The Voyage Home.
TOS violated it's own continuity several times. But it was a time before home video, and a show made without anyone involved expecting the kind of OCD rewatching/analysis that Trekkies love so much. Hence James R. Kirk and everything else in the Nitpicker's Guide to Star Trek.
Sigh, those were the days.
In the third episode Spock went from having a distant ancestor that was human to having a mother who is human. Just part of fleshing out a character, but by today's standards of the Trekker police a change like that would be a major crime.
Kirk could have been exhaggerating about that in a joke. I think the middle initial error on the part of Mitchell showed us that he was not infallable. 'Naked Time' wasn't about slingshoting around the sun. Was it? I thought it was an emergancy intermix formula engine restart. What does that have to do with slingshoting around a sun? It would be the centrifical force that speeds the ship up beyond the time barrier like Superman did. Hey maybe Star Trek is in a galaxy far far away a long time ago. Assignment Earth was a lark, until Nimoy made it a plot device.
Also Gary Seven didn't travel back through time. Scotty theorized that he could have, the beam was so powerful, but he said his alien world was so advanced that it was hidden. He was from Earth's past and trained for decades for such missions, though he could have been from Kirk's future.
Why? There's nothing in "Corbomite" to establish the ancestor as "distant", even though this was a writer intent - so there's no problem in retroactively deciding she wasn't (or that she was a she). Likewise, nothing prevented the writers from suddenly deciding that Spock was a telepath or that he had weird mating rituals. It all went against earlier writer intent but in no way contradicted what they had actually written.
Nobody really considered it a "major crime" when "Rightful Heir" aired and we learned that there wasn't a Klingon Emperor after all. Some people hiccuped when it turned out that Sisko's father, established as ailing and withering and spoken of in the past tense, was still alive in "Homefront", but that wasn't a "crime", either - merely a clever way to expand and exploit a backstory, exactly like the move from "Corbomite" to "Journey to Babel" once had been.
GR himself has said it was a mistake
It's slingshotting out of a gravity well - like Psi 2000, like the Black Star of "Tomorrow is Yesterday", like the Earth's sun in STIV.
No, but the Enterprise sure did.
GR was lying.
Still don't know what a cold engine restart has to do with violating cannon.
Actually they didn't use the slingshot effect until Tomorrow is Yesterday; the time travel method in The Naked Time was a side effect of the matter/antimatter implosion which resulted from a cold engine startup. However, the argument could be used that the same theory applies (that of pulling away from a strong grativational centre, be that a sun or a collapsing planet).
As for violating its own canon, TOS actually stands up pretty well (Phil Farrand says as much in his Nitpicker's Guide). It's certainly no worse than later incarnations of Trek, with the added credence that TOS did it first!
Conceit that is.
They had to justify the boneheaded decision of making Kaless a good guy. They shot themselves in the foot there. Undermining TOS is a way of trying to prove a lie is true is all for those who embrace the later incarnations errors.
I must have missed something. Who said a a cold engine restart has something to do with violating cannon?
Your connection being?
I still have no idea what you are talking about. Next time I will try to post in such a way that there is no space between the lines.
Separate names with a comma.