Did Abrams really save the franchise?

Discussion in 'General Trek Discussion' started by Warped9, May 23, 2013.

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  1. Belz...

    Belz... Commodore Commodore

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    There is a fatal flaw in that argument: Star Trek fans -- I mean those who actually keep it alive by buying stuff or writing fanfic, etc. -- are not enough to keep it going.

    Paramount didn't make a new Trek movie because the fans buy merchandise: they did so because the franchise is a venerable one that they know will make money because it's so well-known.

    But without series or movies, it's not really "alive", is it ?
     
  2. RXTT

    RXTT Lieutenant Red Shirt

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    I think he changed the "franchise," not saved it. he warped it into Big, Dumb Entertainment, the exact opposite of TREK.

    The movies are fun, but they are a cash cow for a studio. They do not progress the Trek universe, only cheat it by creating a new "alternate" storyline which really does not matter to the canon.
     
  3. RXTT

    RXTT Lieutenant Red Shirt

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    What I want from Star Trek is to be forced to THINK. I can get entertainment from the Hangover franchise, or Star Wars
     
  4. Belz...

    Belz... Commodore Commodore

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    When's the last time Star Trek forced you to THINK ?

    Really ? Not much of that in TOS or the previous movies. And the other series were mostly entertainment. Did you mean that you want smart or well-made science-fiction ? Then sure.

    But force you to think ? I don't remember Star Trek doing that for me.
     
  5. Warped9

    Warped9 Admiral Admiral

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    There are perhaps two perspectives here.

    - the franchise is alive only as long as there are big new things introduced.

    - the franchise is alive as long as interest is maintained/continued.
     
  6. BillJ

    BillJ Fleet Admiral Admiral

    Obviously Star Trek Into Darkness did something right as it has some conservative bloggers in an uproar over its message. :techman:
     
  7. Warped9

    Warped9 Admiral Admiral

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    I think what is meant is that he/she prefers Trek that offers something to think about and maybe doesn't have to spell everything out.
     
  8. Belz...

    Belz... Commodore Commodore

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    Well, I think both are correct (remove "big" and replace with "official" in your first one). But in the second sense, Metropolis is still alive, even though the last and only movie was made way back in 1927. Oh, there's "interest", sure.

    I don't deny that the people who loved Star Trek before continued to love it. But the point is that the series and movies (the meat of the franchise) were no longer making good money. In that respect, Abrams and his collaborators "brought back" Star Trek.

    Now, I don't think Paramount would've let the franchise lay there for too long before trying again, but if the 2009 movie had bombed, that might've been the deathknell for Trek.
     
  9. Belz...

    Belz... Commodore Commodore

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    Well in that respect Into Darkness did something right, I think, since there's a lot of non-spoken plot points that we keep debating -- because they were either cut from the movie or left out due to the filmmakers deeming it wasn't necessary to do exposition on them.
     
  10. wissaboo

    wissaboo Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    lots of episodes did. But then, lots of episodes didn't. People forget that there was always an aspect of action in the franchise and every episode wasn't deep.
     
  11. Warped9

    Warped9 Admiral Admiral

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    No, I think they're referring to something more than that. I think they mean something with a message or asks questions.
     
  12. Belz...

    Belz... Commodore Commodore

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    Bah. I hate it when Star Trek does that. If I want social commentaries I'll watch the Daily Show. I watch fiction to be entertained. YMMV.
     
  13. mos6507

    mos6507 Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    Do we always have to keep going down the same rhetorical path? We're going to start deconstructing classic Trek yet again to bring it down to JJ Trek's level?

    Trek may not be THE most cerebral entertainment, but it's hard to argue that JJ Trek has any cerebral qualities whatsoever.
     
  14. bbailey861

    bbailey861 Admiral Premium Member

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    Saved...that's a really big word, but he undoubtedly brought Star Trek back to the forefront to where a younger audience is beginning to take notice again. And I, as part of the older audience, have been really happy with what he's done - with both stories.
     
  15. mos6507

    mos6507 Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    Considering how easy it is for conservatives to feel outrage, that's not saying much.
     
  16. Warped9

    Warped9 Admiral Admiral

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    Entertainment and social commentary are not mutually exclusive. You can have both and enjoy it. It can be done in drama/adventure as easily as comedy.
     
  17. BillJ

    BillJ Fleet Admiral Admiral

    How is acknowledging what Trek has always been "bringing it down"? Honestly, if people didn't keep trying to compare Abrams movies to the rest of the franchise (with the rose-tinted nostalgia glasses on), the comparisons would likely stop.
     
  18. Warped9

    Warped9 Admiral Admiral

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    In fairness when you label something with a familiar name then comparisons are inevitable.

    Every time there's a new version of 007 or Superman (or whatever) it's always compared with previous versions.
     
  19. BillJ

    BillJ Fleet Admiral Admiral

    Of course. But before you make those comparisons, take off the rose-tinted nostalgia glasses. I don't know how many times I've watched someone scream about how something Abrams did "wasn't Star Trek", yet had been done multiple times before in other Trek series including TOS.
     
  20. CorporalCaptain

    CorporalCaptain Admiral Admiral

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    In the sense that now Trek has a future in the movies, whereas before Abrams it was dead, the answer is yes.
     
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