Discussion in 'Star Trek - The Original & Animated Series' started by TEH BABA, Jul 22, 2008.
I only think we saw commdore's.
No, there were a few admirals in TOS, such as Komack.
Komack was the most prominent, showing up several times. There was also an Admiral called Westervliet in one episode.
They were mentioned occasionally, yes, but none ever appeared as a normal guest character.
Komack and Westervliet were portrayed by the same actor.
Westervliet was never referred to by name in "For the World in Hollow...", so he could be considered Komack unless you're picky.
Komack/Westervliet never appeared in person in TOS; we only see them via A/V display of a subspace radio transmission.
Well, most of the time, the few admirals we did see on screen we only saw from the chest up, so we rarely saw their sleeve rank braid, probably as a way to save on the budget.
There is one time, however, that an admiral's rank is seen: in The Trouble with Tribbles. Admiral Fitzpatrick shows his sleeve rank briefly -- see Memory Alpha for the trivia associated with this.
There was also an Admiral Komack who appeared a few times, as well as an Admiral Fitzgerald.
Is it even visible, though? I found a clip of the appropriate scene on YouTube, and the only time you can see portions of Fitzpatrick's arms are in the wide shots. There's very little detail there, and his insignia easily blends into his gold uniform. The close shots of him only show him from the shoulders up.
That's not to say that MA's description is wrong, but it's extremely difficult to see if it's there.
Agreed, you can't see it, but the admiral braid is visible on the blooper reel, when the actor Byron Morrow is lampooning his role in Allstate Insurance commercials.
"And Captain?.... You're in good hands with Tribble."
Hopefully someone else has a better copy of the bloopers than this poor one, but here's the best I could do:
With the light catching the braid differently on the right side of these frames, you can put together a reasonable mental image of what it looks like. As described at Memory Alpha (thanks to Red Ranger for the pointer): "a wide gold band (as worn by commodores), with a single solid rank stripe above and beneath it."
Thanks for the video, it reminds me I made a mistake above. The actor was Ed Reimers (Fitzpatrick), not Morrow (Komack/Westervliet).
The actor Reimers was at the time famous for his Allstate commercials, which explains the joke.
Cool, I always thought Admiral braid was conjecture.
I'm too lazy to look it up right now, were any of the officers on the jury in Court Martial admirals?
There are actually a large number of threads and discussions on the different types of braid used for Commodores and Admirals on TOS over at Dewback Wing ASAP and some people have actually found the correct materials. Here are a few (you need to have an account on Yuku to see them):
As thick and wide as simple commodore braids were, could you imagine how "busy" and even unsightly TOS admiral sleeves might have been? It wasn't until TMP over a decade later and a much bigger costume and wardrobe budget that we got to see fairly clean and well-made admiral's braids...and even then Kirk looked like he was wearing gold Madonna bracelets from 1985.
I think they were all captains, except for the commodore...
I give you Admiral Michael Mullen:
And on the other end of the coin -- a non-com -- Master Chief Petty Officer Bruce Bradley:
But those US things have NOTHING on some of our foreign military friends.
Check out the sleeve-born braid of a few admirals out there. Some really go overboard, with two or three different types of braid in multiple widths. Check out http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Admiral .
Any way, the point is... braid works.
Ah, okay. That helps.
Separate names with a comma.