Dear Doctor... How could you do this?

Discussion in 'Star Trek: Enterprise' started by Jefferies, Sep 22, 2013.

  1. T'Girl

    T'Girl Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Unless I missed it, was any reason given for the Enterprise being in the ocean as opposed to being in orbit?

    The original intent was that the operation to quiet the volcano was to be conducted from a shuttle, relatively small and difficult to see through the ash cloud.

    And from orbit the ship could have been position above the throat of the volcano, providing the direct line of sight necessary to beam Spock out and would have avoided the natives witnessing the ship rising out of the ocean.

    :devil:
     
  2. Gov Kodos

    Gov Kodos Admiral Admiral

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    Besides, there were very few witnesses. The rest of the folks on the planet know nothing of the volcano erupting, much less the Enterprise. They'd have no more reason to believe in the Sea/Sky bird than any other deities the planet's population worships. In a few thousand years, if and when they understand Geology, this place is going to look mighty peculiar. Until then, there's no reason to think this event is all that momentous unless you think extinction would be better for the planet's people than let one tribe see a spaceship.
     
  3. R. Star

    R. Star Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Original intent? I'm fairly sure they went with "how cool would a shot of the Enterprise coming out of the water be!" and tailored the story around that rather than thinking about how the best way to accomplish their task would've been.
     
  4. teacake

    teacake Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    Next movie the Enterprise will be coming out of jello.
     
  5. R. Star

    R. Star Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    A jello monster trying to eat the Enterprise. We can call that episode eat or be eaten.
     
  6. Gov Kodos

    Gov Kodos Admiral Admiral

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    Enterprise might have some immunity to such a syndrome.
     
  7. jespah

    jespah Commodore Commodore

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    It has to be lime.
     
  8. Melakon

    Melakon Admiral Admiral

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    One of those panels in the hull slides open, and a really big spoon pops out.
     
  9. BillJ

    BillJ Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    I think it was a play on words with the episode The Immunity Syndrome where the Enterprise has no issue flying through protoplasm. :techman:
     
  10. MakeshiftPython

    MakeshiftPython Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    I was gonna post this but as I read on I see you already did that. Thanks, I'm totally with Paris on the PD and every time Trek tried presenting Janeway or Picard as those in the right for saying stuff like that I wanted to pull my hair out. Even this little bit makes Janeway look appalling.


    JANEWAY: Don't even think about it, Tom. The Prime Directive is clear. We cannot allow our presence to alter this planet's natural course of events.
    PARIS: Even if the natural course of events is annihilation?
    JANEWAY: Yeah.

    I'm wondering if Roddenberry was really the one that cooked up this bullshit in the first place. This is the earliest example but it's not specific to saving civilizations from natural disasters. A line from Data in "The Last Outpost".

    DATA: Starfleet has permitted several civilizations to fall. We have at times allowed the strong and violent to overcome the weak.
     
  11. Gov Kodos

    Gov Kodos Admiral Admiral

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    Yes, indeed.
    [​IMG]
     
  12. jibrilmudo

    jibrilmudo Lieutenant Junior Grade Red Shirt

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    I think Dear Doctor was one of the worst trek episodes period. Just with the final minutes and utterly bad logic.

    They had plenty of conflicts to explore a future prime directive (which I believe is designed solely to keep federation from being entangle in local conflicts and taking sides). Desert Crossing was one such episode in season 1. DD was not applicable imo.
     
    Last edited: Oct 16, 2013
  13. Edit_XYZ

    Edit_XYZ Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    I agree on all points.
    Indeed, 'Dear doctor' was discussed on this forum several times; I made my position clear on those occasions, as well.
    Of course, several posters were quite vehement on defending Phlox's course of action in the episode; as they are in this thread, I see. Make of this what you will.

    This view has a rather large problem:
    There's nothing subtle about the 'moral quandary'.
    Anyone who knows even a little about evolution, anyone who realises that what may or may not happen 1000 years into the future has no bearing on the morality of a choice now can see the episode supported the utterly immoral side and tried to window-dress it as 'moral'.
     
    Last edited: Oct 16, 2013
  14. Yanks

    Yanks Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    We don't know what events caused Kirk to make those decisions. To assume there wasn't any reason for what they did is looking to bash something IMO.

    As indicated in the movie, maybe the clouds/smoke above the volcano wasn't enough to mask the Enterprise so he made the decsion to hide underwater.

    One thing they could have identified in the movie to make things more plausable was why they couldn't use the transporter from orbit. Maybe they did, but I don't recall it.

    I enjoyed the opening scenes. Fun to watch and brought General Order #1 into play, etc.
     
    Last edited: Oct 16, 2013
  15. R. Star

    R. Star Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Looking for something to bash? Even Scotty pointed out how stupid it was. A novel concept but the spaceship could've stayed... in space. The worst the locals would see there is a moving star. You'd still have line of sight directly above the volcano in space for the transporters.

    The Enterprise coming out of the ocean shot was just a pure glamor shot and nothing more. It made no sense at all from a storytelling perspective. Take away that silliness and it was a good scene. I particularly liked how Spock logiced himself into breaking the PD... and for once someone got punished for breaking it.
     
  16. DonIago

    DonIago Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Just because Scotty thought it was ridiculous doesn't mean there were better options available. Since we didn't witness any discussion resulting in the decision to submerge the ship, we're hardly in a position to judge said decision from an in-universe standpoint.
     
  17. R. Star

    R. Star Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Yeah, I can see how the opinion of the Chief Engineer wouldn't be relevant at all in the situation.
     
  18. DonIago

    DonIago Vice Admiral Admiral

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    I'm sure you know that's not what I was saying. I'm sure you also know there were times in TOS when Scotty complained about what the ship was/would be going through and yet everything worked out fine.

    It's entirely possible for a situation to be both utterly ridiculous and the best course of action available at the time.
     
  19. RandyS

    RandyS Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Bingo. It was solely done to look "cool", and therefore, pointless.
     
  20. BillJ

    BillJ Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    How many times has a Captain ignored the advice of those under him/her about the capabilities of a starship in Star Trek? I'm not talking just about TOS but the entire franchise. It's a staple.

    I think sometimes people forget that Star Trek is suppose to be entertainment. Do I think the driving force behind the Enterprise being submerged was the cool factor? Absolutely. I drooled when I saw the scene the first time in the theater, absolutely drooled. It was one of the coolest special effects sequences I've ever seen in my thirty-five plus years of going to the movies.