D'deridex class Warbird vs Galaxy class

Discussion in 'General Trek Discussion' started by kgartm1185, Aug 8, 2013.

?

Which class of ship is more powerful?

This poll will close on Apr 17, 2027 at 9:34 PM.
  1. Galaxy class

    52.8%
  2. D'deridex class

    47.2%
  1. USS Excelsior

    USS Excelsior Commodore Commodore

    Joined:
    Jun 16, 2004
    Location:
    Alpha Quadrant
    In Tin Man the Enterprise got crippled by the Tin Man itself, and the Warbird was destroyed for being too close when it's defense mechanism was activated.
     
  2. Alidar Jarok

    Alidar Jarok Everything in moderation but moderation Moderator

    Joined:
    Apr 14, 2003
    Location:
    Norfolk, VA
    Yes, but it didn't help that they lost 70% of their shields after just a few seconds.
     
  3. Timo

    Timo Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Aug 26, 2003
    Shield loss is indeed usually more gradual, but "two shots to zero" isn't all that different from the "five shots to zero" of the tiny NOMAD or the "three shots to zero" of the Borg. And how many shots did Chang really get off before the E-A lost shields over Khitomer? Despite having to space out his shots for stealth.

    Our heroes don't typically appear flabbergasted when just a handful of attack runs reduce their defenses to nil. "Prolonged slugfests" is the impression we get from watching TNG, yes - but we often forget the E-D tended to fight grossly inferior opponents (which also explains why Picard wasn't particularly worried about firing back or things of that nature).

    Timo Saloniemi
     
  4. kgartm1185

    kgartm1185 Lieutenant Red Shirt

    Joined:
    Jun 6, 2013
    Location:
    USS Enterprise-D
    I never got the impression the Enterprise-A had shields. I mean, what was the point of shields, to protect the hull. Well the Enterprise-A's "shields" didn't do a good job at that.
     
  5. R. Star

    R. Star Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

    Joined:
    Jun 15, 2012
    Location:
    Shangri-La
    Yeah given each shot did physically damage the hull, despite shields being up, 23rd century shields left a lot to be desired.
     
  6. Timo

    Timo Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Aug 26, 2003
    Hmm... We count the slight non-penetrating charring as a sign of the hull being "not protected"?

    I'd rather argue that if that is what you get from unprotected hits, photon torpedoes shouldn't be classified as weapons!

    Timo Saloniemi
     
  7. Maurice

    Maurice Vice Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Oct 17, 2005
    Location:
    Walking distance from Starfleet HQ
    Just found this again on my Flickr page. Regardless of the variable size shown on screen, this illustrates the original intent in terms of relative size of the two ships. The Warbird is HUGE and easily has more volume than several Galaxy class ships.
    [​IMG]
     
  8. Praetor

    Praetor Vice Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Apr 18, 2004
    Location:
    The fine line between continuity and fanwank.
    I've oft-wanted to make an MSD for the D'Deridex based on that diagram (which was done by Mr. Probert IIRC.)
     
  9. Robert Comsol

    Robert Comsol Commodore Commodore

    Joined:
    Sep 10, 2012
    Location:
    USS Berlin
    Each time I see this size comparison of Andrew Probert I can't help but wonder: Was the Romulan Warbird this big in size to actually accomodate personnel and cargo or was it basically full of "hot air" to make an intimidating impression on any adversary of the Romulan Star Empire?

    Bob
     
  10. Praetor

    Praetor Vice Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Apr 18, 2004
    Location:
    The fine line between continuity and fanwank.
    I'd wager a little of both. Surely a smaller ship could have done the same job, but not made such a powerful statement.
     
  11. Nine of Four

    Nine of Four Commander Red Shirt

    Joined:
    Aug 10, 2013
    Location:
    On a Borg Cube in the Delta Quadrant
    Perhaps the D'deridex was made so large due to the fact the Bird-of-prey classes from TOS and ENT don't exaclty have the most intimidating design......
     
  12. austen_pierce

    austen_pierce Captain Captain

    Joined:
    Aug 15, 2013
    Location:
    Virginia Beach, VA
    Some of my favorite TNG eps involve the standoffs between D'deridex and E-D, whether or not any shots were fired. The intimidation factor was very real, and IMO the driving force behind the in-universe design.
     
  13. jpv2000

    jpv2000 Captain Captain

    Joined:
    Dec 27, 2012
    Location:
    Georgia, United States
    Probably so. I remember the first time I saw that debut episode for the D'deridex, it was indeed an intimidating ship.
     
  14. Admiral8Q

    Admiral8Q Cadet Newbie

    Joined:
    Apr 6, 2014
    More powerful? I'd say that they are even, more dependent on the officers and crew for that. Or the situation.

    Larger? Definately the D'deridex.

    Faster? Galaxy is far faster.

    Yes, I've read the entire thread, alot of good stuff here. Thought I'd anser your original question kgartm.
     
    Last edited: Apr 6, 2014
  15. Admiral8Q

    Admiral8Q Cadet Newbie

    Joined:
    Apr 6, 2014
  16. Levi

    Levi Lieutenant Commander Red Shirt

    Joined:
    Aug 11, 2013
    Location:
    Starfleet Academy, San Francisco, Earth/Sol
    Are Romulan rooms and space area's larger then Federation?
    I always thought that it seemed like the actual volume of their room designs seemed to be bigger. Their ceilings were higher and just had more volume to them. Where ours seemed to be more compact to save space compared to theirs.
    I've never really paid that much attention honestly so I could be wrong.
     
  17. Timo

    Timo Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Aug 26, 2003
    It does look as if there's more headroom and shoulder room in the corridors of "Improbable Cause"/"The Die is Cast" than aboard the E-D or the Defiant or the other Fed ships using those sets - but the lounge and interrogation room on the Romulan ship don't appear all that imposing. The bridges from DS9 and TNG are all rather spacious, that is, sparsely decorated, and the cargo hold in "Face of the Enemy" is shot from an angle that emphasizes ceiling height.

    Is that just because the Romulans can afford the legroom in a ship built at larger-than-necessary size? Or do Romulans and Vulcanoids in general suffer from claustrophobia more easily or severely than humans? We have seen Vulcans operate a tiny vessel for an extended length of time, in "Carbon Creek", but perhaps that's only possible with Surakian self-discipline, and the average passionate Vulcanoid will start tal'shayaing his or her neighbors in no time flat if not given enough lebensraum...

    Timo Saloniemi
     
  18. Robert Comsol

    Robert Comsol Commodore Commodore

    Joined:
    Sep 10, 2012
    Location:
    USS Berlin
    Captain Koloth claimed Klingons didn't equip their battlecruisers with "non-essentials", yet that didn't keep the Romulans from using these ships in "The Enterprise Incident".

    What about the portholes of the warbird's head section? Surely these could give us an idea of average deck height (the Probert warbird size would probably set the upper limit).

    On one hand the Romulans could have chosen the large size to intimidate possible opponents (reputation + size = respect), but in case that fails the warbird has plenty of surface you shouldn't find too difficult to hit.

    Admittedly, the warp engines aren't nearly as exposed as on a Federation or Klingon ship, and surely the "turtle shell" on top and bottom provides a mechanical blast shield to some extent.

    Speculating what a Romulan warbird of 2344 or earlier could have looked like, I wonder if at one stage in the design evolution a warbird resembled more the XCV-330 ringship Enterprise, so what we saw in 2364 for the first time was the latest design evolution of what may have started as a ringship design?

    Bob
     
  19. Timo

    Timo Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Aug 26, 2003
    The upper and lower hulls of the warbird don't really seem to be part of a propulsion ring - they are just structures connecting to the nacelles. No onscreen ringship design has featured engine nacelles, even if some unused ENT sketches do suggest such combinations...

    True enough - but this Romulan design, like so many others, seems pretty good from the frontal aspect minimizing standpoint. Fed ships are good in that sense, too, and similarly present big targets from above or below.

    The ENT Vulcan ringships with their needle bodies have the smallest profiles overall, with special emphasis on frontal profile minimizing but with extra challenges for anybody trying to aim at their sides, too. This is probably better in combat than using spherical ships that in theory would have the smallest target profile overall; spheres are good if you can't maneuver and expect to be besieged from many directions, but any maneuverability makes it more advantageous to build ships with at least one "maximally minimized" aspect accompanied by a couple of compromises.

    Timo Saloniemi
     
  20. publiusr

    publiusr Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

    Joined:
    Mar 22, 2010
    I could always picture a second ship hiding inside the top and bottom halves of the warbird, slipping out un-noticed.