Data x Tasha. Was that affection or abuse?

Discussion in 'Star Trek: The Next Generation' started by xvicente, Sep 19, 2013.

  1. Mycroft Maxwell

    Mycroft Maxwell Lieutenant Commander Red Shirt

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    I agree.

    Wow! Thats news to me. I keep learning more and more about behind the scenes stuff. Explains to me how Data was not immune.

    I did notice this experience seemed to have a lasting effect on Data. He seemed to be the only person to keep that small hologram of Yar in his desk. I think he felt attachment (an emotion) and never ever realized it.
     
  2. T'Girl

    T'Girl Vice Admiral Admiral

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    As pointed out, Tasha wasn't drunk. And while Data seemed a bit innocent at times, he wasn't a minor.

    However, as your question is phrased the woman would be at fault. "Being drunk" doesn't even begin to be a defense of wrongful actions.

    :)
     
  3. MickStrange

    MickStrange Cadet Newbie

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    Of course this wasn't abuse. Tasha said "it never happened," out of fear that her professional standing would be compromised. Cpt. Picard even used Data and Yar's relationship when he defended Data's sentience against the federation. Keeping her hologram all the years after her death proves the special familiarity his neural networks possessed of her. That, and the fact that they both suffered from intoxication clears either of any wrong doing
     
  4. JeffJedi

    JeffJedi Ensign Newbie

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    Data is not a child. He was at least 27 by then. He has a real job with real responsibilities. He frequently carries weapons that can kill people and is fully trusted with them, along with fixing and flying the ship. He attended Starfleet and is third in command of the Enterprise, a ship with over a thousand people on board.

    All that adds up to being at least 18+ mentally in human terms.
     
  5. The Old Mixer

    The Old Mixer Clean Old Mod Moderator

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    But he also has difficulty understanding basic human behavior such as humor. I imagine that at that point, he had far less experience with sex or intimate relationships than he did with humor.
     
  6. T'Girl

    T'Girl Vice Admiral Admiral

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    As did Spock.


    :)
     
  7. The Old Mixer

    The Old Mixer Clean Old Mod Moderator

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    Spock was always the outside observer when it came to human behavior, but other than in STIV, when he wasn't working on all thrusters, I never got the impression that he truly didn't understand it. Whereas often Data was really clueless and didn't get things. Spock never had that "innocent" quality to him...and more specific to this topic, even Spock knew what it was to be a biological male of his species....
     
  8. GalaxyX

    GalaxyX Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    The whole concept of a machine having consensual sex with a human is just stupid.

    I tend to imagine the whole deal in the episode as "Data's curiosity" as to what this whole sex business was about.

    Someone else said this, and I tend to agree:

    Tasha was intoxicated and used Data as a blow up sex doll.
    Data was impaired as well, and as a machine, was not able to calculate what was probably going to be not appropriate behaviour.

    My understanding of the behind the scenes is that at this point in time, they weren't sure what Data was supposed to be (if he was an organic AI, and whether he was created by aliens, etc etc.) and at this time they hadn't yet come up with the concept that Data does not have feelings and emotions like we do.

    The whole idea that a machine could experience sex the way a human being is ludicrous. Even if it were possible (do we really understand what pleasure is, or even pain?) what would be the point in giving a robot this feature?

    The whole idea of Data being "fully functional", why? I could accept it as maybe Dr. Soong providing Data with a working electronic phallus (hah hah) so that he could provide functioning sex (although crippled) to a potential mate.

    Other than that, there really isn't any use to data for having one. If he wasn't "fully functional" he could just use a strap on and it would do the same job.
     
  9. Melakon

    Melakon Admiral Admiral

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    Data may be an emotional child, but since he's programmed in multiple techniques and a wide variety of pleasuring, it's doubtful he could be considered a child.

    The gag reel "Totally Naked" was much better than "The Naked Now".
     
  10. matthunter

    matthunter Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Well, if we go with the novels (and they do a reasonable extrapolation of Soong's motives), he fully intended to transfer himself into an android body the same way he did Juliana (and in the books, he did, having tricked Data into thinking Lore had killed him a wee bit sooner than actually occurred).

    Soong being human would wish his new body to be capable of all the things that gave him pleasure in his human existence, so I can see sexuality in Data being a test run.

    He's also a rampant egomaniac... even if he never fulfills his dream of electronic immortality, he gave his sons HIS face and the ability to pleasure women beyond their wildest imaginations.
     
  11. The Old Mixer

    The Old Mixer Clean Old Mod Moderator

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    Soong: You could have done anything, Data. Why Starfleet?

    Data: There are "hot babes" there, and I have managed to "score" with some of them.

    Soong: That's m'boy....
     
  12. R. Star

    R. Star Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Well often enough one of the first questions with any new piece of technology that someone asks is, "Can I have sex with it?"

    I don't even mind the stupid hilarity of this episode, but... the second one? Bad call there to have an episode of your whole cast behaving like drunken morons. I marvel that TNG didn't get canceled after the first season to this day.
     
  13. JarodRussell

    JarodRussell Vice Admiral Admiral

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    If you watch the episode, you can see that:

    both are "drunk"
    she seduces him
    he is fully functional

    There is no "abuse". Who would have been abusing whom? The fuckt that he has the program and equipment to pleasure her all night long should show that he is not immature, and clearly understands his actions.

    You can also regret sober sex and come to the agreement that it never happened.
     
  14. Mycroft Maxwell

    Mycroft Maxwell Lieutenant Commander Red Shirt

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    I still think if Data had an emotion chip at the time, he'd feel like she just used him for a sophisticated sex toy. ....You know in the series it was clear he kept an attachment to her. Even after her death....actually especially after her death. There should have been a scene in Generations where he feels sadness for her loss.
     
  15. R. Star

    R. Star Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    I always thought Data had an affection towards Tasha even if he wasn't capable of rationalizing the emotion. As for Generations... honestly, the whole emotion chip subplot contributed -nothing- to the movie.
     
  16. xvicente

    xvicente Captain Captain

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    I think the thread is losing focus. Simple question: who should be arrested and/or put in a intergalactic known sex offenders list?

    (btw, I'll watch the ep again to see if Data was already infected at that point or the virus is a std in this case. brb)
     
  17. Mycroft Maxwell

    Mycroft Maxwell Lieutenant Commander Red Shirt

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    neither. Data was seduced by Yar. Yar was mentally affected by a chemical. Want to blame somebody for abuse, blame Dr. Noonien Soong for making data anatomically correct and programed with "Multiple techniques" . But she could have as easily found a toy in her drawer... Actually this episode has done more damage to data than anyone. He was degraded into a pleasure device...
     
  18. Merlanthe

    Merlanthe Commander Red Shirt

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    Reading this thread the thing that keeps popping into my head is how at Tasha's funeral when the holgram version of her is saying all the goodbyes she didnt get to she looks at Data smiles and tells him 'it did happen.'

    I think it was, as others have already stated multiple times, a case of regret after seducing probably the only one of her coworkers who wouldnt realise she was under the influence of a mind altering chemical. A fairly new coworker at that since this was only the second episode and the pilot showed that apart from Riker/Troi most of the crew hadnt met before being assigned to the Enterprise together.

    Maybe, like Pulaski, she saw Data more as machine than person at first which contributed to her embarassment at the situation. I like to think over the course of the first season as everyone got to know one another better her regret/embarassment lessened especially since data went along with pretending it never happened and didnt treat her any differently. If anything they became good friends.

    I always read her holgram telling him that 'it did happen' as an indication that she was no longer regretful or embarassed by what had happened and didnt mind him acknowledging it if he wanted to. By then she knew him well enough to know he would probably never tell others about it unless he had a good reason to.
     
  19. sonak

    sonak Vice Admiral Admiral

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    dickish or sleazy perhaps, but I don't think a situation where a guy sleeps with a drunk woman who comes onto HIM, especially when he had nothing to do with her drunkenness(meaning, he wasn't deliberately getting her drunk to sleep with him) can really be construed as "abuse." And in this case, Data was clearly influenced by the virus and pretty innocent about Human social cues.
     
  20. Mycroft Maxwell

    Mycroft Maxwell Lieutenant Commander Red Shirt

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    They were both victoms of a virus/chemical intoxication thingy. No one was to blame unless you can charge a virus.