Constitution, Miranda, and Constelation Class

Discussion in 'Trek Tech' started by Brainsucker, Oct 24, 2012.

  1. BK613

    BK613 Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

    Joined:
    Sep 3, 2008
    Location:
    BK613
    Perhaps, although if those features are around the other doors...
     
  2. Timo

    Timo Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Aug 26, 2003
    Memory Alpha shows at least one (CGI) Miranda firing forward torps from the usual place, although I can't place the shot in any specific episode. And "What You Leave Behind" has the cute scene of one poor Miranda desperately dodging and weaving, under pursuit from a Breen ship, and IIRC firing at least one aft torpedo before the Breen turns away and retreats to defend Cardassia Prime.

    The Constellation is a "star cruiser" in "Peak Performance"...

    The Miranda is never anything verbally, not even "Miranda".

    ...Then they are tractor beams, plain and simple. :)

    The Miranda has similar things on the upper corners of her bays, but those are in triangular rather than square indentations.

    Timo Saloniemi
     
  3. blssdwlf

    blssdwlf Commodore Commodore

    Joined:
    Feb 26, 2010
    @Timo - That's what I get for typing too fast :)

    "AFAIK, there were no Reliant's to fire torpedoes in DS9 that fired from the saucer ventral section."

    @BK613 - Yeah - the torp launchers could be anywhere on the Constellation class.
     
  4. Chemahkuu

    Chemahkuu Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Dec 23, 2004
    Location:
    Ulster
    Umm, look at the image again, the torp deck is at the bottom of the lower pylon, right there, same as the Conny refit type.
     
  5. Mytran

    Mytran Commodore Commodore

    Joined:
    Aug 5, 2009
    Location:
    North Wales
    The structure is there, but there are also defininitely covers
     
  6. BK613

    BK613 Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

    Joined:
    Sep 3, 2008
    Location:
    BK613
    The structure being referred to is visible here (large image):

    http://www.mutara.net/Christies/detail models/Enterprise A/IMG_2041.JPG
     
  7. throwback

    throwback Captain Captain

    Joined:
    May 27, 2011
    Below the launchers, there are the letters, "EOC".

    1.) Were these letters originally on the model, or were they added later?
    2.) What could be the meaning of these letters?

    Honestly, for a professional model making firm, I expected a better looking model in close-up.
     
  8. B.J.

    B.J. Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

    Joined:
    Jul 14, 2004
    Location:
    Huntsville, AL
    Well, 33 years ago, it looked great! It's just the wear and tear of packing and unpacking, repainting, and handling over the years has done a number on it. Plus I doubt many of the materials and paints used were meant to last that long.
     
  9. Santaman

    Santaman Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

    Joined:
    Jul 27, 2001
    Location:
    That Ship
    Just look around on http://www.ex-astris-scientia.org
    The Constellations have two TMP style photorp launchers each just underneath the horizontal nacelle pylons, every version of the ship has those even the yellow desktop model.
     
  10. blssdwlf

    blssdwlf Commodore Commodore

    Joined:
    Feb 26, 2010
    Yes - and you can see those structures completely covered up indicating no launchers there.

    We've come up with different possibilities:
    1. The torpedo launchers are shuttered with a flush door.
    2. The launchers are somewhere else on the ship.
     
  11. Santaman

    Santaman Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

    Joined:
    Jul 27, 2001
    Location:
    That Ship
    Could it also be bad/difficult lighting which makes it look like they're shuttered?
     
  12. blssdwlf

    blssdwlf Commodore Commodore

    Joined:
    Feb 26, 2010
    Nope. Even in the HD version you can see the model has no launcher detail and it is all white.
     
  13. Timo

    Timo Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Aug 26, 2003
    ...And let's clarify that this "covering up" is due to the fact that the muzzles of the torp tubes are separate plastic bits that need to be glued onto the smooth forward ends of the torpedo deck pieces, but were left out in the construction of both the photographic model and the yellow desktop model.

    So we aren't really talking about Starfleet in-universe installing shutters on a launcher type lifted directly from the Constitution refit, but about Starfleet possibly completely removing such launchers and plating over the holes, or possibly installing new and more compact launchers that have hinged cover plates. Canonically, the muzzle bits were never there, but Sternbach's own art shows them in place - so I'd like to think Starfleet removed the Constitution style tubes at some point after the 23rd century and installed all-new weapons in roughly the same location, with single tubes that we can see in the form of those tubular greeblies atop the top launcher deck and below the bottom one.

    Timo Saloniemi
     
  14. Brainsucker

    Brainsucker Commander Red Shirt

    Joined:
    Dec 3, 2007
    Ok, now because I have already have understand about Miranda, Constitution and Constellation ; what about Ambassador and Excelsior? As we already know, Ambassador is newer than Excelsior, but we see more Excelsior than Ambassador in DS9 and TNG. Even Galaxy Class has more screen time in DS9. So what happen to the Ambassador Class? Is it a failed design or what?
     
  15. Unicron

    Unicron Continuity Spackle Moderator

    Joined:
    May 8, 2003
    Location:
    The Pyxis Unity
    I wouldn't call it a failed design, but TPTB have always been weird when it comes to how they use some models. There was only one Intrepid class vessel seen on DS9 (or outside of VOY for that matter), because VOY was still running then and for some reason they don't like to use other ships of the same class as a protagonist ship. I don't think it makes much difference to viewers myself.
     
  16. Dukhat

    Dukhat Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

    Joined:
    Dec 26, 2007
    Location:
    Baltimore, MD
    The real reason why we never saw the Ambassador class more than a handful of times was because the filming model was damaged and wasn't used again after the first episode of DS9. Conversely, the Excelsior model (and the Reliant model as well) survived long enough to be scanned into a CGI model, which is why we see tons of them in later DS9 in CGI-heavy space battle scenes.

    The in-universe reason? The one that gets bandied about the most is that the Ambassadors were built for long-range deep space exploration, and we don't see much of them simply because none are anywhere close by. There's certainly no indication whatsoever that it was a failed design. If you think it was a failed design simply because we didn't see it much, then by that logic the 20-odd conjectural designs must also be failed, because we didn't see them even once. Or the BoBW kitbashes...or the DS9 kitbashes...or heck, even the Sovereign and Intrepid classes...
     
  17. throwback

    throwback Captain Captain

    Joined:
    May 27, 2011
    The Excelsior-class model was damaged when modifications were made to it for an appearance in Generations, yet the producers elected to pay for a new model. There had to be another reason why the Ambassador-class model wasn't used again.
     
  18. Brainsucker

    Brainsucker Commander Red Shirt

    Joined:
    Dec 3, 2007
    Maybe because the model is almost identical to the Galaxy Class?
     
  19. Forbin

    Forbin Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Mar 15, 2001
    Location:
    I said out, dammit!
    You've got an odd definition of almost identical! :)
     
  20. EmperorTiberius

    EmperorTiberius Captain Captain

    Joined:
    Feb 7, 2009
    Ambassadors are stil around, but probably built in small numbers like the Galaxies. How can you expect to see them in the same numbers as Excelsiors, when Ambassadors are right up there in sheer size behind Galaxy and Nebulas?
    If a few of them were destroyed during Dominion War, they would be almost extinct by the end of it.