Conjectural movie era uniforms

Discussion in 'Fan Art' started by Longinus, Dec 7, 2009.

  1. MarianLH

    MarianLH Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    According to this, Fletcher's notes allow division heads to optionally wear the white turtleneck instead of their division color:
    (empasis mine)

    Case in point, Scotty. It's true he didn't start until he was promoted to captain, but Fletcher's example cited McCoy, who was only a commander, so presumably rank is not a factor.

    It was the white turtleneck, combined with the gray slash on the sleeve band, that led me to infer that Saavik was Grissom's chief science officer. She could also be the XO, but the white turtleneck isn't conclusive. In fact, this is the first time I've ever heard anyone suggest it.


    Marian
     
  2. Data Holmes

    Data Holmes Admiral Admiral

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    Read the next line:

     
  3. MarianLH

    MarianLH Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    Okay, yeah, I missed that.


    Marian
     
  4. Data Holmes

    Data Holmes Admiral Admiral

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    That's ok. While I love the work that Fletcher did with trek's uniforms, both the TMP and TWOK series of uniforms, the TWOK series's divisions and division exceptions always bothered me. One they left a little to much open and strayed a little too far from TOS.

    I attempted to fix these problems once for a fan fic I wrote. I changed the division system and exception systems, starting from TOS and working forward.

    Here are my notes on how I changed the system.

     
    Last edited: Dec 14, 2009
  5. Longinus

    Longinus Captain Captain

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    Engineering red? But red is cadets. Besides, Scotty had a yellow shirt...
     
  6. Data Holmes

    Data Holmes Admiral Admiral

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    Engineering was red in TOS, it was red in TMP. Command and operations was yellow/gold/tan in Cage, TOS, TMP. Cadets/midshipmen were Gray in Cage, TOS, and TMP.

    That is one of those continuity changes which drives me up a wall.
     
  7. Longinus

    Longinus Captain Captain

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    Things change..?

    Engineering is yellow in TNG, so having the switch happen at the introduction of TWOK uniforms makes as much sense as it happening later.
     
  8. Data Holmes

    Data Holmes Admiral Admiral

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    The best thing was what they did in TMP which was to dump the division colors from the uniforms all together. That was one of the best things about the TMP uniforms, and why it was such a shame they got dumped on and dropped from later treks, instead of simply improved upon.

    The fanfic, which used the above mentioned division break down, kept that system. I adapted it to the TWOK style uniforms.

    So with the turtle necks (or class C uniform), enlisted and petty officers wear brown. Chiefs and junior officers (warrant to Lt Cmdr) wear "beige", though I refereed to it as khaki. Senior officers (Cmdr on up) wear Blue-gray. All jackets worn over the turtle neck, Ie the ships service jacket (class B) and Service & Full dress (derived from the TWOK monster Maroon) were in Loden Green like Kirk's dress uniform in TMP.

    Class C's displayed division on the TMP like chest insignia. Class B's on the jacket shoulder tabs, And dress uniforms on the shoulder closure strap and on the sleeves (Length of service band for enlisted, chiefs, and warrant, or between the officer's gold sleeve lace.
     
  9. Herkimer Jitty

    Herkimer Jitty Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Well, the shoulder rank tabs, Starfleet arrowhead, and a stripe on the away mission jackets all displayed division colors, IIRC.
     
  10. Data Holmes

    Data Holmes Admiral Admiral

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    Yes, but the whole uniform wasn't division color. Thus all the uniforms are uniform, and you don't have a "magic rainbow" of skittle people.
     
  11. Longinus

    Longinus Captain Captain

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    I can understand that sentiment, but to me primary coloured uniforms are a big part of the iconic Star Trek look, made it sense or not.
     
  12. ncc-1017-e

    ncc-1017-e Captain Captain

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    i have always thought that twok uniforms would have looked much better if they had had the under shirt be the same division colors as in tos. gol. blue and red. have the shoulder strap gold blue or red as well and have the years sevice pins on the shoulder strap. have the badge that is underneath the starfleet symbol be in the same gold blue or red division color as well. lastly have the rank on the sleeves just like tos but use the braid from tmp.
     
  13. RapidNadion

    RapidNadion Commander Red Shirt

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    ^ I'm with you, as far as the (toned down) TOS division colors on the turtleneck and shoulder strap/wrist cuff. But the rest of it would be ... well, I wouldn't like the rest of it. :)
     
  14. ncc-1017-e

    ncc-1017-e Captain Captain

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    ^ i like the rank system from tos.
     
  15. Longinus

    Longinus Captain Captain

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    Red shirts look bad with red jackets though.
     
  16. ncc-1017-e

    ncc-1017-e Captain Captain

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    ^that may be true but they did use that color combination in twok.
     
  17. Tom Riley

    Tom Riley Commodore Commodore

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    The turtleneck looked more orangey than red to me....
     
  18. Longinus

    Longinus Captain Captain

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    Yes, and it did look bad, though I never liked grey shirts either, they just looked like dirty white shirts.
     
  19. Shamrock Holmes

    Shamrock Holmes Lieutenant Commander Red Shirt

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    First I've got to say that I love the "Class B" variations of the TWOK uniform, I think if they had had those options in canon, the combination would be my fav ST uniform ever.

    I've also had some thoughts on the "fix the colors" debate:

    Undershirts in four colors to designate rank:

    White: Admirality.

    Khaki: Commissioned Officers (based on canon Class A jacket lining)

    Red: Cadets.

    Black: Enlisted.


    In addition, department would be indicated by jacket closures etc (as canon) and epalettes on the undershirt according to the following scheme:

    White: Admiralty, Headquarters Staff, Diplomatic Corps
    Gold: Command, Pilots
    Blue: Sciences
    Green: Medical
    Brown: Security. Armory & Weapons Officers
    Red: Engineering and Operations
    Gray: Cadets, Trainees, Trainers, Recruiters

    (NB: Brown is based on the idea that Brown appeared to be the "divisional color" - or at least the one most associated with - the MACOs. Gray and Red are potentially interchangeable but given the weight of history, I'd favor the combination above).

    As far as Rank Insignia go, I like the Enlisted and Flag ranks as is, however I'd suggest a though or two regarding the Commissioned ranks. I like the pins for Captain, Commander and Lieutenant Commander, but I don't like the Ensign, Lieutenant JG and Lieutenant's pins. So I'd use the simpler "commander" pin style for Junior Officers (1 Gold Bar for Ensigns, 2 for Lt JG, 3 for Lt) and the more complex "captain" pin style for Senior Officers (1 Gold Bar for Lieutenant Commanders, 2 Gold Bars for Commanders and the canon three for Captains).
     
    Last edited: Dec 19, 2009
  20. ncc-1017-e

    ncc-1017-e Captain Captain

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    ^ a little confused i am now lol