Compiling episode scores? Scotty, we have a problem.

Discussion in 'Star Trek - Original Series' started by BeatleJWOL, Jan 19, 2013.

  1. Ssosmcin

    Ssosmcin Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    The music examples I listed are off the top of my head. There are more but I don't remember them off hand and I don’t really have time to go through the episodes. They aren't as bad as the sound effect changes, but they were enough that Neil/Indysolo went to the Lasers to do his sound checks and bad enough that I mostly watch the VHS/lasterdisc copies rather than the DVDs or Blu-Rays.
     
  2. The Warlord

    The Warlord Lieutenant Junior Grade Red Shirt

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    Ooh...where abouts?

    Also, for The Doomsday Machine, are you referring to music during Enterprise/space exterior shots?

    Thanks,

    Warlord
     
  3. Ssosmcin

    Ssosmcin Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    In The Deadly Years, Stocker and Spock are having their discussion about the Extraordinary Competency Hearing in the corridor. Once Stocker orders it to get done, Spock enters the turbolift, the sting at the end of the pre-credits of the Doomsday Machine is plastered over the DVD/Blu-Ray print. It's not in the VHS/Laserdisc print.

    The Doomsday Machine alternate music takes are at the end of act three ("he's gone") and the very end of the episode ("One's Enough").
     
  4. Dalen Quaice

    Dalen Quaice Lieutenant Commander Red Shirt

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    Speaking of The Doomsday Machine, off the top of my head I recall that a cue was missing after Spock had some dialogue on the bridge and also there was a place where Scotty was walking in the corridor of the Constellation that was different. Much like ssosmcin, I just do not have the time to sift through the episodes.

    Also, the 2 episodes DVDs had a scene cut entirely in sick bay with Uhura/McCoy in The Tholian Web. It was restored for the box set release.

    As mentioned, the Blu/DVD copies have sound effect changes and additions more often than music alterations.
     
    Last edited: Jan 22, 2013
  5. Ssosmcin

    Ssosmcin Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    The 2 episode DVD version of The Doomsday Machine was missing the music where Kirk "intends to ram her right down that thing's throat." It was restored for all later issues.

    In the Laser/VHS verison where Scotty suggests they check the duplicate captain's log, there's a one second silence just after the cue starts. This was fixed for the DVDs. Beyond that, and other than what I pointed out previously, the music is intact on the DVDs and Blu-Rays.
     
  6. Dalen Quaice

    Dalen Quaice Lieutenant Commander Red Shirt

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    Yes, I own ~ a dozen episodes in 16mm, and I have about half of the series recorded off syndication broadcast from 16mm film chains (which is the way TV stations aired 16mm films). These days, I'm glad I saved the old recordings.

    The "Next Week" title card was changed sometime ~ 1978 when the copyright was reclaimed by Paramount under the Copyright Act of 1976. Also removed around this time was the NBC Logo at the end that followed the Desilu/Paramount logo. Other changes were made to the syndication package ... including the omission of the electronic theme in the opening of early episodes and the use of incorrect opening VO/main titles on some episodes.

    While a normal 16mm print sent to stations was complete, sans the trailer (trailers were on different reels and edited into the episodes, replacing the "Place Trailer Here" slug on the film) often stations would rather poorly hack the episodes to allow for more commercials and never show the trailers or all of the end credits. Not much attention was taken in some markets.
     
  7. mb22

    mb22 Commander Red Shirt

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    I recall viewing episodes syndicated on WPIX (Channel 11) in New York from 1975-78. Besides the hacking up of scenes, there were no trailers or NBC logos to be found.
     
  8. JarodRussell

    JarodRussell Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Would could they possibly be losing by releasing them?
     
  9. Ssosmcin

    Ssosmcin Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    The only time I saw the trailers on broadcast TV (before the Sci-Fi Channel aired them I guess) was during the 1970's reruns from Connecticut (WTNH). They ran the episodes complete with syndicated trailers amd it was an amazing thrill.

    There could be any number of comments on them or information they consider confidential. Or perhaps it's an added cost of securing the rights to release them. Internal documents are company property and, regardless of fan understanding, it's still their right to keep the originals private. They obviously don't mind transcriptions, but balk at releasing the originals. Unless a court issues a subpoena, we might as well just accept it.
     
    Last edited: Jan 23, 2013
  10. Dalen Quaice

    Dalen Quaice Lieutenant Commander Red Shirt

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    The purpose of the cue sheets is to determine royalty payments for BMI/ASCAP and AFM. AFM requires that musicians be paid every 13 weeks... so one might guess that some estates are still receiving payments based on these unless that requirement ends at some point. I am not aware of such an ending date, as long as the music is being used... but I'm not an entertainment lawyer so please chime in if you are more experienced than I am. Certainly they will receive a payment for the repurposing of the music for a CD. My point really is that CBS likely does not want people possibly questioning the royalties. Hollywood accounting has been documented for years -- we know that studios do not always live up to the contract details unless taken to court. Many times, the reason is that the people involved initially leave the studio and those that take over are unaware of existing deals... but nevertheless, it seems to happen.
     
  11. HGN2001

    HGN2001 Commander Red Shirt

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    In Philly, the old WKBS-TV Channel 48 reran STAR TREK as complete and unedited for a time in the early 70s - for at least one complete run through the 79 episodes.

    While I don't recall seeing the NBC snake logo at the end, I DO recall at least one or two instances of the NBC peacock still attached at the front. And I don't think they ran the next episode trailers.

    Also my memory of the trailers is that the first season ones were different than what we see now. The "STAR TREK - NEXT VOYAGES" screen didn't happen until the second season. If memory serves, first season STAR TREK used a more traditional network promo with a voiceover saying "Next week on STAR TREK..." as some scenes played out.

    When they first started either showing the trailers in TV syndication or on home video releases, they rejiggered the first season promos by appending the "Next Voyage" screen.

    As for the assembling of the cue sheets, I think a lot of us with the CD box set would like ANY kind of useful cueing options for the episodes. If it's been slightly reworked - that's a minor consequence in the scheme of things. Just knowing that there's a formula out there for reconstructing any episode's score would be a plus. Whether it was night-of-first-broadcast or not is not of primary concern to most. Most people weren't around when NBC first aired the show (I WAS!), and no-one has accurate enough memories to know for sure which cue goes where.

    What we have these days on the mono Blu-rays, or the DVDs will have to suffice for the re-compilation of such cueing sheets. So get busy guys - while us old geezers are still around to benefit!

    Harry
     
  12. The Warlord

    The Warlord Lieutenant Junior Grade Red Shirt

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    Perhaps if anyone has the time, they could upload those few short clips from The Deadly Years and The Doomsday Machine laserdisc/VHS version so we can compare with the DVD versions? I popped my old Deadly Years tape into the VCR only to have it chewed :(
     
  13. The Warlord

    The Warlord Lieutenant Junior Grade Red Shirt

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    Interesting. Whilst the alternate 'One's Enough' is present on the last disc of season 2, the alternate 'he's gone' (aka 'Goodbye M. Decker') is not.
     
  14. Ssosmcin

    Ssosmcin Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    To be honest, I don't know of it was an alternate take or just an alternate mix of the same piece, mixing down the trumpets at the end. For whatever reason, the DVDs used the version on the original GNP Crescendo CD.
     
  15. The Warlord

    The Warlord Lieutenant Junior Grade Red Shirt

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    I had a listen to my Region 2 DVD, switching between the English and French audio, and yes, assuming the French is the original, un-tampered music track, then yes, the trumpets are definitely toned down on the modified English version.
     

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