Caprica - Grading & Discussion

Discussion in 'Battlestar Galactica & Caprica' started by Agent Richard07, Apr 14, 2009.

?

Grade the pilot...

  1. Excellent

    35.3%
  2. Above Average

    43.0%
  3. Average

    13.0%
  4. Below Average

    4.3%
  5. Poor

    4.3%
  1. ATimson

    ATimson Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    The math still doesn't add up--he'd be done with college eight years before the end of the war.
     
  2. David cgc

    David cgc Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Well, that's what happens when you have to fix things. IIRC, the original script said Caprica was set 52 years before the fall, with an eight-year-old Willy Adama. Then they remembered that, wait, 52 years was when the war started (and when the colonies federalized as a result), not when they cylons were built, and they also got an actor who was too big to pass as eight. So, the opening text gets altered, and the dialogue gets tweaked, and now we suddenly have a Bill Adama who's eight years older than makes any sense.

    Ideally, they'll figure out some more artful way around it when the show goes to series, hopefully without completely cutting the Young Willy (they better start calling him "Billy" soon) character completely. Maybe mention an infant William, and that the twelve-year-old is Adama's older brother. Just dub his name over. ;)
     
  3. DarthPipes

    DarthPipes Vice Admiral Admiral

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    It's funny how all the reviews kept stating this show took place 50 years before BSG when the movie clearly opens with a caption that puts it at nearly 60 years before BSG.

    I know the series bible stated that Adama fought in the last year of the war but I have a feeling they might retcon that. Just like they retconned Tigh not fighting in the war when they made him a Cylon. I can't see Bill Adama staying out the war for years on end. That doesn't fit his character and I also don't see him as some kind of anti-military type in his youth. Though I've never believed that Razor Miniepisodes establishing that his fighting in the original war consisted of one insignificant battle on the last day of the conflict.
     
  4. ATimson

    ATimson Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    So they rounded with a bigger unit than a decade. Boo hoo.

    It's not just the series bible, though; it's Razor as well, as you referenced. Theoretically, he could have fought on the ground or possibly aboard a capital ship earlier, just not in a snubfigher.
     
  5. USS KG5

    USS KG5 Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Why bother, 11YO 58 years before the fall makes Bill Adama a believable 69 in the mini-series and 73 come the end of the show. With futuristic healthcare and a healthy lifestyle all quite logical.

    Any minor references that bother you you cna just rationalise with rounding and estimation. I don't always get years right talking about my life and I'm nowhere near Adama's age.
     
  6. Scout101

    Scout101 Admiral Admiral

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    "Futuristic healthcare"? Did we watch the same series? BSG was pretty ghetto even by 2009 standards...
     
  7. Harvey

    Harvey Admiral Admiral

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    The fleet didn't have futuristic healthcare, to be sure, but Caprica was probably far better off. We already know that the colonies had possession of anti-radiation medication that doesn't exist in the present day.
     
  8. Scout101

    Scout101 Admiral Admiral

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    I'll check out the first couple episodes, but after watching the pilot, I don't love it. Seems like just trading on the names/characters to try and beat a dead horse. None of the stuff I liked about the series is in this one, and even seems like the stuff they're including screws with what was already established, so might end up just taking a pass on this...
     
  9. USS KG5

    USS KG5 Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Why do you think their healthcare was not futuristic? It might have been basic compared to the presumably advanced and amazing hospitals of the colonies, but even basic healthcare in the hnow is better than any healthcare in the 18th century.

    The science in BSG is deliberately made to look basic, but they are way, way in advance of 21st century Earth. Therefore even Cottle's limited resources probably give him abilities we would find pretty impressive.

    The colonies may be 200 years ahead of us in terms of medical technology, they seem to be in every other field of technology. They do however seem to have not cured cancer, or be able to work miracles with Gaeta's infected leg.

    Its a lovely mish-mash IMHO. In some ways they look primitive by our standards but they also have FTL travel! I would rationalise a similar advance in medical tech as in space-travel tech, but your mileage may vary.
     
  10. Dorian Thompson

    Dorian Thompson Admiral Admiral

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    Folks, maybe Caprican live 20 or so years longer than ordinary humans. Some people age better than others. Bill Adama just has good genes is all.
     
  11. Harvey

    Harvey Admiral Admiral

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    As far as Cottle's facilities go, there was nothing in them that would have struck me as extraordinary in the present day. As far as I can recall, anyway. Thus, the RTF didn't strike me as possessing futuristic health care.

    You're right in stating that it makes sense that they would have medical advances over us, but outside of Hera's miracle cure and Helo's anti-radiation meds, we didn't see them.
     
  12. Temis the Vorta

    Temis the Vorta Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    Thanks for keeping the thread going till I got to the party! :rommie:

    I'll give it an Above Average. Not a thrill a minute like BSG, but certainly a very nice evocation of an alternative society - what Kings was trying to do, I guess, but didn't take it nearly far enough. The characters interest me enough to keep me watching and I appreciate this show being actually about sci fi issues, rather than using aliens and spaceships etc as a backdrop for telling an essentially non-sci-fi story, which is a true rarity on TV. Original Zoe seemed like a stupid little brat, but she's dead and her VR sister is much more sympathetic. Eric Stoltz is a great actor, and when Esai Morales gets some more intensive scenes, I'm sure he'll come through as well.

    Quibbles:

    -How are they going to keep Joe Adama central to this storyline? It's really about Graystone and his obsession. Joe can participate by things like arranging murders, I guess, but it's not really what the show is about, and he's supposed to be the central character.

    -It's implausible that Tamara and Joe's wife could ever be adequately resurrected using data that people leave behind in life - that doesn't tell you enough specifics about their personality that you could create believable reactions that would pass muster with family members. Zoe downloaded her actual memories into her avatar; that's what's required for a believable doppleganger. Even sci fi has to have some level of plausibility.

    But I suppose VR Tamara might not have been a good copy - just an approximation that Greystone programmed to be hysterical (not to mention terrible at acting, yikes!) and upset her father enough that he would leave the VR room before realizing the whole thing's a fraud. Good way to manipulate the guy.

    -Why do you need a self-aware robot in order to shoot a target effectively? That seems like a skill where self-awareness and intelligence is irrelevant - it's all about spatial awareness, reaction time and predicting the target's path. I can see the use of self-aware robots in more sophisticated war scenarios, requiring adaptation, strategy and judgement, but that wasn't the test they were giving the Cylon. Plus, if that's the kind of solider you want, why not use the "soldierboy" idea from Forever Peace and have the Cylons remotely controlled by human minds? Caprican society seems fully capable of that level of technology.

    -There was no way that final scene was ever going to be anything but unintentional comedy. :rommie: Here's hoping Zoe gets a "better" body soon or I'm going to have a hard time suppressing the giggles. And speaking of that...

    -How long could it possibly be before the skinjobs naturally will emerge? They've already done the hard part, making a self-aware robot mind. Reasonably believable humanoid bodies should be far easier, especially if there's no need to make them indistinguishable (genetically) from real humans. Even a mannequin-looking Zoe would be far less upsetting than a frakkin' Cylon.

    If Greystone really wants Zoe back, he should take a few strands of hair from her hairbrush (or cells from her corpse, if there was anything of her left, she was awful close to that bomb) and clone a new body for her. It would be a baby, but it'll grow. Maybe they can speed up the growth process or just be patient. Which raises the interesting issue of the "rights" of the clone not to have her memories overwritten (or forestalled) by VR Zoe. But Caprican society certainly must be capable of cloning. Maybe they'll establish that it's been outlawed or something (which wouldn't stop Greystone).

    Hopes for the future:

    -Not sure how Tigh, Anders et al figure into this genesis story for the Cylons, but I'm certainly holding out hope for some guest shots...

    Yeah, I think the allure of space battles held the attention of some of the BSG audience who aren't going to have the patience for extended investigation into the technology and morality of virtual reality and robotics. I'm in for the duration, but I wonder how long that duration will really be?
     
  13. David cgc

    David cgc Vice Admiral Admiral

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    The Final Five arrived at the Colonies just before the end of the first Cylon War, so assuming one in-story year to a season, we should see the Tighs, Anders, Tyrol, and Tory make their guest appearances somewhere around season eighteen. Take that, Doctor Who! :p
     
  14. Temis the Vorta

    Temis the Vorta Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    Damn, no chance of time travel?
     
  15. Agent Richard07

    Agent Richard07 Admiral Admiral

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    The show could always jump ahead a few years.
     
  16. Devnull

    Devnull Captain Captain

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    Insignificant? A battlestar was lost :rolleyes:
     
  17. ATimson

    ATimson Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    I don't think it's the aging that people have issues with. It's sitting out a decade or so of the war.
     
  18. David cgc

    David cgc Vice Admiral Admiral

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    I also don't like that it makes him older than Tigh (you know, in apparent age), since it hurts the flashbacks from "Scattered" and "Valley of Darkness." I doesn't make sense for Saul to be calling Bill "kid" anymore when Bill's a year older than him instead of ten years younger.
     
  19. USS KG5

    USS KG5 Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Well as he is actually a couple of thousand years younger, as you say yourself, its not THAT bad is it?
     
  20. Harvey

    Harvey Admiral Admiral

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    I watched about half of this tonight, but had to turn it off. Too tired to finish. I don't know, it hasn't hooked me like Galactica did. There's been some interesting concepts, but it's not working for me yet. Some of the CGI struck me as shoddy, too.

    I'll have to watch the entire thing from beginning to end before making a judgment, of course, but tell me--does it get better?