Capitalisation of I

Discussion in 'Miscellaneous' started by Miss Chicken, May 13, 2013.

  1. C.E. Evans

    C.E. Evans Admiral Admiral

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    I tend to capitalize Human whenever I'm in a sci-fi discussion about various alien races (if Klingon and Wookie can be capitalized, why can't Human?).
     
  2. Rincewiend

    Rincewiend Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Dutch also has a formal (U) and informal (je/jij) version for you...
    And dot my i's and j's for pretty much the same reason as J.Allen.

    Too be honest, i hardly ever write like this anymore, mostly its a mix of this and block letters/print letters, like the ones you now see on your computerscreen or in the newspaper...
    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: May 14, 2013
  3. Shaytan

    Shaytan Vice Admiral Admiral

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    French doesn't capitalise its formal you (vous). We're rude, never forget that !
     
  4. Roger Wilco

    Roger Wilco Admiral Admiral

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    No, I think that's not what I meant.

    When you're writing a letter, or address anybody specifically in a written form, you're supposed to capitalise the pronoun even if it's a friendly letter between close acquaintances - "Du" just like "Sie".

    It's just that those conventions aren't taken very seriously anymore in informal letters (e-mail specifically, or online message boards).
     
  5. Rincewiend

    Rincewiend Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Oh right, been a while since i had to write or read in German...
    Never could get my head around the rules for when to use ß or ss in a word...
     
  6. Roger Wilco

    Roger Wilco Admiral Admiral

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    That's got to do with pronounciation (fairly straight forward since the last spelling reform, before that it was more random), but it's really subtle, and the Swiss don't use the ß at all as far as I know.
     
  7. rhubarbodendron

    rhubarbodendron Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    OK, that's going to be a long one as I'll try to answer several questions asked in the previous posts:

    The ß / ss in German follows a comperatively simple rule nowadays:
    ß is written after a long vowel. Example: Straße
    ss is written after a short vowel or vowel-combi. Example: Fluss
    The old rule was more complicated:
    ß if pronounced really sharp and always when a consonant follows. Examples: naß, häßlich.
    ss if pronounced softer and when a vowel follows. Examples: Nuss, Flüsse. (exception: when a long vowel goes before the ß it stays: Straße, Muße)

    ===========

    Capitalisation in German is really simple: the first word of a sentence and all names are written with a capital. Nouns are considered names and hence are invariably capitalized.

    A formal address is always capitalized in a letter (You, Your). That's for reasons of politeness. For the same reason we do not capitalize the first person (I / me/ mine/ we /us / our)

    ===========

    Arab has indeed no capitals. Nor have most of the other oriental fonts.

    ===========

    According to a German article I found online, the capital I in English has a second reason beside the one already mentioned:
    at the same time the ic turned into i, an i in the beginning of a word would also occasionally be used to indicate a past participle: what today is 'run', used to be 'irunne' back then. The font used was very narrow (parchment was expensive and you had to save space - paper was not yet known in the western world). This could lead to misunderstandings if the i (I) was getting close to a verb. So they decided to first write the i (I) larger and then to capitalize it.

    =========
    Shaytan, are the Parisians really as rude as rumour has it? I'm starting to learn French in preparation for a trip to Paris and I'd like to know what I am facing.
    Can you give me a few insider tips how to treat Parisians correctly to receive only a minimum of rudeness? I'm the type of tourist who asks before taking photos, who attempts to be very polite and not to stand in the way of people who are in a hurry. I switch off my cell in hospitals, public transport, museums, theatres and churches and never hear loud music or make phone calls in public.
    What other dos and don'ts are there?
     
    Last edited: May 14, 2013
  8. Shaytan

    Shaytan Vice Admiral Admiral

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    That was a joke, we're not that rude, not always ;)
    Try to speak a little French, even only the polite words (s'il vous plait, merci, bonjour, aurevoir). It's always welcome.

    Waiters are not rude, talking to waiters is a play, you just need to know the codes.

    But I think that with your common sense, you will be fine :)
     
  9. Count Zero

    Count Zero Says who? Moderator

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    Yeah, that always trips me up when I read a Swiss paper online because in my head I pronounce the words accordingly and every vocal in front of ss is short.
     
  10. mari

    mari Captain Captain

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    How new is this rule? In my German class in high school, we used ss and ß interchangeably, but mostly ss because most of the kids didn't know how to access other characters on their computers (same in French class, print it out and write the accents on in pen). In retrospect I have some doubts about the competence of that particular teacher. She's pretty much driven the program into the ground the last 15 years.
     
  11. Roger Wilco

    Roger Wilco Admiral Admiral

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    ^^
    Haha, that "rule" you were taught was never correct.

    Large changes in the spelling conventions of the german language happened around 2000 (couple years earlier with a transition period), with some additional changes in the following years.
     
  12. rhubarbodendron

    rhubarbodendron Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    It's from the reform of the spelling reform. I am not 100% sure about the year but I believe it must have been around 2004.
    I much prefer and still use the old spelling. For official papers I am to use the reformed spelling which is why I am fluent in both.

    Merci bien, Shaytan, à l'aide rapide et détaillé :)
    (LOL naah, I am not that good yet. Am still at lesson #1 in my book. I just have a good instinct for the structure of a language so that I can realize where the translation software screws up and correct it accordingly.)
     
  13. Shaytan

    Shaytan Vice Admiral Admiral

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    I forgot : whatever you see in the news today, it's not everyday like that.
     
  14. Spot's Meow

    Spot's Meow Vice Admiral Premium Member

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    I have always dotted my i's and j's. To be honest I don't think I've seen someone not do it. The dots are so integral to those letters!
     
  15. Rincewiend

    Rincewiend Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Yeah, my last German class was about 20 years ago and as i said, i really havent read or written a lot of German since then...
     
  16. Third Nacelle

    Third Nacelle Captain Captain

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    Turkish actually has a dotted i and an undotted ı. The dotted İ is even dotted when capitalized.
     
  17. RoJoHen

    RoJoHen Awesome Premium Member

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    Indeed. I have never seen them without the dot.
     
  18. Spot's Meow

    Spot's Meow Vice Admiral Premium Member

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    Now that's cool. I would love to have capitalized I's with dots.
     
  19. CorporalCaptain

    CorporalCaptain Admiral Admiral

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    My experience with people who don't dot their i's and j's is from when they write in cursive, when of course the pen generally stays down for the whole word, except to go back and dot i's and j's, cross t's and x's, or anything else I've forgotten to mention. I've seen people just skip all or part of that last step.

    Why? I don't know. Maybe they're sloppy, in a rush, getting into the groove of letting their thoughts out, thinking it's perfectly legible without the extra effort, etc.
     
  20. RJDiogenes

    RJDiogenes Idealistic Cynic and Canon Champion Premium Member

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    I never write in cursive, actually. The dots just seem pointless to me (no pun intended :D). It's not that they slow me down when writing-- I'm not usually in a hurry. I just never even think about them. I'm surprised that a lot of people use them.