Buffy's Tom Lenk officially out of the closet

Discussion in 'Science Fiction & Fantasy' started by lvsxy808, Oct 28, 2008.

  1. Guy Gardener

    Guy Gardener Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    There used to be this drug called cocaine in the 80s.

    EVERYTHING seemed like a good idea.
     
  2. Tulin

    Tulin Vice Admiral Admiral

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    This is the part that interested me, since my partner SWEARS that Joss Whedon is gay. He has the look and SO knows how to write for young girls.

    Hmmmmmmmm............
     
  3. exodus

    exodus Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    :guffaw:
     
  4. Kaijufan

    Kaijufan Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Yeah when I was first watching the DVD bonus features for Firefly/Buffy and really didn't know much about him I thought he was gay.
     
  5. Gojirob

    Gojirob Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Andrew was a weak character no matter his preferences. To me, he was JW's version of Gollum, albeit one who survived when he maybe should not have. Xander's last comment about Anya can be seen as being far more snide towards Andrew than her. His devotion to the heartless Warren was sad, whether in friendship or love, and he killed the only person who could stand to be around him (ala Smeagle's cousin). If TL had been directed to speak in a less stereotypical way (my brother had to point him out in Transformers) Andrew might have worked better. Everything in BTVS S7 was more than slightly overdone, in MO.
     
  6. exodus

    exodus Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    I disagree.

    Andrew was the next generation of Xander, despite whatever his sexuality was. Xander had grown up and his humor was becoming more jaded due to his experances. Andrew replaced that, by bringing back whimsy to the show in a season that most needed it. Xander couldn't even cry for Anya upon her death, while Andrew did.
     
  7. Gojirob

    Gojirob Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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  8. exodus

    exodus Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    In other words, Andrew could be a member here.:lol:
     
  9. Trent Roman

    Trent Roman Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Probably the reason why he survived. Andrew wondered, in the finale, why he wasn't the one to have died: that would have provided the appropriate narrative closure, redemptive death, to his story so far. But Andrew's S7 arc was about not treating life like a story, and surviving the final battle when more 'deserving' characters didn't was just another way of disrupting the expected narrative, for the character and the audience.

    What, me over-analyse?

    Creditorly yours, the Rent Woman
     
  10. Gojirob

    Gojirob Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Fair analysis. :techman:
     
  11. OmahaStar

    OmahaStar Disrespectful of his betters Admiral

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    You do realize that was not his first Angel episode, right?
     
  12. Caleuche

    Caleuche Commander Red Shirt

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    Fair point. He was better used in his other episode (much better then on Buffy arguably.)
    Yes and on television they exist more. The weak cowardly coded gay outnumbers the strong gay hero, what, a hundred to one? A thousand to one?
    He was a one note joke in a show that invited the audience to laugh at a guy who wasn't a 'real man' and to stop anyone being too offended he was given his crush on Warren and his implied gayness.
    The stereotypical attributes I was refering to was his feyness, his weakness, his general pathetic nature (highlighted by his nerdiness), his inabilty to fight and his cowardy moments. Now given that Buffys mantra was to subvert sterotypes (A show about the cheerleader/girls saving the guys) this was near unforgiveable and very lazy writing.

    And a background character who was killed off far too early.
    Who as horrible as she may be was never treated as a joke. She was also Willows second girlfriend. When did we see any of Buffy or Angels gay man/men with boyfriends?

    Of course they can, and if it was the directors idea then sorry to the writers, but I believe Andrew actually says something along the lines of 'sometimes its time to try something new/different' (not the exact quote) and then walks off with the girls. I saw this as a suggestion that his implied gayness was only a phase and now he had grown up and matured (which was after all the whole theme of the episode) he had discovered girls. (And yes, I did assume them to be slayers, I also assumed the episode was impling he was sleeping with them.)
     
    Last edited: Oct 29, 2008
  13. exodus

    exodus Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    ^^^Johnathan had all these characteristics as well and wasn't gay.

    What gay character was on Angel?
    Lorne was a demon and owner of a night club but it was never proven what his sexuality was one way or another. His flamboyance fit the type of job he was in much like many big city club owners who aren't gay.

    It was also first believed Wesley (when he was on Buffy) acted gay, same for Giles due to their manerisims but they weren't, were they?

    Joss did a good job showing ones mannerisms doesn't define ones sexuality. It is we the viewing audience that holds onto such stereotypes.
     
  14. Caleuche

    Caleuche Commander Red Shirt

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    Yeah, but...well..you know..um..the fact is...err...

    Damn it!

    There wasn't one which was kinda my point.
    Another good point and I would like to add Lorne was rather awesome as well. He shot Linsey!:lol:
    No, they were English on an American show.
    I still feel it was using those stereotypes that they implied Andrews sexuality which I felt was wrong.
     
  15. Chemahkuu

    Chemahkuu Admiral Admiral

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    I'm only just remembering this now but in one of the issues of Season 8 hes in the middle of a game of strip poker with a lot of half naked really hot Slayers and isn't interested, you have to see the actual frame but the implication is clear. Thats set several months after his appearances in Angel.
     
  16. exodus

    exodus Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    Sorry, you already admitted that Johnathan & Lorne made that point moot.:p
     
  17. Lindley

    Lindley Moderator with a Soul Moderator

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    I need to buy the TPB when it's collected....
     
  18. Bob The Skutter

    Bob The Skutter Complete Arse Cleft Premium Member

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    The first 2 TPBs are already out, the third is out within the next month or so.
     
  19. Ethros

    Ethros Vice Admiral Admiral

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    That scene is in about issue 2 or 3. It was collected ages ago in the first TPB "Long Way Home" (1-5)
    Vol.2 "No Future For You" (6-10) is also out, and Vol.3 "Wolves at the Gate" (11-15) should be out November 19
     
  20. ClayinCA

    ClayinCA Commodore Commodore

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    I resemble that remark. :p