Breaking Bad - Season 5

Discussion in 'TV & Media' started by Agent Richard07, Jul 7, 2012.

  1. Robert Maxwell

    Robert Maxwell Comfortably Numb Premium Member

    Joined:
    Jun 12, 2001
    Location:
    where it hurts
    I would hate to see Walt "redeemed." He has done too many bad things for me to think he can walk back from that at this point.

    I would, however, like to see him broken and alone at the end, and to realize everything he destroyed and lost in the name of "protecting my family."

    I don't think he is "purely evil" or anything like that, since I don't buy into such absolutist silliness, but he has gone down a very dark path that you don't just turn away from and become a model citizen again.
     
  2. Borgminister

    Borgminister Admiral Moderator

    Joined:
    May 30, 2001
    Location:
    California
    That would be the ultimate shark jump, wouldn't it...
     
  3. Robert Maxwell

    Robert Maxwell Comfortably Numb Premium Member

    Joined:
    Jun 12, 2001
    Location:
    where it hurts
    I think it would just be dishonest to give Walt any kind of happy ending. Skyler's not going to miraculously come around and take him back. If Hank, Marie, and Walt Jr. never find out about what Walt's done, I think that'd be a cheat. If Jesse never finds out about Jane, I think that'd be a cheat.

    This is a narrative, after all. His uppance must come, one way or another. How that plays out is anyone's guess, but there is no way he just rides off into the sunset with fortune and family intact.
     
  4. Harvey

    Harvey Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Oct 8, 2005
    Location:
    Los Angeles, California
    I'm honestly not sure if Jesse is going to find out about Jane (and Brock's poisoning) by the end of the series, but I can't imagine a finale that tries to redeem Walt. That's an impossible feat at this point. Walt, Jr. is certainly going to find out about his father, though. The writers have been waiting to play that card for the entire series, and if done well it should be even more devastating than when Hank puts the pieces together.
     
  5. Robert Maxwell

    Robert Maxwell Comfortably Numb Premium Member

    Joined:
    Jun 12, 2001
    Location:
    where it hurts
    Absolutely. Flynn's about the only person who still respects Walt. More than that, I think he's the only person whose respect Walt actually cares about. With that gone, what's he got left? Nothing.
     
  6. sidious618

    sidious618 Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Feb 21, 2005
    Location:
    sidious618
    If anyone is looking for Walt to be redeemed at the end of the show then they're going to be letdown. I don't need to see Walt "punished" at the end, I just want to see the story end how Gilligan wants it to, without him feeling the need to change anything due to fears of how viewers might react.
     
  7. gblews

    gblews Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

    Joined:
    Apr 13, 2004
    Location:
    So. Cal.
    Can't disagree with this.

    But I wouldn't mind (shall we say?) a scene at the end that reminds us of who Walt was when this thing started and how he felt about his family. I'm talking about something small --perhaps as innocuous as the scene in the final episodes of BSG where we saw Boomer "redeemed" in that little flashback right before she was killed. That scene didn't make up for all the bad stuff Booms had done but it did remind us that she hadn't started out to be bad and for "Walter White", that might be really moving -- kinda whipsawing our emotions back and forth.

    I don't think anyone who has watched the show expects or even wants to see anything where Walt ends up "getting away" with his crimes (or is made to look like the good guy in the end) and transgressions. But it would be nice to be reminded of who the old Walt was or possibly even see a final bit of that guy.
     
  8. Dorian Thompson

    Dorian Thompson Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Mar 3, 2003
    Location:
    Oklahoma City, Oklahoma
    If Walt Jr. were to find out about his father and die as a result--suicide or maybe driving off in his car and getting into an accident due to his lack of coordination and being in a devastated emotional state--that could be a powerful comeuppance for Walt. Sure it would be sad if the baby died, but he hasn't known the baby for 16 years. This is his son. His namesake.

    The domino effect could be spectacular for story. Skyler would drop dime on him immediately and go to Hank. A reeling Walter might be driven back to Jesse out of some emotional need to play daddy to the only pseudo son he has left even though he treats him like crap at all other times. The emotional fallout would be spectacular. Jesse might actually feel sorry enough for him to get sucked back in to his orbit.

    Until he finds out about Mike. I don't think the narrative will suffer if Jesse never finds out about Jane and Brock, but Mike is a different story. I'll always believe that Walt was a teensy bit jealous (if only his ego) that Jesse bonded so easily with Mike and respected him instead of respecting Walter at all times. That all could come into play. Good material to be mined. Personally, I'd be satisfied if Jesse shot Walt at the end of it all.
     
    Last edited: Aug 31, 2012
  9. Mojochi

    Mojochi Commodore Commodore

    Joined:
    Aug 18, 2007
    Ultimately, Walt's completion as a character has nothing to do with redemption. He's been too far gone for redemption for a while now, & I don't think there was ever that intention at all. The end for Walt should be all about self realization. He is an intelligent man, far too intelligent to come to his end without fully realizing what he has become.

    Walt is a man of many flaws, egotism, pettiness, selfishness, but his biggest flaw has yet to be spoken of. This entire time, he has barely even noticed how bad he has been breaking. He's nearly blind to the fact that he's changed negatively. In fact, I figure he actually thinks he's become a better & stronger person than he was. I think... perhaps... shooting Mike might have enlightened him to that truth however, in some small way. I can't be sure though, but it might be the 1st pinhole of truth illuminating the man's perspective

    Don't expect anything more on Jesse's dead girlfriend, or the poisoned boy, or any other open ended things from back a ways, because those pawns are off the board, & there shall be no time to drudge them up, in the coming hours of this downward spiral. Jesse's end with Walt will exist unto itself, independent of any of that stuff, that didn't really need resolving anyhow
     
  10. Trubinator

    Trubinator Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

    Joined:
    Dec 22, 2004
    Location:
    Chico, Calif.
    I think there was some misunderstanding about what I meant by "redeemed." I agree he should face the music, but I would also like to see his final act be something good as opposed to going out like he is now. But I would also settle for him finally coming to terms with his transformation ...
     
  11. Harvey

    Harvey Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Oct 8, 2005
    Location:
    Los Angeles, California
    I think the closest we'll get to that is a Falling Down-style, "I'm the bad guy?" ending. But I'm not sure Walt's ego will allow for that kind of self-analysis. Maybe in the final moments, as he sees everything crumble around him.
     
  12. Mojochi

    Mojochi Commodore Commodore

    Joined:
    Aug 18, 2007
    You may be right, but in some way I feel like his character certainly needs an "I did this" moment before it's all over. It could come at the cost of something hugely horrible, like a dead son or god knows what
     
  13. sidious618

    sidious618 Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Feb 21, 2005
    Location:
    sidious618
    Walt has had "I did this" moments but he's able to rationalize his guilt away and at this point he could do it even if he nuked Albuquerque.
     
  14. Trubinator

    Trubinator Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

    Joined:
    Dec 22, 2004
    Location:
    Chico, Calif.
    He seemed to have a somewhat harder time swallowing his killing of Mike. I think that perhaps the more Walter becomes unhinged the more he will see himself for what he is.
     
  15. Mojochi

    Mojochi Commodore Commodore

    Joined:
    Aug 18, 2007
    It just seems like the loss of his own life is not a great enough cost for what he has done now, such that it will be his reality check

    It feels like the only way to complete the character is to have an inescapable moment where his iniquity has earth shattering personal consequences, that finally bring into question everything he's done this whole time, not just instance by instance
     
  16. Dorian Thompson

    Dorian Thompson Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Mar 3, 2003
    Location:
    Oklahoma City, Oklahoma
    The only thing that would accomplish that is the death of one of his children, IMO, whether it be caused directly or indirectly by Walt's new career
     
  17. gblews

    gblews Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

    Joined:
    Apr 13, 2004
    Location:
    So. Cal.
    And in order for that to have any meaning, Walter has to still have real love for his children, something that "some" us thought no longer was the case.
     
  18. gblews

    gblews Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

    Joined:
    Apr 13, 2004
    Location:
    So. Cal.
    Here is what Vince had to say about "redemption" for Walt in an L.A. Times article today:

    I do think he is viewing "redemption" here as Walt making up for the bad he has done, and not as a thing where we are given a reminder that Walt didn't start out to become Scarface.

    But he also said this about the ultimate ending:

    To me, this sounds like we will see a fuller explanation of Walter White and who he was and who and why he became who he became beyond 'he was a very bad guy who in the end got what was coming to him'.
     
  19. InklingStar

    InklingStar Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

    Joined:
    Jul 14, 2003
    Location:
    Olympia, Washington, USA
    Spoiler alert!
     
  20. Mojochi

    Mojochi Commodore Commodore

    Joined:
    Aug 18, 2007
    I can't say I think he never loved his children, but I'm a firm believer that as much as he does love them, he loves himself more, or is so much more obsessed with himself, that he places his own needs & desires above theirs. (At least since the day he learned he had nothing else to lose) That is the worst transgression he's committing, while simultaneously bullshitting himself that he's done all this to help them

    It's true that's there's little evidence to build a working knowledge of the man before his diagnosis, but between the back story, & the few scenes from the pilot, it's apparent he is a man who spent his adult life sacrificing to provide, swallowing his pride, & hating himself for who he was

    Though he loves his family, in the beginning, it's apparent that he was a man that got very little joy from his family. He was a man trapped in a family life, that deep down you could tell he resented. Finding out he'd be dead by 52 was the ticket to ride out his remaining days living any way he wanted, from trashing his boss's car wash, to beating down a kid who mocks his son

    And it doesn't stop. He's lived that way ever since, choosing to play things in ways that benefit him over everyone else. I think the best thing about the scene where he lets Jane die is that you see those wheels turning, from the initial knee jerk reaction of panic that she might die, & he should help her, to considering that it benefits him better if she were to just die

    He knows the right thing to do, by reflex, & is choosing to not do it. It's a new life of complete self interest, & when you're doing that, it reaps consequences on the ones who you claim to love