Ben Sisko’s hair

Discussion in 'Star Trek: Deep Space Nine' started by Captrek, Jul 16, 2009.

?

Which is your favorite look for Ben Sisko?

  1. hair on scalp, not on face

    6 vote(s)
    7.3%
  2. hair on scalp and face

    6 vote(s)
    7.3%
  3. hair on face, not on scalp

    70 vote(s)
    85.4%
  1. Odo's_Bucket

    Odo's_Bucket Commander Red Shirt

    Joined:
    Dec 23, 2008
    Location:
    Deep Space Nine.

    You said "the military usually lets haircuts be as you like". I proved that to be false. Then you claim starfleet had no uniform and appearance standards. I pointed out that they do and we've seen them enforced several times. Seeing some one with adaptations to their starfleet uniform or hair style does not mean there are no regulations. Waivers were made for people like Scotti, Worf, Ro .. ect. So anyone we see in the background who appears to be out of uniform, obviously the character has had such issues wavered in regard to either their religion or cultural tradition. That is something that happens in today's military to an extent in non combat environments.

    The point is : You have no argument.

    Seeing someone who is slightly out of uniform does not mean that the orginaziton for which they wear the uniform is not military.
     
  2. Odo's_Bucket

    Odo's_Bucket Commander Red Shirt

    Joined:
    Dec 23, 2008
    Location:
    Deep Space Nine.
     
  3. DiSiLLUSiON

    DiSiLLUSiON Commodore Commodore

    Joined:
    Apr 7, 2004
    Location:
    The Netherlands
    No, I said "not every military has as many haircut rules, nor is as strict with them as the US military". Seeing as Starfleet is not the US military, those rules would, in all likelyhood, not apply. You also proved only that the US military had certain rules, that does not discount my argument that not every military on this planet has the same rules or regulations, and by extension, that you shouldn't expect something like Starfleet to, if it is a type of military.

    We have also seen that regularly, any appearance standards (we weren't talking about uniforms, but about haircuts) were not enforced. Even from episode to episode. Thus there is no basis in that argument if you only count those shots that support your views, and discount all others.

    You said it yourself; that is a discussion that has been going on for a long while. As such, I did not continue it. Trying to start it up again, because you think your argument is more valid then mine, is silly. Start a new thread for that.
     
  4. Odo's_Bucket

    Odo's_Bucket Commander Red Shirt

    Joined:
    Dec 23, 2008
    Location:
    Deep Space Nine.
    You lie. "the military usually lets haircuts be as you like" is clearly in your post.

    No one is saying that Starfleet is U.S. military. We're only stating that it is military. The example I gave of the U.S. UCMJ was to show that your statement, that "the military usually lets haircuts be as you like" was incorrect. I'm not 'expecting' Starfleet to have the same standards. I'm simply pointing out that, by what has been shown on screen, it's fairly obvious that Starfleet has similar uniform and appearance standards.

    If you haven't seen them enforced then you obviously don't pay enough attention. There are scenes in Star Trek that address both the uniform and appearance standards. That is my point. And yes, hair has been addressed on Star Trek. You contradict yourself by implying that since you believe Starfleet to be without uniform and appearance standards similar to those that exist in today's military, clearly it isn't military. Then you say that not all militaries have the same standards. Then you say that it doesn't matter anyway because Starfleet isn't military, but in case they are it doesn't matter since different militaries have different standards. The facts remain that Star Trek has shown on screen that there are certain uniform and appearance standard and that Starfleet is military organization and that many of the characters have referred to themselves as soldier. That is the point.

    The comment was made that the hairstyles on Star Trek sometimes look bland and conformist. To which I replied that it wasn't strange since hairstyle is usually part of a uniform. You then made the comment that hairstyle is usually only part of a military uniform and that Starfleet is not military. You were wrong on both parts.

    Yes, Starfleet is military. It has been acknowledged and shown on screen that Starfleet is military. Anyone who says that it hasn't obviously hasn't been paying attention all these years. Also, hairstyle is not just part of a military uniform. It is also sometimes part of many other uniforms including Police, Some paramedics services, some Fireman units, some professional sports teams, some styles of prize fighting, and many more.

    You are wrong on both counts, you contradict yourself, and you have no argument.

    My original point, that which eludes you, is that the "bland and conformist" hairstyles shown on Star Trek are not surprising considering that hairstlye is usually part of a uniform.
     
  5. DiSiLLUSiON

    DiSiLLUSiON Commodore Commodore

    Joined:
    Apr 7, 2004
    Location:
    The Netherlands
    I do not lie, since I said "the military". As in, "the military in my country". I'm not based in the US, as the text besides my posts clearly state.

    The rest is all semantics. I don't think Starfleet is military, but that is a different discussion. We've seen examples of haircut regulations being enforced, and we've seen examples of it being overlooked. That does not mean I need to "pay more attention".

    In essense; my point is this: We've seen all sorts of crazy hairstyles on Star Trek; nothing bland about them at all. If they were, you'd have a point. But they aren't, they are often strange.
     
  6. Odo's_Bucket

    Odo's_Bucket Commander Red Shirt

    Joined:
    Dec 23, 2008
    Location:
    Deep Space Nine.
    I'm not the one who said they were bland. So that isn't my point to make. I said that it wasn't suprising to see bland or conformist hairstyles on Star Trek.

    And claiming you didn't say what you actually said is considered lying.
     
  7. DiSiLLUSiON

    DiSiLLUSiON Commodore Commodore

    Joined:
    Apr 7, 2004
    Location:
    The Netherlands
    There you go again; re-read my post. I said exactly what I said, which was "the military" and, after that I said "not every military is the same". You said it yourself. And, seeing as I'm not from the US, I was clearly not talking about the US military. I could have been more clear on the point, by describing it differently, but I thought you'd understand that.
     
  8. Odo's_Bucket

    Odo's_Bucket Commander Red Shirt

    Joined:
    Dec 23, 2008
    Location:
    Deep Space Nine.

    I think you're actually trying to convince yourself.
     
  9. Red Ranger

    Red Ranger Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    May 20, 2005
    Location:
    New York City, the greatest city in the world!
    I'm in the minority -- I like him better with hair on his head and with a beard. -- RR
     
  10. Captain Fine

    Captain Fine Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

    Joined:
    Mar 1, 2002
    Location:
    Toronto, ON
    I voted for option three: beard, "hair on face, not on scalp". But I'd've liked to see him with no hair on his face and none on the scalp.
     
  11. USS Kongo

    USS Kongo Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

    Joined:
    Jan 25, 2006
    I thought he looked much better bald.

    Sean
     
  12. Loupjo

    Loupjo Lieutenant Commander Red Shirt

    Joined:
    May 11, 2005
    I liked Sisko better without hair. He looked cooler & more mature tha way.

    I don't think Starfleet really has much rules regarding to how one should wear one's hair given the multitude of different hairdos we see during the show. It wouldn'be practical anyway because not all of starfleet is human and not all aliens can be expected to wear their hair the same way.

    I always had the impression that Starfleet is pretty relaxed in that way. Yes, Starfleet has rules on uniform (ensign Ro and the story about whether she was permitted to wear the earing or not) but captains and commanders seem to allow considerable leeway when it comes to those rules (Troi's Uniform, Worf's sash, Ro's earring, O'Briens sleeves rolled up :) etc)
     
  13. NathanielM

    NathanielM Captain Captain

    Joined:
    Jul 14, 2007
    Location:
    Phoenix AZ
    Well hell what happened to the gerry curl and the big ol FRO! Shieeet




     
  14. Deckerd

    Deckerd Fleet Arse Premium Member

    Joined:
    Oct 27, 2005
    Location:
    the Frozen Wastes
    I don't get head shaving. It always makes the person look older and more boring.
     
  15. DevilEyes

    DevilEyes Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

    Joined:
    Jun 9, 2009
    Location:
    basking in the warmth of the Fire Caves
    Re: Ben Sisko’s hair

    Not at all. And actually, it definitely has the opposite effect if the guy is already balding. Who do you think looks younger, stronger and sexier: a balding guy, or a guy with a shaved head? And even when they are not balding, some men just don't look that great with hair, and head shaving only makes them look more striking and more badass. Compare Michael Jordan with and without hair. Avery Brooks is another good example.
     
  16. Deckerd

    Deckerd Fleet Arse Premium Member

    Joined:
    Oct 27, 2005
    Location:
    the Frozen Wastes
    It's a stereotype. My husband has male pattern baldness and he keeps his hair cropped really close. It looks fine. If he shaved his head he would look like a prat.
     
  17. DevilEyes

    DevilEyes Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

    Joined:
    Jun 9, 2009
    Location:
    basking in the warmth of the Fire Caves
    Re: Ben Sisko’s hair

    Depends on the individual. A shaved head makes some men look like thugs. Others look much better without any hair on their heads, Avery Brooks being one of them.