Battlestar Galactica 4x18: "Islanded in a Stream of Stars"

Discussion in 'Battlestar Galactica & Caprica' started by Agent Richard07, Mar 6, 2009.

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Grade the episode...

  1. Excellent

    26.2%
  2. Above Average

    41.9%
  3. Average

    22.5%
  4. Below Average

    7.3%
  5. Poor

    2.1%
  1. sidious618

    sidious618 Admiral Admiral

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    I'm at the point where I think it'd be funny if Ron didn't answer any of the questions in the three hour finale just so I could see the shitstorm here.
     
  2. Gregsmack

    Gregsmack Captain Captain

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    I've seen your posts, and while I disagree with your opinions on the episodes I don't necessarily have a problem with what you write. Generally I don't have a problem with what anyone one poster writes. It's just that once one person makes a trite criticism it snowballs into the entire thread.

    There's a lot of work that goes into each episode, and I think every scene has enough going on that an entire episode's worth of them can easily spark at least 20 pages of good thread discussion -- anything from plot to direction to dialog to whatever! There's a LOT to talk about, and this is why we're all here anyway. The problem is that most posters tend to ignore a lot of what goes on in each episode, and instead use the word 'filler' like a reflex if there are no momentous plot-changing events. And then in the end, discussions end up being about everything but what we've seen in the specified 45 minutes of screen time.

    I find that, after a while, the good discussion eventually comes out. I understand that most fans are excitable as each episode airs because I am too, so sometimes it's difficult for a discussion to stay objective and actually critical (as opposed to complaining). Once the series ends I think a lot of people will be able to grasp the whole a lot better (me included). Whether or not anyone will enjoy it is a matter of taste, but at least we'll have a complete understand of what exactly this series was supposed to mean.

    Also, just so I don't come off as an apologist for the show's flaws, I want to say that even though I am one of the BIGGEST BSG fans around and I genuinely think that for the most part this series has been excellent -- among the best in TV's history, even -- I am still skeptical that RDM and co will be able to pull this finale off. I don't necessarily think there's a reason for them NOT to, but I've seen weirder things happen. That being said, I like to stay critical of things. I want this show to earn it, because I really think it can.
     
  3. Mr Awe

    Mr Awe Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    I'm not sure who these mystical people are who are expecting a happy ending? That's really not BSG's style and I don't think most people are expecting one.

    I've posted this before, but, the happiest ending that's reasonably possible is that the colonials get to colonize a new world while not being harrassed by Cavil's forces. They're looking at basically a planet bound, subsistence living for awhile until they can rebuild a technological civilization. That's the best case! To do that, they have to both find a planet and keep Cavil's forces away.

    The possibilities get worse from there . . .

    Mr Awe
     
  4. startrekwatcher

    startrekwatcher Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Lost is better in any number of ways IMO:
    -it balances expertly both character and plot much better

    -it is much more imaginative in its concepts and ideas

    -it has better plot twists and revelations

    -it unabashedly embraces its mythology and its serialized nature to where it dedicates every episode to it not just ever so often. Lost is a series that actually makes the most of serialization in a way I've really never seen before.

    -it actually remembers its numerous threads and develops them whereas BSG which isn't nearly as ambitious in terms of what it has to keep up with forgets them or drops them altogether.

    -It has a cast as large as BSG but it juggles them around giving them more to do and bringing them more effectively into the story than BSG.

    -the writers are better at making material fit in the episode without losing important scenes.

    -it is better paced and covers ground like there is no tomorrow. Every episode is crammed to the point where it is overflowing with story.

    -it has mastered alternating storylines to the point where every thread is engaging and holds your interest.

    -it knows how to develop a season long arc and to actually execute a slow burn and build up to the finale instead of the puttering BSG has a bad habit of doing.

    -It has far more characters you actually care about

    -It doesn't resort to the stylish pretentious habit that BSG has of the close up shaky camera on the actor as their face contorts in a grimace in order to notify the audience that a dramatic scene is in progress.:lol:

    -Its villians are much more interesting. I'll take Ben or Widmore over Zarek or the Cylons.

    -And from a purely structural standpoint Lost is a work of art and form as far as its assembly. How the writers put each episode and season together of such a complex series with the grueling demanding schedule of a weekly network series impresses the hell out of me.

    -And most importantly it is more fun and entertaining.
     
  5. Mr Awe

    Mr Awe Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Shrug, ok. In my opinion, the lack of planning and attention to the plot as the show progressed is the reason why we're now left with the last three episodes which had some nice character moments peppered throughout but not much else.

    We've got watered down soup. The writers didn't come up with enough plot to last to the end of the series. So, they take there characters, put them together, have them shout and cry, reminisce, etc. Now, nothing wrong with those character moments and they actually came off pretty well. But, the series suffers when that's the majority of the material.

    You're free to be happy with less however.

    Mr Awe
     
  6. DarthPipes

    DarthPipes Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Mar 3, 2006
    One thing in fairness to BSG but I think it was a mistake for Sci-Fi to give them twenty episodes a season. Those kind of dramas function a lot better with a 13-episode run where the storylines are a lot tighter and there's less filler. BSG started losing focus and control over continuity when it expanded to 20 episodes. I wish Sci-Fi had kept BSG at 13 episodes per season.
     
  7. Ayelbourne

    Ayelbourne Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    Apr 25, 2005
    It's possible, but not neccessary. It's not "less", it's just different.
    You like to have it both ways and thats fine. But just because BSG episodes like this one isn't your cup of tea because of that, doesn't mean its bad writing.
    It just isn't your taste, thats all.
     
  8. EliyahuQeoni

    EliyahuQeoni Commodore Commodore

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    As with all of this, that is a matter of opinion. I love Lost, but have always found BSG to be far more entertaining. I'm not going to list the reasons why, because I don't feel the need to justify my enjoyment of the show or try and convince anybody that their opinion is "wrong."
     
  9. scotthm

    scotthm Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    That's assuming the series ends in the near future. What if the series ends 1,000 years in their future, after civilization is booming again? They may have generations to go before Cylons are built again--presuming the cycle hasn't been ended. It doesn't have to end on a sour note.

    To be honest with you, at this point, I'm not expecting a very satisfying ending.

    ---------------
     
  10. Cyrus

    Cyrus Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    I see I am not the only one that was reminded of V'ger. Was that the colony or just a huge Cylon spaceship?
     
  11. Corran Horn

    Corran Horn Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Weird, I thought it was a Borg Unimatrix.
     
  12. sidious618

    sidious618 Admiral Admiral

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    Eh, otherwise than John Locke non of Lost's characters match the excellence of Adama, Roslin, Tigh and Tyrol in terms of character arc. Plotwise the whos are different and it's tough to compare.

    Not much I can argue with there otherwise than to say that I disagree.

    That's like saying that The Twilight Zone has better spooky stories than The West Wing. BSG isn't all about big plot twists. As far as revelations go nothing on Lost can beat Crossroads, Parts One and Two when it comes to revelations. Locke's wheelchair reveal comes close but it occurred so early on when we didn't have as much attachment to the character.

    There were tons of episodes during the first three seasons that did not do that.

    Examples?

    Dude, they wrote Claire out for a whole season. :lol:

    Eh, I don't think that's much of anything.

    But BSG is moreof a character show than a plot show. Always has been.

    Uh, no. The flashbacks were hit and miss. Kate is always boring. The Oceanic Six onland stories left a bit to be desired.

    BSG is firing on all cylinders in my book.

    Uh uh. I love Locke but otherwise than him none of the characters match Laura, Bill and Tigh for me.

    I think it works fabulously.

    Again, apples and oranges.

    Now that they have shorter seasons. When Lost had longer seasons they struggled quite a bit.

    Like most of your points that's too subjective.
     
  13. tomalak301

    tomalak301 Admiral Premium Member

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    I'm curious about something. I've barely watched Lost (More like never other than a few clips here and there) and people call it the most imaginative, creative thing on TV. Now not knowing the context, I do know that the show has been doing a time travel theme lately. Given people's attitudes about time travel in Star Trek, and how that theme is such an old plot device anyway, why do people praise Lost so much again?
     
  14. Saul

    Saul Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    This episode was fine. I also didn't think we needed to see another Adama break down since it's been done before and it doesn't have the same impact as it did the first time. Also we've been seeing him get emotional about things these past few weeks.

    I felt the episode needed something a bit more. More Cavil scenes, something outside the ship. I guess they needed to save money for the final but these episodes prior will not be memorable when we look back.
     
  15. TheGodBen

    TheGodBen Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    I've watched Lost since it first aired in my country four years ago and I've been a fan since the third episode. I love the show, I think it is good popcorn entertainment which has moments of greatness, but I prefer BSG.

    Sometimes, certainly not in its first three seasons. I was so unbelievably pissed off back in season one where they had a big cliffhanger moment where they introduce the hatch, and the next week they don't advance that story at all but rather tell a stupid story about how Kate is a whiny bitch who needs to be hit repeatedly with a shovel until she stops moving. :brickwall:

    What is Lost about, exactly? It is a show about a battle for control over a magical island. It has time travel, electromagnets which can destroy the world, smoke monsters... It is ridiculous crap, but it is entertaining and is very well produced.

    BSG, for all its flaws, tries to be about something and it has ever since Adama gave his "worthy for survival" speech in the miniseries. It has since become a show about the inherent destructive nature of mankind and how we are doomed to repeat a cycle of war. I can't judge whether it will all work out until I see the finale, but I still have to give them credit for trying.

    I have to agree with sidious, Crossroads did contain the mother of all revelations. Lost has some excellent twists (Michael shooting Anna-Lucia and Libby, Ben shooting Locke, the flash-forward in Through the Looking Glass), but I still don't think they are at the same level as Crossroads.

    And Lost has an annoying habit of ending every episode on a cliff-hanger, even if it isn't very good. Ben revealing how he would trick and capture Sayid if he was an Other back in season 2 was very well acted, but the next episode begins by him saying that he was only joking. :wtf: If you don't have a cliff-hanger then don't pretend that you do.

    Kate's story has never held my interest. :p

    If Locke was written out then I probably wouldn't care about the show anymore. Desmond, Sayid and Sawyer are all okay, Jack is much better now than he was in the early seasons, but Locke is the glue that keeps me stuck to the show. I'll elaborate about Ben below.

    No. Ben was great back in season 2 when we was pretending to be Henry Gale, he quickly became my favourite character on the show. But in season 3 he became very boring until Locke showed up about half-way through the season. He was okay in season 4, he was magnificent in The Shape of Things to Come, but so far in season 5 his only good scene was with Locke.

    Ben is a great character when paired with Locke, but once you remove Locke from Ben's story he just becomes a boring character. Ben is Locke's antagonist, he isn't good at being anything else.

    As for Widmore, he has been in a handful of episodes and has never struck me as being all that interesting.

    Baltar is the villain of BSG, and he is far better than either Ben or Widmore. He is a good guy whose demons keep on forcing him into doing the wrong thing. He is a narcissist who hates what he is, he is a great character who has been badly utilised this season.

    And that is almost all it is. It is a fun show with great character moments, but it is closer to The Da Vinci Code than Lord of the Flies.
     
  16. Mr Awe

    Mr Awe Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Characters moments < Character moments plus tight plotting

    By definition, it is less. It's harder to do both simultaneously, but that's why it is better.

    Mr Awe
     
  17. Myasishchev

    Myasishchev Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    :lol: This made me chuckle.
     
  18. Mr Awe

    Mr Awe Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    For me it works. Give it Lost a try from the beginning on DVD. Watch it in order. Given your posts, I think you'll like it. As I've said, I prefer BSG's premise but end up enjoying Lost more because the execution is so much better. At least it has been for the last couple of years. There was one year or so where Lost didn't get it quite right. Too much stalling, or filler, as we're calling it here with character moments. Sound familiar? But, unlike BSG, the Lost writers adapted and man oh man the series has really been banging away on all cylinders. So, don't give up on it when you get to that patch of filler episodes.

    Mr Awe
     
  19. Myasishchev

    Myasishchev Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    I guess Sixes and Eights are prettier than Threes and... crap, I actually forgot their numbers. I know they're Fours and Fives only through process of elimination, that's how long it's been.

    Leoben's been out since Earth, too.
     
  20. ialfan

    ialfan Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    I think it's pretty crappy how the only Cylons that have any kind of significant screentime are the Ones, Threes, Sixes, Eights and final five. Simon, Doral and Leoben have been really neglected. For me Leoben not appearing in the last few episodes as part of the work party on Galactica is really noticable as well as Simons lack of anything since New Caprica. Has he even spoken since then?
     

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