Battlestar Galactica 4x16: "Deadlock"

Discussion in 'Battlestar Galactica & Caprica' started by Agent Richard07, Feb 20, 2009.

?

Grade the episode...

  1. Excellent

    7.1%
  2. Above Average

    26.4%
  3. Average

    46.7%
  4. Below Average

    14.2%
  5. Poor

    5.7%
  1. Samuel T. Cogley

    Samuel T. Cogley Vice Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Nov 7, 2001
    Location:
    Hold still, Jim.
    What I find incredibly frustrating is that, months ago, we saw a bunch of articles talking about how the creators of this show went to The Sci-Fi Channel and said that some/all of the last ten episodes were going to run long. Sci-Fi allegedly said, "No problem, we'll let them run past the hour mark."

    I remember thinking how incredibly cool that was. Not only because the creators had a lot of extra stuff to put in, but also because Sci-Fi was going to do something failry unprecedented and just let them roll with it. One wonderful thing about this show is the (mostly) harmonious relationship between Sci-Fi and BSG. That usually doesn't happen, and I can't help but think that relationship contributed to the quality of the show.

    So what the frak happened to our longer episodes? Did Sci-Fi reverse their earlier position? It was pretty clear in the articles that they weren't just talking about a longer finale.

    Feels like a missed opportunity. (Or ten missed opportunities.)
     
  2. Samuel T. Cogley

    Samuel T. Cogley Vice Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Nov 7, 2001
    Location:
    Hold still, Jim.
    Well, he may have forgotten since that interview, especially since he had decided not to go there. :lol:

    I'm less concerned about RDM remembering Iblis than I am about him putting Iblis in this show. And if he does, I suspect it will bear so little resemblance to the original Iblis that we won't really notice or care.
     
  3. Zane Gray

    Zane Gray Commodore Commodore

    Joined:
    Jul 3, 2002
    Location:
    Huh? What day is this?
    I actually really liked the episode. I know everyone loves the big action episodes, but that's never really been the point on NuNSG. Given all the action and major revelations we've had after the last few episodes, a character episode is just what we need to see how everyone is dealing with these events. I also quite like everyone's struggle to deal with the fact that the Humans and Cylons need each other now, like it or not. Their fates are tied together now, and the crews are already integrating whether anyone is really ready for it or not. I also LOVE the fact that when Ellen comes back as the "Final Cylon" privy to all the big answers, she's still just as petty and petulant as she ever was. The point of all this seems to be that Humans and Cylons... there's really no difference between them anymore. The only way to break the cycle is to find a way to live together as equals. And that isn't going to be easy.
     
  4. Robert Maxwell

    Robert Maxwell Comfortably Numb Premium Member

    Joined:
    Jun 12, 2001
    Location:
    where it hurts
    I don't think anyone was complaining about the lack of action, just that this episode didn't really do much to advance the "big picture." It felt like filler with a few worthwhile moments. Not terrible by any stretch, it just feels like things should be moving much faster with so few hours left to go.
     
  5. Hermiod

    Hermiod Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Mar 16, 2006
    I gave this an Above Average. Sure, it wasn't exactly "Exodus, Part Two" in terms of action but I don't mind that.
     
  6. DarthPipes

    DarthPipes Vice Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Mar 3, 2006
    I'm not a fan of the alcoholic and pill-popping Adama. Its not interesting development for his character and it just seems lazy to me. I think it's very reasonable for him to hit his breaking point. After the last couple of years, how can he not? But I'm not in the mood to see every character destroy themselves and I've always felt that the writers on this show do some of the dark storylines that they do simply for the sake of doing a dark storyline.

    Right now, it's a boring as hell storyline.
     
  7. Gregsmack

    Gregsmack Captain Captain

    Joined:
    Mar 20, 2007
    Location:
    Toronto, Ontario
    Rob Maxwell:

    Part of me agrees with you but part does not. Coming closer to the finale, most series tend to ramp up and drive towards their resolution. But BSG has already reached its primary resolution. They've found Earth and have since moved on - they did not find the quick fix they expected or needed. It's a major disappointment. I might argue that the series is in epilogue mode now, and as such there is no clear-cut goal or ending to be driven towards. What we're seeing in 4.5 is fallout and patchwork and our heroes are just going to have to settle for less and fix their problems realistically. Frankly, I will be very surprised if the ending culminates the series into a bow -- that was what 'Revelations' was for. I personally am expecting a finale that is somewhat conclusive, but more suggestive of what is to come in the series' off-screen future.

    While I sometimes might feel the plot is going nowhere, what I have to think about is where it's supposed to be going anyway? If the viewers feel a bit adrift in all this it's because the characters themselves are pretty much in the same situation. Truth be told, I can't think of another series off the top of my head that has structured its narrative like this. The 'Deadlock' episode may have been slightly underwhelming, but as a whole I find 4.5 to be a very interesting bit of storytelling.
     
  8. kipron

    kipron Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

    Joined:
    May 20, 2001
    Location:
    Australia
    Okay sure, the show is ending. But the characters don't know that.

    This was a good character piece and - imo - exactly what we needed after the slightly silly, plot-driven randomness of last week. I felt like I was watching something from HBO. I can think of no better compliment for any tv series.

    Above Average.
     
  9. Samuel T. Cogley

    Samuel T. Cogley Vice Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Nov 7, 2001
    Location:
    Hold still, Jim.
    I think the deteriorating Adama is supposed to exactly parallel the deteriorating Galactica. Galactica is an extension of Adama. And they are both having to reach absolute bottom before they will -- and reluctantly at that -- accept help from their former enemies, which is the only thing that can save them, and it may be too late, even for that.

    That's why I love the scenes where Adama is watching the Galactica repairs. He has to see for himself -- to physically touch the ship -- to realize just how bad the damage is, and his painful acceptance of "the Cylon solution" exactly mirrors his own internal struggle of having to accept help from the Cylons to save what's left of the fleet.

    I think we needed to see the cracks, the metal fatigue, the warped bulkheads. They represent the damage Adama's own body has suffered. And he needed to see it. And he needed to touch the cracks after they were filled in with Cylon goo. He needed to see and feel it. To believe that it was necessary. And to believe that he had actually allowed it to be done. And to hopefully confirm that the solution was working. It was like needing to touch Jesus' wounds, in order to believe that these events were actually happening.

    I'm surprised that some people felt that they showed too many "Adama reaction shots" in this respect. Some of those scenes were only a few seconds long. And I think that if they hadn't shown enough scenes, we wouldn't have bought it. We wouldn't have realized the extent of the damage. We wouldn't have bought into the need to rely -- in desperation -- on the Cylon goo. And we wouldn't have believed that they pulled off a miraculous repair job in such a short period of time. We had to see it. And we had to see Adama work through it, mentally.

    Having to err on either the side of people feeling that they showed a little too much of it, or on the side of people rejecting that it was necessary and that they accomplished the repairs because they didn't see enough of it, I would easily err on the side of the former. I'm sure the writers balanced that same equation.
     
  10. anti-matter

    anti-matter Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

    Joined:
    Jan 5, 2002
    Location:
    canon violation
    in & out...

    ...damn I missed both showings and Hulu isn't showing 'Deadlock', hope I can catch it tomorrow night. I can't wait to read all your comments.

    Woe is me.
     
  11. Samuel T. Cogley

    Samuel T. Cogley Vice Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Nov 7, 2001
    Location:
    Hold still, Jim.
    Can someone help me with a line interpretation:

    When Adama and Tigh are hugging at the end...

    TIGH: "Liam. His name was Liam."

    ADAMA: "It's a good name. Short for William."

    TIGH: "Yeah... It's not like that, I know."

    What does Tigh mean by "It's not like that."

    Clearly, the implication of the scene was that Tigh was -- in a not too obvious way -- naming his son after William Adama.

    But Tigh's line seems to cut the other way. Or does Tigh mean something else?

    I'm not understanding the meaning.
     
  12. Gregsmack

    Gregsmack Captain Captain

    Joined:
    Mar 20, 2007
    Location:
    Toronto, Ontario
    Shit son, I thought the man said "It's not like Zach" with Zach being Adama's own dead son. Either way, the line is slightly unclear to me.
     
  13. Robert Maxwell

    Robert Maxwell Comfortably Numb Premium Member

    Joined:
    Jun 12, 2001
    Location:
    where it hurts
    He said "It's not like Zack," actually. Meaning Six's miscarriage is not entirely comparable to Adama losing his adult son, but it didn't matter to either of them at that moment. I thought it was a touching scene, and as someone who's lost a potential child to miscarriage, the pain definitely is real.
     
  14. Berg417448

    Berg417448 Commander Red Shirt

    Joined:
    Aug 19, 2007
    I thought he said "It's not like Zack" as well. I think the confusion stems from the fact that the TV closed captioning displayed the line as "It's not like that."
     
  15. Samuel T. Cogley

    Samuel T. Cogley Vice Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Nov 7, 2001
    Location:
    Hold still, Jim.
    Shit, that makes a lot more sense. That's what I get for trusting the damned closed captioning. :lol:
     
  16. Gregsmack

    Gregsmack Captain Captain

    Joined:
    Mar 20, 2007
    Location:
    Toronto, Ontario
    They oughta be more careful for the sake of fandom everywhere. Imagine a frak up like that at the end of Sometimes a Great Notion. "Helen.. you're the fifth?"

    HELEN? WHO'S HELEN? The internet would consume itself.
     
  17. Robert Maxwell

    Robert Maxwell Comfortably Numb Premium Member

    Joined:
    Jun 12, 2001
    Location:
    where it hurts
    Hogan has always vacillated between saying her name like "Ellen" and "Helen." I've never understood why.
     
  18. Rii

    Rii Rear Admiral

    Joined:
    Jul 22, 2008
    Location:
    Adelaide
    Below Average. There's nothing wrong with filler, some of my best friends are filler, but this was oddly disjointed filler and none of the individual pieces were all that interesting.

    The change in Ellen's disposition from last week was rather disconcerting also, although that's perhaps more the fault of the previous episode than this one.
     
  19. freak

    freak Commodore Commodore

    Joined:
    Nov 17, 2005
    Location:
    stationed at NCIS post Voyager.
    That's exactly what I was thinking as well!!!!! "deadlock" as well as "someone to watch over me" I was thinking: HEY! Voyager has some episodes of the same names!!! WEIRD!

    All in all, I liked this episode. However, I didn't know there was a #7. I bet it's Kara Thrace. I could be wrong. But hopefully we'll all know the truth in the next four weeks. This episode was ok..it wasn't wonderful and it wasn't bad either. I'm wondering why Anders isn't regaining consciousness though. And was saddened that #6's baby didn't make it. :(
     
  20. WeAreTheBorg

    WeAreTheBorg Vice Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Jul 28, 2004
    Location:
    Sector 001
    This one felt kinda wierd. I got the same vibe from this episode as I might from an episode of "Heroes", as in, plot developments that seem odd or out of character, and a larger than life scope that isn't properly communicated.