Bajoran Militia and training.

Discussion in 'Deep Space Nine' started by WesleysDisciple, Feb 14, 2013.

  1. WesleysDisciple

    WesleysDisciple Lieutenant Commander Red Shirt

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    heres a question I had for some time.

    It suggests in DS9 That the bajoran militia would be integrated into starfleet


    Ideas on how to deal with the fact many bajoran militia members do not have much education?

    Before that...

    Something ive wondered about a lot is how when the resistence groups created the provisional government they decided who got what rank, since a lot probaly nominated themsleves for high office.

    thoughts?
     
  2. Lindley

    Lindley Moderator with a Soul Moderator

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    "Your job is to do everything, short of violating the Prime Directive, to ensure that they are."

    It's right there in the pilot. Federation membership takes time, and part of the process is gradually adapting training to a common basis. Same as any merger.
     
  3. Loskene

    Loskene Lieutenant Junior Grade Red Shirt

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    Well they are a space capable society with 7 years to catch up, since they you have computers, transporters and starships and know how to use them. I pretty sure they could catch up pretty darn quick.

    Bajorians are not exactly the picture of stupidity, they managed to drive the massive Cardassian Empire off their planet.
     
  4. Pavonis

    Pavonis Commodore Commodore

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    The Bajoran Militia has plenty of training. The members who didn't pass their training died at the hands of the Cardassians, is all.

    That they weren't trained in the same way as Starfleet officers is no reason to discount their intelligence. They're educated by hard experience.

    Most of the senior resistance fighters probably did end up as colonels and generals, but why not? They were probably already acting as the equivalent of flag officers anyway.
     
  5. T'Girl

    T'Girl Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Do wonder where you got this?

    :)
     
  6. WesleysDisciple

    WesleysDisciple Lieutenant Commander Red Shirt

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    Well how ELSE did the provisional government come about?
     
  7. Timo

    Timo Admiral Admiral

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    Well, the collaborators would have much more experience in governing...

    Depending on how dire the organizational needs of Bajor were at the beginning of independence, the only practical choice might well be to beg for the collaborators to keep up the good work, since the heroes of resistance would realize none of them knew how to keep food flowing to those in need.

    Certainly we never learned of any wholesale slaughter of collaborators once the Cardassians fled. Some of the collaborators slithered into the woodwork, some were declared non grata in absentia ad hoc, but stories of open, violent deposing are missing.

    Perhaps significantly, we never quite learned whether the provisional government differed from what Bajor had before the occupation or not. But we heard of no changes in government in "Accession" when Akorem Laan made Bajor return to the old ways for a brief while. It would make sense, then, that the provisional government would be quickly erected using the time-honed traditions of the caste society. In such a case, a resistance strongman might have a say on which born-to-lead politician got which seat in the new government, but he would have no real chance of sitting there himself.

    Timo Saloniemi
     
  8. Pavonis

    Pavonis Commodore Commodore

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    Though the government of Bajor was often referred to as "provisional", in what sense was it meant?

    Was it that people were serving provisionally until elections were held? But elections were held at least by the third season of DS9, supposedly more than three years after the Occupation! Surely that's long enough to establish a real government.

    Was it provisional in some other sense - perhaps governing only Bajor and not all off-world Bajorans? What was the relationship between Bajoran refugees and their government?

    Was it provisional because it had no official constitution yet? But we never heard of any constitution of the Bajoran government, and yet it was all-but-accepted into the Federation (with only signatures lacking on paperwork)!
     
  9. Wally

    Wally Lieutenant Commander Red Shirt

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    Granted this occurred non-canon novels, but the integration of the Bajoran militia into Starfleet really without any large issues. But this does not happen to everyone, Bajor still has its own militia like that of many Federation planets still retain their own forces.
     
  10. WesleysDisciple

    WesleysDisciple Lieutenant Commander Red Shirt

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    The ones declared non grata HAPPENE to be those who held positions in the occupational government...

    Im guessing that the Spiritual leaders probaly helped to organize things.
     
  11. Timo

    Timo Admiral Admiral

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    But at that point, the government indeed ceased to be referred to as "provisional".

    Never really explained. That would have been an interesting subject, considering TNG made a big deal of the mass exodus of Bajorans. When the refugees of "Ensign Ro" returned, what did they find? Were their old homes waiting for them? Or had they been appropriated by others? Nationalized by the provisional government? How many chose not to return?

    For all we know, the Bajoran government is a spiritual one, and the Vedek Council is the main executive element there. Even Bajoran "Ministers" might be clergymen, and Shakaar would be the one modernist exception to that... Unless he were a clergyman from a religious caste by birth, too?

    Timo Saloniemi
     
  12. WesleysDisciple

    WesleysDisciple Lieutenant Commander Red Shirt

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    oh heres a point?

    I dont think the Illyan proclamation Held.

    it was Trial in absentia... and I think With Kira's influence... it would be neat, if after what she went through in the early 6th season, with the station occupied by a joint cardassian dominion occupation force, she in her epipheny, convinced the government, to at least grant each collaborator who was found a trial.
     
  13. Timo

    Timo Admiral Admiral

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    Yet Kira in "The Darkness and the Light" was particularly unrepentant about the occupation/resistance thing. If five years of dealing with the ambiguities of the post-occupation era hadn't weaned her of that, I doubt the second occupation would really make a difference, either. For all she cared, collaborators still deserved eternal exile, just as in the titular second season episode.

    Of course, the second season was an early stage of the post-occupation history of the planet, and all sorts of forces could have been at play to reverse the Proclamation later on. But Kira being one of those? Doesn't ring true.

    Timo Saloniemi
     
  14. Pavonis

    Pavonis Commodore Commodore

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    Did it? I don't remember whether the "provisional" was dropped from the references to the Bajoran government after Shakaar's election. It would make sense if it were.
     
  15. WesleysDisciple

    WesleysDisciple Lieutenant Commander Red Shirt

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    Oh Think Kubus actualy made it to bajor or that Winn, once she became Kai, changed her mind?
     
  16. Dover

    Dover Lieutenant Junior Grade Red Shirt

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    My guess would be that whoever had the influence to declare themselves generals would then have decided how to organize the former resistance members under them, and it would trickle down until everyone had been given a rank by the people above them.

    To some extent, I'm sure they just made it up as they went along. For instance, once they decided to assign Kira to DS9, she had to be a major to fit in the right place between Sisko and the rest of the crew's ranks. Since they were making everything up from scratch, it's possible she was given a rank over better or more experienced people, just because that's the rank she needed for the job that would get her out of the way.

    Although, she had been fighting for something like 14 years. It seems like it would be hard to be at war that long without being killed, so she was probably one of the more experienced members of the resistance anyway.