Avengers Vs. X-Men -- Speculation, Spoilers, and Discussion

Discussion in 'Science Fiction & Fantasy' started by Allyn Gibson, Mar 28, 2012.

  1. Allyn Gibson

    Allyn Gibson Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Issue #2 is out today.
    Some thoughts.

    Jason Aaron scripts this. After liking his work on AVX #0, I'm not impressed with his work here. The dialogue, what little of it there is, is fine. It's the caption boxes that are annoying; I find them pretentious rather than portentious.

    Cyclops continues to come off badly in this, and the way the situation develops it's very hard to see the X-Men in general in anything but a poor light.

    It's difficult to say whether or not the book works on its own. I was entertained by it, but in a "Oh, you've got to be kidding me" sort of way. The last page really opens up the scope of the series, and I'm curious to see where that plotline goes. For the rest, sixteen pages of "Saving Private Ryan on Utopia's Beach," it's meh.
     
  2. Hound of UIster

    Hound of UIster Vice Admiral Admiral

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    I wonder if JRJR has a drug problem otherwise, he might want to think about another profession.
     
  3. Admiral_Young

    Admiral_Young Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    Scott pretty much is the villain in this event. Not due to actions perse, but because as others have explained already due to his philosophical stance and unwillingness to budge on Hope. He has become a desperate man leading a desperate people. Remember that teaser image Marvel release almost a year ago now of him wearing Magneto's costume? That turned out to be very symbolic and more true than any of us would suspected as Erik himself asked Scott in the first issue "You sound like I me Scott".

    I have yet to read the issue, but interested to know that the X-Men roster roll call in the front has now expanded to include all of Scott's team on Utopia, and has Logan and Storm in the middle. I suspect with Jason Aaron writing this issue that it will be better than the opener.
     
  4. DarthPipes

    DarthPipes Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Issue #2 was much better. The action was great and made up for Aaron's embarrassing, groan-inducing writing. Those dialogue captions were just embarrassing.
     
  5. Turtletrekker

    Turtletrekker Vice Admiral Admiral

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    And how are the actions of Captain America and the Avengers any more acemptable than Scott's?

    Put yourself in Scott's shoes for a minute. Joe Government knocks on your door and basically says, "Hello, even though she has done nothing to deserve it, we're here to take your grand-daughter (son/daughter/grandson/wife/husband/parents/whatever) away from you and into our custody because of something she hasn't done yet but might do, based on the opinion of a psychopath who holds a massive grudge against you"? Don't tell me that you wouldn't be pissed. That you wouldn't resist in some way. Stuff like this is why so many right-wing gun-nuts so revere the 2nd Amendment, to protect yourself and yours in case the government comes after it.

    Personally, I'm not seeing anything but villains on either side here. If Cap didn't want a fight, he shouldn't have brought 20 Avengers to watch his back. Wolverine, in particular, is being a monumental ass.
     
    Last edited: Apr 19, 2012
  6. Admiral_Young

    Admiral_Young Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    I'm not saying Cap or the government are any better at all. I'm just explaining why Scott is being portrayed in the specific manner he is right now. Personally I'm on neither side, and this has been building up for years in the books. You'd think that Captain America and the Avengers would take another route given what they supposedly learned from fighting each other in the Civil War. I do agree with some fans that this is essentially Civil War Part II but the mainstream heroes vs the mutant community. It will be interesting to see the Marvel Universe post AVX because I have a feeling there is going to be a bit of a shake up. Hopefully whatever happens isn't undone like a few weeks later lol.


    Avengers Vs X-Men #2: I see the problems everyone is having with this book, and I really do agree with them. This is written much better than the first one though. I now understand what point Praetor Shinzon was making in the other thread. This doesn't surprise me though. Logan killed Jean when she was possessed by Phoenix at the end of Morrison's New X-Men run, mostly because Jean begged him to and there wasn't going to be another way to stop the entity. Jr's art is terrible in this issue. This hasn't been awesome so far, but we're just getting started. I see they were also setting up the matches for the fight book as well in this issue.
     
    Last edited: Apr 19, 2012
  7. Turtletrekker

    Turtletrekker Vice Admiral Admiral

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  8. Mr Light

    Mr Light Admiral Admiral

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    I don't understand the "VS" side series concept, is it just cut aways to random fights in the middle of the main book?
     
  9. Turtletrekker

    Turtletrekker Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Yeah, pretty much. Instead of devoting so many pages to all of the myriad battles between Hero A and Hero X in the main book, the "VS" book allows the big epic fight scenes to be chronicled properly without dragging down the main narrative.

    I'm on the fence myself.
     
  10. Turtletrekker

    Turtletrekker Vice Admiral Admiral

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    I've read the preview for Uncanny X-Men 10 several times now, and I love Namor's inner monologue as Captain America confronts Cyclops. It gives some insight as to why Namor fights for Cyclops and the X-Men other than the fact that he's hot for Emma.

    "People ask me why I stand with the mutants.

    I am a king in my own right. While I am a mutant, the humans don't consider me one. Mutants are loathed I am feared... but respected.

    This is not my fight. I need not be here.

    But watch Summers.

    Understand what is happening.

    This is a man stating the autonomy of his people.

    This is a man rejecting the idea that the fears of the mob should govern their destiny.

    This is a species of 200 declaring war on the United States of America.

    I admire Scott Summers. (This would be the panel where Cyke blasts Cap.)

    I would have his woman, of course.

    But, that's a compliment, in it's own way."
    :lol:
     
    Last edited: Apr 21, 2012
  11. Admiral_Young

    Admiral_Young Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    Well there's also the fact that Utopia has an alliance with Atlantis and utilizes Atlantean technology as well...but yes Namor has gained a respect for Scott since working with the X-Men. Look at the people that Scott considers his "inner circle" over the years (Magneto especially) all of them are there because they have come to respect and admire Scott's leadership. Unfortunately it is also his leadership that has caused the current political and philosophical situation he now faces with Logan and now the Avengers and the government.
     
  12. Allyn Gibson

    Allyn Gibson Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Out today, AVX Vs. #1:
    I feel dumber for having read this.

    Magneto Vs. Iron is written by Jason Aaron and drawn by Adam Kubert. It's not as pretentious as Aaron's work on Avengers Vs. X-Men #2, but it's still stupidly wordly.

    And I won't even mention what Iron Man does to deliver a knock-out blow to Magneto, except that it's so scientifically absurd that I felt brain cells die.

    The only thing worthwhile is Magneto's realization at the end of the story, [spoiler="where...]where he begin to understand just what the X-Men have gotten themselves into and what's coming for them. There's now dissension in the X-Men's ranks, and I'm curious how/if it will play out in the weeks to come.[/spoiler]

    The Thing Vs. Namor is by Kathryn Immonen and Stuart Immonen.

    Nothing really to say about it. Given the number of times these two have tangled over the years, I was surprised at how superficial it all was. They wail on each other, there's a giant sea monster, that's about it. Stuart Immonen's artwork is nice.

    Pretty pointless book overall.
     
  13. Admiral_Young

    Admiral_Young Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    I'm skipping the fight book. I was on the fence about it, but it really is pointless no matter who is writing or drawing the fights.
     
  14. Turtletrekker

    Turtletrekker Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Yeah, I thumbed thriugh the first issue and put it back on the shelf. I really liked Uncanny X-Men 11 with it's opening monologue from Namor, to the fight between Red Hulk and Colossus (Which I think was better than either of the "AvX vs" fights), to Scott activating his "Avengers Protocol", which is the first time in this event that it's made clear that Scott knew this was coming, as per X-Sanction. Possibly the best issue to come out of AvX yet.

    New Avengers 24 is, I think, another one of those issues that will read better in trade. None of the NA team are actually in the issue, which is set mostly in the past and details the connection between K'un L'un and the Phoenix Force. Secret Avengers follows the space-team on their mission, and ends with the appearance of...

    Mar-Vell.

    I wasn't too impressed with either of the Avengers AvX crossovesr this week.
     
    Last edited: Apr 26, 2012
  15. Saga

    Saga Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    didn't care for AvX VS #1, mostly cause both my guys lost. stupidly, i might add. i did like Secret Avengers and Uncanny X-Men though.
     
  16. Hound of UIster

    Hound of UIster Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Is that the ones with IM vs Mags and Juggernaut vs Rulk? Because both were bullshit.

    And New Avengers didn't make much sense. Wasn't the Yu-Ti kicked out of KunLun in Fraction's Iron Fist?
     
    Last edited: Apr 25, 2012
  17. Turtletrekker

    Turtletrekker Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Newsarama gave Uncanny X-Men 11 a 10 out of 10, which I completely agree with. However thaey also gave "vs" #1 9 out of 10, which I don't agree with so much.
     
  18. Aldo

    Aldo Admiral Admiral

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    I was at my local comic book store today and saw that number 2 was on sell. I kind of kicked myself because I realized just then that it was something I would have liked to read. Then I walked over to the bookstore (both are in my mall) and what did I see in their comic section? AVX Round 1 (not round 0, though from what I read here it doesn't seem all that essential). So I snatched that one up, and then went back to the comic book store and picked up Round 2.

    Boy the X-Men have changed a lot since I used to collect the comics (about ten years ago, lol) but it didn't take me long to get used to it. Though I am unsure who Hope is? Am I to believe she is Cyclops' daughter?

    For some reason I'm siding with the Avengers right now, I think Scott is being a colossal dick in his refusal to give up Hope. Though at the same time Cap could have went about it differently, but it's still making for an interesting read nonetheless.
     
  19. Turtletrekker

    Turtletrekker Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Hope is actually Scott's adopted grand-daughter as she is the adopted daughter of Scott's son Cable/Nathan Summers.

    Hope is a fairly new character (5-6 years?) that already has a complex history.

    Here is her wiki page. It's easier to direct you there than try to relate her history here.
     
    Last edited: Apr 27, 2012
  20. Admiral_Young

    Admiral_Young Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    Yeah Hope's biological parents are still unknown IRRC. Also I still can't help but be focused on what Brevoort has said about Hope with regards to Jean Grey. We're supposed to keep an eye on her during Avengers Vs X-Men. I believe Hope's origins will finally be explained in this event. I still hold out hope that Jeannie will return at the end of this event, she still is supposed to be in the White Hot room as White Phoenix regenerating so unless the writers have retconned that for this event, it is still possible to use her in some fashion.