AVENGERS: Grade, Reviews, Discuss, DVD & Sequel **SPOILERS**

Discussion in 'Science Fiction & Fantasy' started by Captain Craig, Apr 20, 2012.

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How do you grade The Avengers?

Poll closed Nov 26, 2012.
  1. A+

    46.4%
  2. A

    31.8%
  3. A-

    9.3%
  4. B+

    5.3%
  5. B

    3.4%
  6. B-

    1.6%
  7. C+

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  8. C

    1.2%
  9. C-

    0.3%
  10. D+

    0.3%
  11. D

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  12. D-

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  13. F

    0.3%
  1. stj

    stj Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    As I recall, the scene where Banner is holding the spear came after the Black Widow "interrogated" Loki and realized that his plan was to unleash the Hulk. The scene doesn't play right because none of the others act upon their newly acquired knowledge in any rational way, such as landing the stupid helicarrier. The others actually get more abrasive! However if the implication is supposed to be that Banner has the Hulk under control, the scene with the Black Widow bringing him in plays in retrospect as if he's toying with her. And the attempted suicide story is either hysterical self-pity or a blatant lie.

    Well, the movie's about spectacle. And the Thor scenes with Loki remind us of the decent half of the Thor movie. And the Iron Man scenes with Pepper reminds us of the Iron Man movie.
     
  2. LaxScrutiny

    LaxScrutiny Commodore Commodore

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    ^ You're missing something that came across pretty obvious to me. Loki wasn't "in control" in the same way he was controlling Hawkeye, he was boosting their negative emotions. He was "broadcasting" anger, which he was directing primarily at Banner, but it was also affecting the others as well. The staff was like a broadcast antenna, they were all near it and they were all having a completely irrational argument. None of the things they were saying were things that they normally would have felt about each other, but due to the staff broadcasting emotions, it made them twist the "facts" into insults - something I picked up on because my ex-wife liked to do that too. ;)
     
  3. Kirby

    Kirby Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Took my 9 year old son last night and we both loved it. There were some flaws, but overall I gave it an A for over two hours of solid popcorn munching entertainment.
     
  4. Captain Craig

    Captain Craig Vice Admiral Admiral

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    It's an early estimate but as of now they are predicting a record setting $200m 3-day+midnights OW of THE AVENGERS!!!!

    This is going to cruise over the Billion mark. Ok, Sony your Amazing Spider-man is now on deck, TDKR is standing by.
     
  5. Agent Richard07

    Agent Richard07 Admiral Admiral

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    I'm surprised at all the positivity surrounding this movie. It's got a near unanimous "A" vote here and a 94% at Rotten Tomatoes. So I have to ask... What did this movie deliver that universally panned movies like Transformers: Dark of the Moon and Green Lantern didn't? I enjoyed The Avengers, it was indeed a lot of fun, but to me, it's pretty much the same as any other superhero movie that's come out over the last decade. I don't see what sets this one apart. Hopefully someone can shed some light on what makes this movie work so well for so many people.
     
  6. CaptainCanada

    CaptainCanada Admiral Admiral

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    Better characterization, better-directed action, better dialogue, and (in the case of Michael Bay movies) less racism and sexism.
     
  7. Methos

    Methos Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    Ok... watching Pulp Fiction after The Avengers... sooo not a good idea...

    Nick Fury: "Does Tony Stark look like a bitch?!?"

    Loki: "What?"

    Nick Fury: "Does he look like a bitch?"

    Loki: "What?"

    Nick Fury: "Say what one more time and i'll drop this cage right here and now f**ker!"

    M
     
  8. trekkiebaggio

    trekkiebaggio Vice Admiral Admiral

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    The fact that they're all on screen at the same time is a massive factor. The best moment of the movie for me was when it clicked that I was actually watching Thor, Iron Man, Captain America and the Hulk all on the same screen.

    Avengers is way more cohesive than Transformers.
     
  9. Admiral James Kirk

    Admiral James Kirk Writer Admiral

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    I hope The Avengers dethrones Avatar. I never could stomach that sucker sitting at the top of the all time box office heap. I want something that I actually like sitting on the throne! :techman:
     
  10. LaxScrutiny

    LaxScrutiny Commodore Commodore

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    The Avengers is true to the source material (early 60s) in spirit, it updates in a way that works for the 21st century. The characters are interesting and believable. The movie is choreographed in a way that works, multiple personalities on screen that interact in a way that is believable in terms of who those people are. For example the conflict between Steve and Tony, it isn't just made up, it is exactly what the personality of Steve would have against the personality of Tony, the same judgement and resentment (magnified by Loki at the time.) In short, it works because the human element is believable.

    The action choreography works because it captures attention and then leads the eye along a progressive line to the conclusion. It isn't just random things blowing up, it is like a set of dominoes knocking each other down, getting progressively faster as each adds its force to the next.

    The characters have individual moments of expression (I wish Thor had been handled a bit better) and true to life interpersonal interaction with each other. This interaction is also intentionally choreographed into the plot. The group come together as individuals and have no cohesion. They are provoked into interpersonal conflict that mirrors the physical battle that occured when they first met. They get past that and gradually learn to work together. They mesh and become a team. We aren't told they are a team, we see them becoming one. The movie is an experience of the set of players bonding.

    Compared to the movies you mention, there is no comparison because this movie had a theme and it pulled it off. The basic plot was predictable enough, but the point of it was bringing the characters through a process of coming from being strangers, to aquaintences, to mistrustful co-workers, to trusting team-mates.

    The movie wasn't perfect, and I mentioned my complaints earlier in the thread, but intended point of the movie worked, it captured the viewer and took the viewer on a journey. I could imagine myself with them, feeling what they felt, wanting to go along on this ride. And at the end, wanting the ride to continue.
     
  11. Emher

    Emher Admiral Admiral

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    I've totally forgot what that was, remind me.
     
  12. flemm

    flemm Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    Well, I can only speak for myself, but, while Transformers does provide a certain amount of spectacle, I always felt that those movies assaulted my brain on multiple levels with pure stupid, whether it be the war-mongering, the racism and sexism, the "heros" who are actually sociopaths, I won't even bother trying to list them all (admittedly, this is somewhat less true of the first movie, which I did enjoy). The action scenes are barely coherent.

    On the other hand, Green Lantern was just not a very good or exciting superhero film. With some tweaks it could have been roughly as enjoyable as Thor or Captain America. But it's not in the same class as this movie where pure entertainment is concerned.

    This movie is incredibly entertaining, but not in a way that makes my brain hurt. This is apparent even in the big action sequences, which make visual sense.
     
  13. Warped9

    Warped9 Admiral Admiral

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    Being a comic book based film there are a lot of things you have to let slide, and depiction of realistic physics is only the beginning. Yeah, thousands of innocents would have died in such an attack. You could tell this was a family friendly film because we didn't once see innocents getting crushed by falling debris or blasted by alien weapons fire. Compare this with the War Of The Worlds remake where you did see those things.

    In a film like Spider-Man, Iron Man and Captain America it's easier to get wrapped up in the story because we can focus on the one or few core characters. It simply feels more personal. In that respect I find those films more satisfying overall. In Avengers it's the dramatic (more or less) variation of a collection of sight gags. The story here is actually flimsy because what it's really about is seeing the various personalities clash as well as seeing them in action in a big way. And on that note while there were quite a few moments I enjoyed it's Brice Banner/Hulk and Tony Stark/Iron Man who really make the film for me. That said I liked some of Black Widow's scenes as well as Cap's and Nick Fury. Fury's Number 2 (Coulson?) was also enjoyable.

    The weakest element in this for me was Thor. He just seemed like an afterthought. And while I'm now a bit more curious about the film Thor I'm still not that enthused.
     
  14. stj

    stj Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    At the end of Thor, Selvig was under Loki's influence just by remote control. But in this movie, Hawkeye specifically said that there was no problem on this end of the Cube, yet a door opens both ways. A little later, we see Loki using the scepter to take over Selvig and Hawkeye. The conclusion is that Loki has to do the mind control thing using the scepter, a conclusion reinforced by Loki's failure to take over Stark.

    (Since Loki could apparently read minds or otherwise gain amazing amounts of information, there's no reason to think he wouldn't have known about the lamp in Stark's chest, except if the villain wasn't stupid, evil would triumph.)

    Later, when Banner was told to put down the scepter (by Captain America I think,) that was supposed to be showing that he was being influenced by the scepter. I wondered how Loki could plan to have Banner pick up the scepter, or indeed, anybody other than lab geeks trying to study it. I suppose it's possible that we are supposed to imagine that the scepter is powerful on its own to influence everybody, but that doesn't seem obvious to me. Pointing out that Banner is holding the scepter and should put it down rather highlights the importance of touching the scepter. By the way, with that kind of power the plan to become a prisoner gets even more Rube Goldbergish. Besides, Iron Man and Thor were already duking it out without Loki's help.

    I think the bottom line on it all is that the motivations for all this fighting with each other is kind of murky at best, and really just there because that's what superheroes tend to do in the comics. Kind of average writing.
     
  15. Chemahkuu

    Chemahkuu Admiral Admiral

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    "I watched you while you where sleeping."

    Edwards line to Bella, the defining moment of creepy that sums up Edward and a lot of what is seriously wrong with that series.

    In the Avengers, Coulson was meant to be caught up in his hero worship and just worded it badly, but most people got the joke.

    Oh, and:
    [​IMG]
     
  16. Aldo

    Aldo Admiral Admiral

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    When even the people who haven't seen Thor feel that Thor was wasted, you know something's wrong.
     
  17. Emher

    Emher Admiral Admiral

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    Oh, I didn't catch that as a reference. Then again, haven't watched "Twilight". I do remember laughing at that though :lol:
     
  18. M'rk son of Mogh

    M'rk son of Mogh Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Strange you feel that way since I felt he had the most personal connection to the whole thing via Loki.

    I'm glad I didn't catch that either. I'll happily not watch Twilight to miss a punchline that was still funny on its own anyways.
     
  19. Warped9

    Warped9 Admiral Admiral

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    You're right and thats why I feel it was one of the film's weak points. Thor should have felt more integral, but I didn't feel he was. Hmm...maybe if I watch Thor then I'll feel differently about it in Avengers.
     
  20. Hartzilla2007

    Hartzilla2007 Vice Admiral Admiral

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    I though Dr. Reinstein just created another version of the serum likely based off of what they could reconstruct of Erskine's seeing as the serum was different in TIH than Captain American as well as the freaky mutation looking thing going on with Blonsky and Ross being concerned about possibly side effects from the serum making it seem like a failed recreation.