Atlas Shrugged

Discussion in 'Science Fiction & Fantasy' started by xortex, Jan 3, 2013.

  1. stj

    stj Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Yes, but...it's not precise. Why should anyone care what I say if I don't say what was BS, or why it was hypocritical? I daresay there are implications in my avatar that most people are not interested in nor political enough to pick up on. But it would be remarkable if there was any interpretation that make my disapproval of Ayn Rand noteworthy. Unless I spelled it out a little.


    Christians firmly believe that they are being persecuted, that even Christmas is under attack. And that's just a specific subset of the conservative mentality. Yes, very likely he/she is very serious. Books are not banned, however, they just don't get mass distribution or stay in print. Of course, that's always because of market forces.

    Fortunately for Objectivists, the definition of "market forces" is rather elastic.

     
  2. Set Harth

    Set Harth Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    That's affect, not effect.
     
  3. T'Girl

    T'Girl Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Please come to Seattle and talk to the people who want to spend hundreds of millions on a light rail system that will carry only a few thousand people a day.
     
  4. Alidar Jarok

    Alidar Jarok Everything in moderation but moderation Moderator

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    Actually, rail has been making a comeback (especially in cargo shipping). As much as people want to mock that, I think the terrible writing and poor message is much easier to mock.
     
  5. Admiral2

    Admiral2 Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Nobody watched or critiqued these movies as just "a lover of cinema." You're deluding yourself if you think your politics had nothing to do with your opinion.
     
  6. Coloratura

    Coloratura Snuggle Princess Premium Member

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    Yes. As an avid train lover, I would love to see more (passenger) railways. The premise itself is decent enough; that a guy comes up with a new kind of steel that can handle massive amounts of heat and pressure, and other companies try to get it out from under him (which is what would really happen). How it was all executed, however, was so poorly done, it's laughable. Especially when you toss in the perpetual motion machine plot device to make it all work.
     
  7. Klaus

    Klaus Vice Admiral Admiral

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    I always thought the idea that a specially-shaped antenna could extract free energy from static electicity in the atmosphere to be one of the most amusing technobabbles of all time. :lol:

    Maybe she gets chutzpah points for even trying that one. :rolleyes:
     
  8. Mr. Laser Beam

    Mr. Laser Beam Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    Really? Great. Give them a medal!
     
  9. iguana_tonante

    iguana_tonante Admiral Admiral

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    Five thousand quatloos that the guy won't come back to explain his idiotic (and, if you case about such things, insulting) claim.

    So what is your opinion on the movies, then? Apparently, it will say everything we need to know about you. In your case, the statement might be even accurate.

    That's nonsense. You know what would solve the problem of traffic? More cars.
     
  10. stj

    stj Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    A few thousand people on a train means a few thousand fewer cars in the business district. The costs entailed by those cars have to be taken into account to decide whether the proposed scheme is worthwhile. I imagine a single extra parking garage would by itself be, what? One to five percent of the projected costs? Other costs from those few thousand cars will be lumped with other things, like street maintenance, and hard to evaluate.

    As I understand it, land acquisition in urban areas is always a substantial part of the costs for these projects. It is very possible that actual operating costs will be substantially lower with rail. On the other hand, a public amenity like rail transit might contribute substantially to increasing land values, and this might be the main reason for some people's support.

    Unfortunately for the regular citizen, the information needed for a correct evaluation will probably be hidden away. Whatever information must be public record will be hidden in multiple obscure sources with peculiar jargon and fine print that takes a certain amount of expertise to ferret out and understand.
     
  11. Mr. Laser Beam

    Mr. Laser Beam Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    Explain.
     
  12. Admiral Buzzkill

    Admiral Buzzkill Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    I think the ongoing appeal of the novel, year after year, is that in essence it's a bodice ripper written a generation before its time.
     
  13. Coloratura

    Coloratura Snuggle Princess Premium Member

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    [yt]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xy0UBpagsu8[/yt]
     
  14. Admiral Buzzkill

    Admiral Buzzkill Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    Well, in several respects it's a science fiction novel and the naive technological ideas presented in it weren't out of line for sf of the pulp era (the book was published in 1957).

    My impression is that sf fandom of the 50s and 60s was one of the early loci of Rand's following, as well as of libertarianism. OTOH when I worked in bookstores in the late 1970s I noticed that Rand's books sold mainly to the same women who bought the month's romance paperbacks a dozen at a time.
     
  15. Nerys Myk

    Nerys Myk Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    I find I can watch films featuring political ideas I don't support and characters who do things I'd never do and enjoy them because they're well made. OTOH, movies about political ideas that I support, yet are poorly made, I'm more that happy to declare "terrible".
     
  16. scotpens

    scotpens Vice Admiral Admiral

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    When Atlas Shrugged was originally published in 1957, passenger trains were a huge business. You couldn't change that element of the novel or it would be a completely different story.

    Besides, it could still happen.

    [yt]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gUERtAe73NI[/yt]

    Yes, I think Ayn Rand was out of her depth when she tried using science fiction concepts (the "free energy" engine, the invisibility screen). Of course, a lot of folks here would say she was out of her depth just writing novels. :p
     
  17. Klaus

    Klaus Vice Admiral Admiral

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    sarcasm

    :D
     
  18. The Mirrorball Man

    The Mirrorball Man Vice Admiral Admiral

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    I'm a Christian and I'm not conservative and do not believe that I'm being persecuted. And I don't really care about Christmas, to be honest.

    Honestly, around here, Ayn Rand is a complete nonentity. No one has heard of her, no one reads her books and her ideas have no political influence whatsoever.

    And yes, I'm perfectly able to tell the difference between my politics and my taste for cinema. There are movies that I quite enjoy, even though I don't agree with their message or point of view.
     
  19. Mr. Laser Beam

    Mr. Laser Beam Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    I am a Christian conservative and have never been persecuted either, nor do I think I am, and also I do not think that Christmas (which I love) is under attack. Except by fruitcake.

    FWIW.
     
  20. Gov Kodos

    Gov Kodos Admiral Admiral

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    'Christians believe...' that phrase was a laughable concept even before the Council of Nicaea.
     

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