Anyone here who HATES "in the pale moonlight"

Discussion in 'Star Trek: Deep Space Nine' started by WesleysDisciple, Apr 2, 2013.

  1. indolover

    indolover Fleet Captain

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    Then if you're stupid enough to believe in "morals", that's your own business.
     
  2. R. Star

    R. Star Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    ^
    Got any more pearls of wisdom? :lol:
     
  3. wingsabre

    wingsabre Lieutenant Junior Grade Red Shirt

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    I though it was one of, if not the best episode in the season/series. Gene Roddenberry had an ideal universe, where humanity eventually evolved to the point of avoiding conflict. However, humans will always be humans. We can built great things such as the pyramids, or reach for the stars, but we can still be capable of doing horrible things to each others a well.
     
  4. indolover

    indolover Fleet Captain

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    Yeah, so all unrealistic artistic works have to be canned....
     
  5. BillJ

    BillJ Fleet Admiral Admiral

    Whenever arguments like this come up, I think of a line from Encounter at Farpoint...

     
  6. Jarvisimo

    Jarvisimo Captain Captain

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    Sorry to add a late reply, but there is a subtle discussion of Romulan perceptions of Vreenak's demise in Una McCormack's Treklit sequel to the episode, Hollow Men.

    More to the point, Hollow Men is a wonderful examination of espionage in Trek, as well as the Sisko's guilt and sense of honour, the utilitarian attitudes of Starfleet (& S31) during war and, most of all, McCormack's excellent recurrent treatment of Garak (see also the Never-Ending Sacrifice and The Lotus Flower).
     
  7. indolover

    indolover Fleet Captain

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    Then you're probably autistic or something and don't have an imagination. Do you think this of all supposedly "unrealistic" art works?

    I personally don't give a crap if any art work has to be realistic. The Roddenberry vision can be seen as it is, as a hope and dream.
     
  8. marksound

    marksound Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    :guffaw:

    First good laugh of the day. Thanks.
     
  9. sonak

    sonak Vice Admiral Admiral

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    you made me want to check out that book.:klingon:
     
  10. BillJ

    BillJ Fleet Admiral Admiral

    Hollow Men is a great book. :techman:
     
  11. BillJ

    BillJ Fleet Admiral Admiral

    Unrealistic TV shows are fine. But don't be surprised when a long-running franchise like Star Trek that depicts an unrealistic humanity eventually examines the flip-side. Don't be surprised when they eventually examine the cost such a society would have, the the things people would be willing to do to protect it.

    When they present an "unrealistic" humanity, they open up other storytelling options in the process.
     
  12. indolover

    indolover Fleet Captain

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    I don't care. Since I see works for what they are in their context. Nobody in this thread has frankly mentioned why all artistic works need to be realistic.
     
  13. indolover

    indolover Fleet Captain

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    then you're weak if you endorse the contrary.
     
  14. marksound

    marksound Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    Stop it! You're killing me!
    :guffaw:
     
  15. indolover

    indolover Fleet Captain

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    Yeah, it's good I made a psychologically imbalanced person laugh.
     
  16. sonak

    sonak Vice Admiral Admiral

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    indeed-laughter is the best medicine
     
  17. indolover

    indolover Fleet Captain

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    Laughter? You all endorse "morality". That in itself requires laughter.
     
  18. wingsabre

    wingsabre Lieutenant Junior Grade Red Shirt

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    Look, even Roddenberry created situations where humans did despicable things out of greed, fear, etc... He may have a utopian future in his mind, but even he relented to human nature. Roddenberry created Harry Mudd after all. He created a world where Kirk was a womanizer and was weak to control his lust. He created a future where his heroes allowed a good woman die so the world will be a better place. He created a world where his heroes too had to acquiesced to thievery and treachery in order to steal the Romulan Cloaking device, just so they can protect their precious Federation. Look at any piece of art out there and you'll see that there's no absolute black or white, but there are also shades of grey. Sometimes there are no good decisions, just the least bad decision and Roddenberry understood that. Sisko's least bad decisions brought the Romulans into the war, and prevent an epoc of genocide and tyrannical rule from the Dominion.

    Just because you hate certain aspects of the episode does not give you the right to force others to think the same way. If that's your goal, you should give up now because I know what I like and no one can convince me otherwise.
     
    Last edited: Apr 26, 2013
  19. Crazyewok

    Crazyewok Commander Red Shirt

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    That why I gte confused when certain people cry about Rodenberry "vision" I mean look at the TOS you had crew bullying (ok that may be abit extrme), a man slut who liked to bend the rules and a universe full of theives and criminals.


    By the time TNG is created Rodenberry seems to have become retarded. HE hippie lala land trek is boring. It may be Art but it sucks, which is why TNG first 2 series sucked and nearly killed it. Art all well and good but when you are makeing a TV show you have to be consistant and make something people want to watch.
     
  20. RXTT

    RXTT Lieutenant Red Shirt

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    NO! I LOVE IT! DS9 4EVER!!!! Love that episode. It got to the real heart of war. Makes TOS and TNG look like VOY!!!!!!