A thought on regenerations (spoilers for "Night/Day of the Doctor")

Discussion in 'Doctor Who' started by Christopher, Dec 8, 2013.

  1. Christopher

    Christopher Writer Admiral

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    Re: A thought on regenerations (spoilers for "Night/Day of the Doctor"

    I think you're right. Moffat has been building to the Trenzalore thing throughout Smith's run. And I couldn't help but notice in "The Name of the Doctor" that the Doctor's "tomb" at Trenzalore was in the current version of the console room. I just chalked that up to budget limitations -- it would've been too expensive to create a whole new future version of the console room for just a few scenes -- but in the context of what Dorium said a while back about "The Fall of the Eleventh" being at Trenzalore, it makes sense. So we have been told this was coming. Dorium said the Eleventh fell at Trenzalore, and the Doctor revealed that Trenzalore was where he died once and for all. All we had to do was remember and do the math.

    Of course, that raises some questions. Will Capaldi be a new, separate person taking over as the Doctor, or some alternate incarnation? Will the Doctor change his own future? Or maybe it'll be the same kind of thing Moffat's done before, where it turns out that what we think we're seeing isn't the whole truth, that the Doctor found some way to cheat death while preserving the appearance of it.
     
  2. Mr Awe

    Mr Awe Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Re: A thought on regenerations (spoilers for "Night/Day of the Doctor"

    ^ Well, yeah, except for the fact that he's not going to die once and for all! Just like he didn't really, truly, honestly die at Lake Silencio. As you say, Moffat has played that card already. Will be interesting to see if he tries that one again or has something new up his sleeve.
     
  3. Christopher

    Christopher Writer Admiral

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    Re: A thought on regenerations (spoilers for "Night/Day of the Doctor"

    Moffat has a way of doing something brilliantly original... and then reusing it over and over until it gets stale. I'm not sure he has anything new left.
     
  4. Mr Awe

    Mr Awe Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Re: A thought on regenerations (spoilers for "Night/Day of the Doctor"

    Unfortunately there's always the chance that he'll reach too far trying to outdo himself. If he goes with something like a character who assumes the Doctor's identity, or Capaldi is a secret previous incarnation, or something like that, he's run out of ideas. Well, good ideas.

    I was worried about that with Day of the Doctor, but that was brilliant. And, that was even a reuse of the Lake Silence "death" scenario. So, perhaps it'll all be good. We can hope!

    Mr Awe
     
  5. Emperor-Tiberius

    Emperor-Tiberius Commodore Commodore

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    Re: A thought on regenerations (spoilers for "Night/Day of the Doctor"

    I agree:

     
  6. Emh

    Emh The Doctor Premium Member

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    Re: A thought on regenerations (spoilers for "Night/Day of the Doctor"

    I completely agree. I've been saying for years how much I want to see how The Doctor handles being on his last incarnation, facing his mortality and being on recurring theme. (Of course, my big dream was for the show to end with The Doctor actually dying but I know that would never happen) In addition to the fact that I've never been a fan of the whole Meta-Crisis incarnation (despite otherwise loving that two-parter) and would prefer to pretend that it never happened, I'm quite disappointed that Moffat had decided to abruptly, without warning, to rush to this point and skim over it in just one episode. It would be one thing, as suggested by others in this thread already with The Tenth Doctor's "I don't want to go," to have the audience actually know the full situation in advance but we don't even have that consolation. I have faith in The Moffat but I"m going into this episode concerned and unhappy.
     
  7. Hartzilla2007

    Hartzilla2007 Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Re: A thought on regenerations (spoilers for "Night/Day of the Doctor"

    We already pretty much got that from the end of Tennant's run and I don't really see a reason to rehash it just because of something that was probably always going to be either ignored or somehow side stepped.
     
  8. Christopher

    Christopher Writer Admiral

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    Re: A thought on regenerations (spoilers for "Night/Day of the Doctor"

    ^Right. The Doctor getting all maudlin about his imminent mortality has been a running theme for years now -- "He will knock four times," the cracks in time erasing the Doctor, the "fixed point in time" astronaut assassination, the fields of Trenzalore. I'd like to see the Doctor stop obsessing over his impending doom.
     
  9. Emperor-Tiberius

    Emperor-Tiberius Commodore Commodore

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    Re: A thought on regenerations (spoilers for "Night/Day of the Doctor"

    I only hope he won't be as obsessed over his imminent regenerations from when he turns into Capaldi and onward.
     
  10. Mr Awe

    Mr Awe Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Re: A thought on regenerations (spoilers for "Night/Day of the Doctor"

    Hopefully it's a great episode. However, even it's great, I do feel like we missed out on the drama of the Doctor knowing it was his last regular regeneration. Skipping ahead has removed that.

    As a kid watching the classic series, I thought we'd never ever reach the 13th Doctor. It just seemed so far away as I was enjoying Pertwee, Baker, and Davison.

    When the new series started, it still seemed far away but that we could potentially reach it after some time. Still quite a milestone because it would involve 4 regenerations in the new series.

    But then to find out that we had reached the momentous milestone but only realized in hindsight makes it anti-climatic. Or even worse, it takes that huge milestone and reduces it to a plot point of one episode.

    Mr Awe
     
  11. Hartzilla2007

    Hartzilla2007 Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Re: A thought on regenerations (spoilers for "Night/Day of the Doctor"

    But again I doubt it would be any different from how obsessive he was over impending deaths since Waters of Mars.
     
  12. Mr Awe

    Mr Awe Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Re: A thought on regenerations (spoilers for "Night/Day of the Doctor"

    ^ It all depends on how it would've been done, right? It all comes down to execution.
     
  13. DWF

    DWF Admiral Admiral

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    Re: A thought on regenerations (spoilers for "Night/Day of the Doctor"

    The four knocks at the end of Tennant's time only came about after he announced that he was leaving the part, the same can said for some of the events The Day Of The Doctor. Trenzalore was meant as the fall of the 11th, but that was before the creation of the War Doctor and Moffat's shift of Smith to the final incarnation of the Doctor. The same can said for the Watcher in Logopolis, he was meant as a foreshadowing of the fourth Doctor's upcoming regeneration.

    But there's only one for the Doctor to get more lives and that's from the Time Lords, which means time was changed in The Day Of The Doctor. In Dalek the Doctor said that he could feel if there were any other Time Lords left, the Master became human in order to hide himself. But it's obvious now that the Time Lords have returned and evcen if it's in the future they could return in time to regenerate the Doctor so that he could find them in the future.
     
  14. Alidar Jarok

    Alidar Jarok Everything in moderation but moderation Moderator

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    Re: A thought on regenerations (spoilers for "Night/Day of the Doctor"

    Well, that's unimaginative.

    Except the Doctor can't sense River or Jenny. And he specifically said that, if Time Lords were in a pocket universe, he couldn't sense them either (The Doctor's Wife). It's entirely possible there are reasons they can't be sensed either.
     
  15. Christopher

    Christopher Writer Admiral

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    Re: A thought on regenerations (spoilers for "Night/Day of the Doctor"

    That's easy enough. He could sense them in a pocket universe if they were active, but since they're frozen in time, there's nothing to sense, no mental activity to register.
     
  16. Alidar Jarok

    Alidar Jarok Everything in moderation but moderation Moderator

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    Re: A thought on regenerations (spoilers for "Night/Day of the Doctor"

    Well, I said he couldn't sense them in a pocket universe. However, it was illustrating the point that there are other reasons they can't be sensed. Your theory is a good one.
     
  17. The Mirrorball Man

    The Mirrorball Man Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Re: A thought on regenerations (spoilers for "Night/Day of the Doctor"

    If things play out as I think they will, he'll focus on "why am I still alive?" instead of "what happens if I die?"
     
  18. Kelso

    Kelso Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Re: A thought on regenerations (spoilers for "Night/Day of the Doctor"

    I'll be pretty stoked if the rumors pan out. Not only would it add some consequence to that terrible regeneration fake out from season 4, but it will also tie up the regeneration limit baggage (or "milestone" if you prefer) during the 50th year and in the 800th episode (or so I'm told). It seems like a fitting way to end this chapter of the Doctor's life and start anew.

    Also, it'll mean that one of my crazy fan theories turned out to be true... and that's always nice.
     
  19. DWF

    DWF Admiral Admiral

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    Re: A thought on regenerations (spoilers for "Night/Day of the Doctor"

    While other races in Doctor Who can regenerate like the Kastrians, so far only the Time Lords can grant oterh Time Lords new lives.

    Neither River nor Jenny are Time Lords though. And yes River did get her other lives from the TARDIS durin conception, if it were that easy all Time Lords would live well beyond their normal limit.
     
    Last edited: Dec 12, 2013
  20. Green Lantern

    Green Lantern Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    Re: A thought on regenerations (spoilers for "Night/Day of the Doctor"

    I for one would like a brutal and traumatic regeneration. Oh, and emotional.

    Those regenerations are always best.

    If you wan an original regeneration (me included), how about a stab wound. ;) Killed in an explosion would be fun. I'd love a tear of two from the doctor and Clara. That's why the Third Doctors regeneration (apart from the actual regeneration scene itself) is so brilliant and I also love ten's regeneration in general. Maybe a good old fashioned betrayal would be great.

    The funny thing about this year is that there have been three regenerations! 8-War, War-9, and 11-12. I think the reason Moffat didn't make the other two regenerations too epic (although I did enjoy Eight's regeneration a lot anyway) was so they didn't down-play the main regeneration.

    If played right, this regeneration could definitely be another classic one like Caves of Androzani.