A Niner Watches Babylon 5 (NO spoilers, please)

Discussion in 'Science Fiction & Fantasy' started by TheGodBen, Jan 24, 2010.

  1. Kegg

    Kegg Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Really? I've seen fans go so far as to mention it as one of the worst episodes of the show, which I'd definitely consider a wild overreaction (there are so many other more deserving targets). Certainly the timing was unfortunate for the show; it's a slap in the face of a return to substandard dreck after a genuinely nicely laid hour of TV.

    I don't differ in that I don't see a point to non-arc episodes. As a Star Trek fan, quite fond of the episodic format for sci-fi storytelling. I just think a lot of them stink.
     
  2. stonester1

    stonester1 Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Really, this is the first I've heard that about GROPOS.


    And we can disagree on them. I do think that's where one will find the weakest eps of B5, but I think I'm far less inclined than you to describe any one as "stinky".
     
  3. RoJoHen

    RoJoHen Awesome Premium Member

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    "GROPOS" is one of my least favorite episodes in the entire show. There, you've heard it again. :p
     
  4. Sykonee

    Sykonee Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    Wait... an Irishman drunk-posting on March 16th?:eek:

    GROPOS has its moments but, as mentioned, relies a bit too heavily on war cliches. Depending on my mood, I find the tragi-ending either very moving or dully predictable. As a subsequent episode to Coming Of Shadows, well it's certainly a better episode than TKO was as a following episode to Signs And Portents.
     
  5. RoJoHen

    RoJoHen Awesome Premium Member

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    That was my whole point. :vulcan:
     
  6. stonester1

    stonester1 Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    I liked the peak it showed into other maneuvers of power and reactions to events in B5. I enjoyed some of the new characters, especially the Sergeant Major and most especially Dodger. Love saucy, curvy redheads. And Paul Winfield is just awesome.

    And I'm Army, and it was great to FINALLY see a space opera show give some major love to the ground forces. Enough fekking squids, let's show the people who REALLY work for a living when the balloon goes up.

    :bolian:
     
    Last edited: Mar 18, 2010
  7. MPH

    MPH Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    I pnly seen Gropos for the first time about a week ago and I found myself laughing out loud at it as it was so bad. It was full of cliches with a bunch of unconvincing military guys oh but what got me is the last shot where all the people we where introduced too all died within a foot of each other :lol:
     
  8. Harvey

    Harvey Admiral Admiral

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    I enjoy GROPOS just for the fact that it has both Paul Winfield and Ken Foree in it (neither of whom you can go wrong with). But it's not the finest episode of the series, and another example, IMO, of DiTillio's work being extraneous to the series in the long run.
     
  9. TheGodBen

    TheGodBen Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    It took me about twice as long as normal to type it, and by the end my spell checker had given up. :lol: I haven't seen that much red since the "accident" involving the woodchipper.

    I would have gone into my reasoning behind being disappointed with the episode more, but it was so hard trying to type like that that I kept it short. In essence, my main problem was that the episode focused on a lot of army clichés as opposed to the characters I've gotten to know over the last few months. Right now Londo and G'Kar are my favourite characters, and I would have liked to see more of them, especially after the events of the previous episode. Failing that I would have liked to see some Garibaldi, but his scene felt a little weird. I know how difficult it is to screw up your life by losing the only future you ever wanted, but that's not something you talk about with a quick lay, that's something you keep bottled up inside until it turns you cold and bitter, and you only let it slip out every once in a while on the internet.

    I've lost my train of thought. :confused:

    Oh yeah, the episode. Now I'm a bit of a left-wing pinko that has little interest in the armed services, but even I don't like it when Hollywood makes the military out to be a bunch of jarheads. The sergeant guy that started a bar brawl because someone accidentally spilled a drink on him seemed annoyingly stupid, and the bar-brawl itself was just comical, I think I actually saw someone swinging from a chandelier. :lol:

    Yes, we love the celebrate the death of Julius Caesar over here with several days of drinking. We hate him for attempting to occupy our good friends, the English.
     
  10. Neroon

    Neroon Mod of Balance Moderator

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    It had some bright moment, as well as some touching ones. Garibaldi's exchanges with Dodger were fun, especially that kiss at the end with Sgt. Maj. Plug looking back at him with a bemused grin. The arguments between Franklin and his father were effective to a point. It may not have been the higher tier of episodes we came to know so well, but it was pretty decent as a standalone
     
  11. David cgc

    David cgc Vice Admiral Admiral

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    In the first draft of the story, Garibaldi was supposed to sleep with Dodger (after Jerry Doyle complained that Dr. Franklin was the only one on the show getting laid). Doyle then said, no, he meant he wanted to nail Talia, and he thought it wasn't in Garibaldi's character to go for a one-night stand while he was carrying a torch for her.
     
  12. stonester1

    stonester1 Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Hate to tell you this, TGB, but you do find those in the military. Especially in bar situation, double especially when intoxication comes into play.
     
  13. Skywalker

    Skywalker Admiral Admiral

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    Though in all fairness, at that time they weren't English yet.
     
  14. chrisspringob

    chrisspringob Commodore Commodore

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    It's true that GROPOS only mentions the Narn-Centauri War in passing, but you have to keep in mind the context of the time in which this series was made. B5 Season 2 aired concurrently with DS9 Season 3 and The X-Files Season 2. Both of those shows regularly had big arc episodes one week, and then the following week's ep didn't mention the previous week's events at all, almost as if they were occurring in a different universe. DS9 didn't really become much more serialized than that until about Season 5.

    In 1995, there was no SF TV in the vein of Lost, where it's "all arc, all the time". That sort of thing didn't really exist yet. In B5, yes, you had big arc eps followed by unrelated standalones. But hey, at least the big arc episodes could come at any point in the season, and not just in season premieres and finales, as was common in many shows of the era.

    But don't worry, the Narn-Centauri conflict will come up again in another couple of eps. It is just not the only thing that's going on in Season 2. There are a lot of different threads to be explored.
     
  15. Ryan Thomas Riddle

    Ryan Thomas Riddle Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    I don't mind the stand-alone episodes. I just happen to not like the ones written by Larry DiTillo.
     
  16. GROPOS was pretty mediocre, people above are right about the ridiculous army cliches. Just another in a string of many mediocre early S2 episodes.

    Agreed. For a show that's hailed as one of the best sci-fi shows EVER, it can be really REALLY pedestrian when not dealing with big arc episodes. Pedestrian as in Star Trek episodes with less acting and budget.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Mar 18, 2010
  17. Asbo Zaprudder

    Asbo Zaprudder Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Yep, we Angles were still living in Schleswig-Holstein at the time. I think TGB means the Brittunculi.
     
  18. Asbo Zaprudder

    Asbo Zaprudder Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Though the episode that he wanted to make for Crusade involving Matheson and the Apocalypse Box actually sounds rather good -- the way he tells it.
     
  19. Lindley

    Lindley Moderator with a Soul Moderator

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    The two who were friends died next to each other. The panning shot cross-faded to another location for the others, if I remember right.
     
  20. Reverend

    Reverend Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Speaking as someone that used to live right next door to a squaddie pub, I've seen fights kick off for much less than that...mind you more often than not it's the army wives rather than the soldiers that get into fist fights, but the point remains valid. ;)
    Plus of course the one that kicked it off is the same git that tried to beat up Delenn for having hair. This is not a guy that feels he needs much of an excuse to deck someone and yes, you get jarheads like that in the army (or marines in this case) too.

    As for the "military stereotypes", sometimes a stereotype or a cliché exists for a good reason. I swear, I've met the real PFC Large, though he wasn't a cigar chomping black guy built like a brick shithouse so much as a port drinking Welshman built like a brick shithouse