A Niner Watches Babylon 5 (NO spoilers, please)

Discussion in 'Science Fiction & Fantasy' started by TheGodBen, Jan 24, 2010.

  1. Jan

    Jan Commodore Commodore

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    ...is insane. --JMS
    FWIW, his alcoholism is realistically portrayed.

    Another FWIW, his stupidity, if you will, is that he and Delenn promised to go along with whatever the Alliance worlds decided. They've used that 'trust us, we keep our promises blah-blah' before but never with these consequences.

    Jan
     
  2. hyzmarca

    hyzmarca Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    It's also due to the fact that they structured the ISA poorly. It was designed to get things done rather than protect against mass stupidity. If the institution were better structured, they could have kept the issue bottled up in committee for months.
     
  3. Deranged Nasat

    Deranged Nasat Vice Admiral Admiral

    We're into the real meat of the season now! :)

    I loved that little scene. I found their exchange very moving, particularly since it recalled an exchange in the pilot (which I don't think you watched). It's sort of an inverted version of that meeting in some ways...and quite heartwarming.
     
  4. Hound of UIster

    Hound of UIster Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Neither option seems preferable.
     
  5. TheGodBen

    TheGodBen Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Love is the Drug (**)

    I know that JMS wanted to have a gay couple on the show, but Franklin and Garibaldi? :wtf: I understand that they realised their love for one another when they connected about their addictions, and that was a very sweet scene, but it's a bit late to retcon in the fact that they're both bisexual. I could buy Franklin at a push, but Garibaldi? No way. The two of them falling so in love with one another so fast that they get engaged in the same episode made this absurd situation even less believable. I can't believe that it was made into an episode.

    Luckily it wasn't and this was just a dream I had. Yes, I had a slash-fiction dream. I'm scared too. :scream:
     
  6. Sykonee

    Sykonee Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    Could be worse. At least the na'ka'leen feeder wasn't involved as well, turning your slash-fiction dream into a hentai.:wtf:
     
  7. Kegg

    Kegg Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    The thread title does say no spoilers, Skyonee.
     
  8. TheGodBen

    TheGodBen Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Movements of Fire and Shadow (****½)

    Things are moving very quickly now, only a week after the outbreak of war and already Centauri Prime is being blowed up real good. :eek: In a way, things are happening a bit too quickly, Franklin and Lyta going to the Drazi homeworld and finding the bad eggs (literally) that are behind the Centuari attacks felt especially rushed.

    Meanwhile, Delenn flies back to Minbar to order to construction of a new fleet of ship, presumably the ones that look like a big Klingon Bird of Prey with a third wing. I think that Crusade was set aboard such a ship, but is there enough time to build one of those beasts before the end of Babylon 5? Probably not. Anyway, Delenn's ship gets blowed up moderately and now they're stuck in hyperspace. Will she die? Probably not, but I said the same thing when Sheridan fell down the canyon on Z'ha'dum and people laughed at me. :(

    Sheridan encourages the three main races involved in the war with the Centauri to work together on a joint strategy, and when they do he gets pissed off and decides to stop them. Make up your mind! Lochley shows up again to remind me that she still exists, which is unfortunate because I've forgotten everything about her. Who is she again?

    The real meat of the episode takes place on Centauri Prime as Londo gets fitted for his evil shoulder eye. He tries to stop the Regent but nobody wants to help him, and things go pear-shaped when the Regent gets rid of the planet's defences in time for an enemy fleet to jump into orbit. The episode earned a score of 7 or 8 from me, but the cliffhanger bumped it up to a 9 just for how epic it was. What is going on? Why do the agents of darkness want Centauri Prime in ruins?

    Scott Bakula: 73
     
  9. Forbin

    Forbin Admiral Admiral

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    I said out, dammit!
    And would you believe TNT did a mid-season break at this point, and left us hanging for THREE FUCKING MONTHS?!?!?!?

    :klingon::klingon::klingon:
     
  10. JoeD80

    JoeD80 Captain Captain

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    Lyta's powers are reaching such a high level now, she can get things done quite fast. You'll see a bit more about her growing powers soon.

    The Drazi having found the Shadow pods has always been lurking in the background, and now scenes from earlier in the season such as the Drazi bugging Londo's quarters, or Garibaldi being led to the Centauri when on the Drazi homeworld, or the Drazi having control of Raider ships will read a bit differently since it's now apparent that the Drazi had known about the control pods already and were holding back on the information for their own purposes.
     
    Last edited: Jul 11, 2010
  11. David cgc

    David cgc Vice Admiral Admiral

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    You know, I never connected those, especially the idea that the Raiders might've been under remote control. I don't think that quite works, though, because it was supposedly a long-term operation. Even if the Drazi were able to reverse-engineer the control pods and use them on the raider ships, they wouldn't have started getting them until after the Centuari raids began, which was after "The Paragon of Animals," never mind the ten years of piracy and subjugation that came before that.
     
  12. Reverend

    Reverend Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Yeah, the Drazi have only known about the pods since the open outbreak of hostilities. Prior to that, none of the Centauri warships had been taken out because they we only engaging civilian transports, not full blown warships.
    The thing with the Enphili had been going on for about a decade and they weren't the only world treated as such. The Drazi Freehold had a deal with that group of raiders to basically help themselves to all the low-tech, independent worlds along their border in exchange for a cut. They didn't have for did they need control pods to pull that off. As for bugging Mollari, remember that happened after Garibaldi's mission to Zhabar went south. The Freehold's intellegence service (or equivalent) must have somehow gotten wind that it was the Centauri who where secretly after their man. Bugging Vir's veggies and trying to pry a confirmation out of Sheridan was just them acting on their suspicions.
     
  13. JoeD80

    JoeD80 Captain Captain

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    Actually, the new Raids started after Z'ha'dum exploded when the Drakh first headed to Centauri Prime. The new Raids were mentioned in several episodes in season four.

    Hm I did forget the timeline for that.

    I think it could also be likely because they want to make sure all the suspicion is cast on the Centauri and that no one is looking their way. Even when Lyta finally makes the discovery they don't want to turn over the technology because they don't want to have to share it with the Alliance. The way I read Garibaldi's failed mission in the prior episode knowing what the Drazi know is that they were trying to lead Garibaldi straight to the Centauri to cast suspicion off of their activities, and then bugged Londo to see what he knew about what they knew.
     
  14. David cgc

    David cgc Vice Admiral Admiral

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    I don't remember that. The closest I can think of are the Hypothetical Aliens that Sheridan got everyone worried about in "Rumors, Bargains, and Lies."
     
  15. JoeD80

    JoeD80 Captain Captain

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    ^
    Sheridan mentions that commercial transports are now being subject to Raider attacks to Londo and G'Kar in "Conflicts of Interest."
     
  16. Reverend

    Reverend Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Space is big and there are always raider attacks all over the place by an ever changing parade of criminal cartels and opportunists. We briefly see one such group at the beginning of 'Thirdspace', operating near Freehold territory mid-season 4 and we know from later on that the Drakh were also raiding near Minbari and pak'ma'ra space around that time too. None of this points to the Drazi having shadow tech or being behind some wider conspiracy.

    Indeed, the smuggler and weapons runners Ivanova brought in to work for B5 said that since the war profits are down across the board and nobody is buying weapons anymore. So you have a small fleet of fast smuggling ships, a vast stockpile of unsold weapons and a whole bunch of highly skilled pilots who aren't getting paid from their usual Dust running and smuggling gigs. With dozens, if not hundreds of worlds and colonies in disarray, whole militaries wiped out is it any wonder raider attacks spiked so drastically? In fact there's several references to scavenger fleets and colonies being evacuated in the aftermath. Hell for a while there Garibaldi made a modest living out of helping people pick up the pieces.
     
    Last edited: Jul 12, 2010
  17. TheGodBen

    TheGodBen Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Considering what I've learned about the way this show and its fans were treated while it was airing, I have no trouble believing it. :(

    The Fall of Centauri Prime (****)

    I'm often surprised when people say that the found an episode of a TV show hard to watch because they find it disturbing or upsetting, Intersections in Real Time is an example of this as someone in this thread said that it was hard for them to watch that episode. I didn't feel that way while watching it, I enjoyed that episode and didn't find it hard to stomach at all. The Wire is an example of a show that contains many moments that made me feel bad, including the deaths of some of my favourite characters, but I never found it hard to watch. Sometimes good shows do things to make you feel bad, and I rarely have a problem with that.

    This episode is an exception. I like Londo, I'll go out on a limb and say that he's my favourite character on this show, so knowing that this was probably going to be the episode that saw him descend into the despot from War Without End was a difficult thing for me to accept. He has grown so much since season 1, he has become a better person in so many ways, and watching all that being taken away from him by evil aliens was upsetting. His final conversation with G'Kar as the "real" Londo was a lovely moment, it's one of my favourite from the show. To watch him walk away from that and into his doom... :sigh:

    Sadly, one thing held this episode back for me; the scenes between Delenn and Lennier on the damaged White Star. Every time they appeared on screen I felt like shouting at them, "Get out of my Londo episode!" Recently the show has been milking this unrequited love story and each time it shows up the less that I care. It's not even a proper love triangle, it's just a line with a dot looking sadly at it.

    Now that the Centauri war is over, what's left for the show to do? :confused: Four episodes of goodbye montages and orgies? I don't want to watch that!

    Scott Bakula: 74
     
  18. hyzmarca

    hyzmarca Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    From this point of the Garabaldi needs to get laid subplot and the Lenier really needs to get laid subplot both swing into high gear and take center stage, eventually intersecting when the two travel together to a planet populated entirely by prostitutes where they get into several wacky adventures that prevent them from actually having sex with anyone. Or something like that.

    Lenier really does need to get laid.
     
  19. Forbin

    Forbin Admiral Admiral

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    I said out, dammit!
    "The Last Minbari Virgin" is my favorite 5th season episode.
     
  20. Forbin

    Forbin Admiral Admiral

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    I said out, dammit!
    ACK! DP
     
    Last edited: Jul 13, 2010

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