‘Superman & Batman’ movie will follow ‘Man of Steel’

Discussion in 'Science Fiction & Fantasy' started by JoeZhang, Jul 20, 2013.

  1. theenglish

    theenglish Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    I wonder though if this quote is more in reference to how they meet. I can imagine a story where Waynetec and Lexcorps are working together to find a way to take down Superman or beings like him in the case of a future invasion. It would be logical that Batman might even consider Superman a conspirator in the alien attack and set out to take him down at the beginning of the movie, only to join forces with him as the story progresses.

    This is still in very early stages so I wouldn't read to much in to the DKR reference just yet.

    On another note, Super-hero movies are perfect to set up like a James Bond series. There is not much difference between a different actor in a movie and a new creative team on a comic when you think about it.
     
  2. davejames

    davejames Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Yeah I'd love to see a completely different take as well (ideally something a lot more operatic and comic booky), but I'd also be fine with another Nolan-style Batman as well--especially considering we hardly ever saw much of Batman in those movies anyway!

    He was more of a supporting player in a vast and epic crime drama, so it'd be nice to finally see him get some real screen time in a movie and have a much bigger role.
     
  3. Agent Richard07

    Agent Richard07 Admiral Admiral

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    ^ Hopefully not at the expense of Clark/Superman, Lois, Perry, etc.
     
  4. Christopher

    Christopher Writer Admiral

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    But their confrontation from TDKR is hardly the only story about them being at odds. A far better model, I think, would be John Byrne's Superman: The Man of Steel #3, depicting the first meeting of post-Crisis Superman and Batman. Instead of a physical throwdown, it's more a battle of wits as Batman uses his skill and hyper-preparedness to evade getting taken in by Superman, and gradually convinces Superman that his vigilante methods are necessary in Gotham. And it's a story that works as the first meeting between two characters who start out at odds but gradually come to realize they're on the same side despite their conflicting methods.

    Although what I'd like to see is rather the reverse of that. The MoS Clark/Kal-El did a pretty crappy job of being Superman, failing to prevent the city's destruction and not making a lot of effort to safeguard civilians. I'd love to see a story where Batman starts out seeing Superman as the threat, as having great power and insufficient responsibility to be trusted with it, and where Batman shows Superman how important it is to protect the little guy, how it's pointless to save the world if you don't try to save the individuals who inhabit it. Then they'd start out at odds, but Batman would be taking Superman on the next step of his journey, guiding him closer toward true heroism.


    Indeed, none of the Burton-Schumacher movies was an origin story for Batman, only for his enemies. The series opened with Batman already active, and his backstory was revealed over the course of the film. Of the eight live-action Batman feature films to date (including the '66 version, the Burton & Schumacher films, and the Nolan trilogy), only one is an origin story. Even Mask of the Phantasm only showed the origin in flashbacks.
     
  5. The Old Mixer

    The Old Mixer Auld Lang Mod Moderator

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    I wasn't trying to suggest that there's a "rule" that studios have to follow...I was merely expressing my opinion, based on my observations of the patterns typical of super-hero movie franchises. You seem to see the seven Batman movies since 1989 as a continuous series with small interruptions, a la Bond. I see them as belonging to two distinct series of Batman movies, with a moderate pause between them.

    Conventional wisdom is that where super-hero movies get sequels at all, they tend to make 3 or 4 films, and fans usually don't like 3 or 4 nearly as much as the first two.

    Are Batman and Spider-Man examples of a new trend of super-hero franchises that keep churning out movies at a fairly regular pace into perpetuity, occasionally undergoing creative reinventions but never fully stopping? Time will tell, but there are always opposite extreme examples, like the Superman series spending two decades in development hell after Christopher Reeve.

    FWIW (and you probably already know this, but indulge me), "World's Finest" wasn't supposed to be descriptive of the Superman/Batman team...it was supposed to be descriptive of the comic in which they were appearing...an anthology comic in which they were originally featured in separate stories, along with some others, a typical format in the 1940s. The title was World's Finest Comics, along the same lines as All-Star Comics, All-American Comics, More Fun Comics, etc. Superman and Batman didn't start sharing stories in the title until sometime in the 1950s.

    I'm of the opinion that Batman's name shouldn't be first in the title, but they'd be idiots not to put him in the title. Unless they want to go for something like The Man of Steel vs. The Dark Knight, but that's not terribly marquee-friendly....
     
  6. Greg Cox

    Greg Cox Admiral Premium Member

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    If you want to be really retro, just call it Caped Crusaders.

    (And the first person who suggests Super Friends should get zapped with heat-vision and a Batarang!)
     
  7. Set Harth

    Set Harth Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Then I'm glad I held back, because I was going to suggest that.
     
  8. The Old Mixer

    The Old Mixer Auld Lang Mod Moderator

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    If you call it that, people are going to expect Wonder Woman and Aquaman, and that could get messy....
     
  9. jbny67

    jbny67 Captain Captain

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    I remember seeing this scene for the first time when the movie made it's television debut.

    You can see, in the beginning of this clip, that Zod & Co. are being lead off to the police vehicles.

    [yt]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mA5d66AnT7s[/yt]
     
  10. Agent Richard07

    Agent Richard07 Admiral Admiral

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    ^ Can't really see them and I wouldn't have known they were being taken away if someone didn't point them out.
     
  11. Jax

    Jax Admiral Admiral

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    I love how Lex in that video is not cold by wearing just a suit in the Artic :lol:
     
  12. Christopher

    Christopher Writer Admiral

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    No, I don't. I'm not talking about what's been done in the past, but questioning the idea that some kind of rest was necessary in the present/future. Whether or not there was a long enough rest between Schumacher and Nolan had no bearing on the success of the Nolan films. The Nolan films worked because their makers did a good job. They would've worked just as well if they'd been made years earlier.

    "Conventional wisdom" means what's widely believed, not necessarily what's actually true. And human beings love to project patterns where none exist. Film franchises run as long as they make a profit. The only numbers that are determinative are the box office returns.

    And really, there aren't enough long-running superhero film series to allow drawing any statistically meaningful conclusions about their patterns.


    I never said they would be. The alternative to one extreme is not the opposite extreme. Most truths lie in the middle ground. I'm only saying that there's no reason to think there's a requirement for a long rest. Sometimes a series goes fallow for a long time, but only because it's had enough failures that there's no interest in a new one. If, as in the case of Spidey or Batman, a series is brought to an end on a fairly high note while audiences still have a generally positive view of it, there's no reason why a reboot couldn't succeed just a few years later. And sometimes a series that did run out of steam due to disappointing box office, like Star Trek, can nonetheless be successfully relaunched without too long a rest. (There were seven years between consecutive feature films, but only four between consecutive productions inclusive of TV and features.)

    The point I'm making is that it's not about some kind of overall cosmic pattern that makes things happen a certain way. It's about the individual circumstances and performance of each individual movie series. A series will last as long as it produces successful movies. No, there's no guarantee that it will continue to do so "forever," but neither is there a guarantee that it will stop doing so after some arbitrarily preset number of films, or that there needs to be some minimum interval before it can start up again.
     
  13. The Old Mixer

    The Old Mixer Auld Lang Mod Moderator

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    ^I never said there were any requirements, guarantees, or cosmic forces at work, and you're the one who brought in the Bond films and other long-running franchises as examples, so what exactly are you getting at? It gets tiresome when it seems like somebody's just arguing the opposite of anything that I say.
     
  14. Christopher

    Christopher Writer Admiral

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    ^What I'm getting at is exactly what I've said: That there are counterexamples to the idea that film series need some kind of "rest" before being rebooted. That's as simply as I can put it.
     
  15. DalekJim

    DalekJim Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    Spider-Man 3 and Batman and Robin were very poor films, so the idea of a reboot was more warmly welcomed. I don't think fans will be as glad to see the back of the established order this time round.

    Personally, I'm used to the idea of different Batman continuities so I'm not too bothered. Film has never been the ideal medium for superhero storytelling anyway, as it loses the long-term arc storytelling. A huge reason I'm a fan of the genre in the first place.
     
  16. The Old Mixer

    The Old Mixer Auld Lang Mod Moderator

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    And my basic point, going way, way back--and in response to a different poster's statement--was that we simply don't know if they're planning to feature Superman vs. Batman's new Batman in solo films. Whether they could, would, or should is irrelevant. There's been no announcement of such plans, and if they intend to do it, it doesn't seem to be on the schedule until at least after the JL film in 2017.
     
  17. Trekker4747

    Trekker4747 Boldly going... Premium Member

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    That's like saying a scratched cornea and a ruptured testicle are both inconveniences.
     
  18. Bad Bishop

    Bad Bishop Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    How long must we wait for a hi-res version of the Batman/Superman logo seen at Comic-Con?
     
  19. Turtletrekker

    Turtletrekker Vice Admiral Admiral

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  20. Christopher

    Christopher Writer Admiral

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    It is the nature of BBS conversations to branch off into tangents, because there are multiple people involved who have multiple ideas they wish to discuss. In the course of the point you were making, you said, in passing, "They'd be best to give him a rest when it comes to solo films." I was curious about that particular assertion, and I asked why you believed that to be the case. Maybe that's not the original subject you were discussing, but it's a topic that was suggested by something you said, and since this is a discussion board, I attempted to begin a discussion of that new issue. I have as much right to pursue the topics that interest me as do you or any of the other hundreds of people here, and that was the question that interested me.