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Voyager There's coffee in this forum!

View Poll Results: Chakotay / Seven pairing gets:
Thumbs up! 21 17.80%
Thumbs down! 97 82.20%
Voters: 118. You may not vote on this poll

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Old July 10 2009, 03:56 AM   #481
Da'an
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Re: Opinions on Chakotay & Seven

Maybe only drones assimilated as children receive them. Children usually are more prone to emotional outbursts than adults.
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Old July 10 2009, 04:15 AM   #482
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Re: Opinions on Chakotay & Seven

teya wrote: View Post
Brit wrote: View Post
If you will look closely, the emotion dampener is either a component of the cortical node possessed by Seven of Nine or it piggybacks. Now someone asked isn't Seven's cortical node actually Icheb's and by the time of "Endgame" it is. So if the emotion dampener that Seven possesses was Icheb's and if the dampener is a component then why don't all former drones have the dampener. It doesn't look like Picard has one, nor does Janeway, B'Elanna, or probably Tuvok. The doctor was surprised by the dampener, so the knowledge of such a Borg device was not in his programming. That tends to lead me to believe that Seven's dampener was unique to her, and therefore wasn't Icheb's.

Brit

Why would the Borg install special technology in one drone?

I'm sorry, but that makes no sense at all.
Yes it does, when you realize that there have to be unique drones, just as there are unique bees, the ones that are potential Queens. The Borg wanted Seven back in Dark Frontier, the Queen also lied to Seven when she told her that she was the only drone that had been severed from the hive mind. We know Picard was severed and we know the drones from "Unity" were severed.

And you can talk all you want about how Janeway, B'Elanna, and Tuvok were not fully assimilated, the fact is that Picard was and it doesn't appear that Picard has an emotion dampener, especially considering the fit he threw in "First Contact" where he "broke his little ships." Considering the problems between the individual former drones in "Unity" it doesn't appear that they had emotion dampeners either.

There is one other interesting canon fact from "First Contact." Picard was meant to be the Queen's counterpart only he wouldn't give himself to the Borg and so they turned him into a regular drone. Seven fought freedom. Even after many weeks in the episode "Raven" she was trying to get back. She linked the three drones from the episode "Survival Instinct" and forced them back into the hive mind the first time she was severed from the Borg.

Seven didn't just have one unique piece of technology, she had several. There is one good reason for Seven to be different, when one questions where the Queens come from, perhaps she was one of those who was in reserve waiting for the "royal jelly" that would turn her into a Queen if the need arose.

Seven was unique, and as far as I know there would be only one reason for any drone to be unique. It is a theory, an extrapolation if you will, but it is one that makes sense to me.

Brit
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Old July 10 2009, 04:31 AM   #483
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Re: Opinions on Chakotay & Seven

And she had both arms.
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Old July 10 2009, 04:38 AM   #484
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Re: Opinions on Chakotay & Seven

Da'an wrote: View Post
And she had both arms.
Maybe that's because the Borg Queen is expected to give hers up along with most of her natural body.

Actually Seven and the Queen were the only drones with a noticeable bust, although the Queen's was a part of her artifical body.

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Old July 10 2009, 02:48 PM   #485
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Re: Opinions on Chakotay & Seven

Brit wrote: View Post
teya wrote: View Post
Brit wrote: View Post
If you will look closely, the emotion dampener is either a component of the cortical node possessed by Seven of Nine or it piggybacks. Now someone asked isn't Seven's cortical node actually Icheb's and by the time of "Endgame" it is. So if the emotion dampener that Seven possesses was Icheb's and if the dampener is a component then why don't all former drones have the dampener. It doesn't look like Picard has one, nor does Janeway, B'Elanna, or probably Tuvok. The doctor was surprised by the dampener, so the knowledge of such a Borg device was not in his programming. That tends to lead me to believe that Seven's dampener was unique to her, and therefore wasn't Icheb's.

Brit

Why would the Borg install special technology in one drone?

I'm sorry, but that makes no sense at all.
Yes it does, when you realize that there have to be unique drones, just as there are unique bees, the ones that are potential Queens. The Borg wanted Seven back in Dark Frontier, the Queen also lied to Seven when she told her that she was the only drone that had been severed from the hive mind. We know Picard was severed and we know the drones from "Unity" were severed.

And you can talk all you want about how Janeway, B'Elanna, and Tuvok were not fully assimilated, the fact is that Picard was and it doesn't appear that Picard has an emotion dampener, especially considering the fit he threw in "First Contact" where he "broke his little ships." Considering the problems between the individual former drones in "Unity" it doesn't appear that they had emotion dampeners either.

There is one other interesting canon fact from "First Contact." Picard was meant to be the Queen's counterpart only he wouldn't give himself to the Borg and so they turned him into a regular drone. Seven fought freedom. Even after many weeks in the episode "Raven" she was trying to get back. She linked the three drones from the episode "Survival Instinct" and forced them back into the hive mind the first time she was severed from the Borg.

Seven didn't just have one unique piece of technology, she had several. There is one good reason for Seven to be different, when one questions where the Queens come from, perhaps she was one of those who was in reserve waiting for the "royal jelly" that would turn her into a Queen if the need arose.

Seven was unique, and as far as I know there would be only one reason for any drone to be unique. It is a theory, an extrapolation if you will, but it is one that makes sense to me.

Brit
You make excellent points here, Brit. I don't know why I always assumed that all Borg were alike when they are obviously provided with different mechanical attachments that make them unique. We know from "Dark Frontier" that Seven is different; I always assumed that was because she was on Voyager, but it could have been her role in the collective, as well. There was some reason that she was selected to be the one to interact with Janeway in Scorpion. Again, I always assumed that she was selected because she was human, but that might have only been part of the equation.

A lot to think about here. Thanks!

Last edited by AuntKate; July 10 2009 at 03:07 PM.
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Old July 10 2009, 04:36 PM   #486
teya
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Re: Opinions on Chakotay & Seven

Brit wrote: View Post
And you can talk all you want about how Janeway, B'Elanna, and Tuvok were not fully assimilated, the fact is that Picard was and it doesn't appear that Picard has an emotion dampener, especially considering the fit he threw in "First Contact" where he "broke his little ships." Considering the problems between the individual former drones in "Unity" it doesn't appear that they had emotion dampeners either.
Picard and the drones from "Unity" were all assimilated before Icheb--which supports my theory that the technology was something relatively new, and not a part of Seven's first node.

Seven fought freedom. Even after many weeks in the episode "Raven" she was trying to get back. She linked the three drones from the episode "Survival Instinct" and forced them back into the hive mind the first time she was severed from the Borg.
Seven was assimilated as a child and so the Collective is all she knows. This is not unlike children conscripted into service as soldiers.
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Old July 10 2009, 11:30 PM   #487
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Re: Opinions on Chakotay & Seven

AuntKate wrote: View Post
I always assumed that was because she was on Voyager, but it could have been her role in the collective, as well. There was some reason that she was selected to be the one to interact with Janeway in Scorpion. Again, I always assumed that she was selected because she was human, but that might have only been part of the equation.

A lot to think about here. Thanks!
It's no secret that I'm writing a Borg Queen story so I've looked a lot of things up.

In the collective Seven was Seven of Nine Tertiary Adjunct of Unimatrix Zero One. There is this line from "Dark Frontier"

ERIN: Species six nine six one, Ktarian. Tritanium infrastructure. He's a tactical drone.
MAGNUS: Take a look at his proximity transceiver. Let's check his previous designation.
ERIN: Three of five, Tertiary adjunct of Unimatrix one.
MAGNUS: I want to keep an eye on this one. Let's tag him. Bring me the subdermal probe, will you?
ANNIKA: Is he special?
MAGNUS: Very special. We think he used to work near the Borg Queen. If he ever goes back there we'll be able to track him now.
That would put Seven very close to the Queen, perhaps in her inner circle.

There is another interesting thing. According to the stardates the following things happened in this order, and they all happened in just about a month.

1. The Borg discovered Species 8472.

2. The Borg attempted to defeat the Federation as seen in "First Contact."

3. The events of the Voyager episode "Scorpion".

We saw three Queens in all, the "First Contact" Queen. The "Scorpion" to "Unimatrix Zero" Queen, and the "Endgame" Queen. Although we don't see the second Queen die, one wonders what could have happened to her because she failed three times: "Scorpion", "Dark Frontier" and "Unimatrix Zero".

There is nothing wrong with Teya's "new technology" but from my writing standpoint Seven as a protoqueen is a much more interesting story, and the theory is as viable as hers.

Brit
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Old July 10 2009, 11:48 PM   #488
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Re: Opinions on Chakotay & Seven

The tertiary adjunct job used to need 5 drones, but now it needs 9?

Something is twice as large as it was 20 years earlier.
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Old July 11 2009, 12:01 AM   #489
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Re: Opinions on Chakotay & Seven

Guy Gardener wrote: View Post
The tertiary adjunct job used to need 5 drones, but now it needs 9?

Something is twice as large as it was 20 years earlier.
Maybe it was supposed to be nine and they had a temporary personal problem. Tertiary Adjunct is almost a computer term, you could have a Secondary Interpreter or a Primary Adjunct and even a Auxiliary Compiler.

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Old July 11 2009, 12:24 AM   #490
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Re: Opinions on Chakotay & Seven

Or even an "Auxiliary Processor" like Three of Nine.
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Old July 11 2009, 02:41 AM   #491
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Re: Opinions on Chakotay & Seven

I thought the whole Idea was down right GROSS.
I'm glad Christie Gold broke them up....

Most men don't know what a good love story is like and the same was true here.
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Old July 11 2009, 02:47 AM   #492
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Re: Opinions on Chakotay & Seven

Christie Gold has problems. She writes love letters to Janeway twice as much as I write hate mail to Kim. It's very unsettling.
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Old July 11 2009, 03:14 AM   #493
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Re: Opinions on Chakotay & Seven

teya wrote: View Post
Why would the Borg install special technology in one drone?

I'm sorry, but that makes no sense at all.
Well according to the Queen Seven was "special" and left on the ship intentionally by the borg. Perhaps the dampener was there so that Seven would be easier to re-assimilate.

We did see in Unimatric Zero that different drones get differet pieces of equipment based on their use. For example B'Elanna got the voice modulator when Janeway and Tuvok didn't.
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Old July 11 2009, 03:21 AM   #494
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Re: Opinions on Chakotay & Seven

KimC, I forgot about that, but you're right. They did get different "tools" when they were assimilated. In fact, when I think about it, some drones had different arm attachments, eye pieces, etc.

Perhaps the dampener was put there when she was singled out to work with Janeway to keep her from "jumping ship," so to speak!
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Old July 11 2009, 03:44 AM   #495
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Re: Opinions on Chakotay & Seven

Quite right, none of them are a universal tool.

Although, Harry Kim is a...
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